MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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Losifer
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407
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Location
Sandia Park, NM US
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3/30/2023 8:35am
Outlawed wrote:
Long time listener, first time caller. Happened to stumble across this (cannot link directly as the posts gets deemed as spam)  weight is said to be...

Long time listener, first time caller. Happened to stumble across this (cannot link directly as the posts gets deemed as spam)
chainsawoopsie

chainsawoopsie1

 weight is said to be 16.35kg

Are we safe to assume this is an aluminum Spartan HP? If so, why the different name? And why not make it a freeride/park bike with...

Are we safe to assume this is an aluminum Spartan HP? If so, why the different name?

And why not make it a freeride/park bike with 180ish mm of travel?

As for the name, #LongLiveChainsaw.

2
kcy4130
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319
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MT US
3/30/2023 8:56am
Primoz wrote:
The two accelerometer idea, the post connecting them would influence the measurement much more than just using a gyroscope (a MEMS device) directly on the frame...

The two accelerometer idea, the post connecting them would influence the measurement much more than just using a gyroscope (a MEMS device) directly on the frame. And you don't have the issue of measurement synchronisation as well (always a pain when acquiring data off multiple sensors).

But, as you alluded, even a gyro would be influenced by bike lean. And using two gives you the same issue as you have with the accelerometers.

You can easily and precisely measure flex on a fixture. If you use strain gauges all over the frame when doing the measurements, you can also calibrate the strain gauges to certain flex values or to a 3D model. If you have enough of them you can even recreate loadings from the field in your finite element model to see what the external loads are like and use that when developing the next bike.

Two gyros that measures roll, (like yaw pitch roll) one the front triangle and one on the rear near axle, would work as well. The roll of the front triangle would be subtracted from the rear, thus giving torsional flex. The accelerometers would be two on front triangle two on rear arranged vertically, so four total. Either way: sample rate, accuracy, and synchronicity (as you said) would have to be very good to get useful data. Probably not what's going on here, but it's an idea. 

1
Simpancz
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Location
CA
3/30/2023 9:04am
Primoz wrote:
The two accelerometer idea, the post connecting them would influence the measurement much more than just using a gyroscope (a MEMS device) directly on the frame...

The two accelerometer idea, the post connecting them would influence the measurement much more than just using a gyroscope (a MEMS device) directly on the frame. And you don't have the issue of measurement synchronisation as well (always a pain when acquiring data off multiple sensors).

But, as you alluded, even a gyro would be influenced by bike lean. And using two gives you the same issue as you have with the accelerometers.

You can easily and precisely measure flex on a fixture. If you use strain gauges all over the frame when doing the measurements, you can also calibrate the strain gauges to certain flex values or to a 3D model. If you have enough of them you can even recreate loadings from the field in your finite element model to see what the external loads are like and use that when developing the next bike.

kcy4130 wrote:
Two gyros that measures roll, (like yaw pitch roll) one the front triangle and one on the rear near axle, would work as well. The roll...

Two gyros that measures roll, (like yaw pitch roll) one the front triangle and one on the rear near axle, would work as well. The roll of the front triangle would be subtracted from the rear, thus giving torsional flex. The accelerometers would be two on front triangle two on rear arranged vertically, so four total. Either way: sample rate, accuracy, and synchronicity (as you said) would have to be very good to get useful data. Probably not what's going on here, but it's an idea. 

Works in theory, but I would not expect any usefull data from the MEMS inertial measurements units in such dynamic and noisy environment.

The strain gauges could be way more precise tho

Primoz
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SI
3/30/2023 11:01am

Don't have experience with MEMS gyros, but if it can be made in millions of units to handle airbags, ABS and ESC in cars, I'm sure it's possible to make a sensor precise enough to handle a mountainbike riding down a hillside.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsjvaYAFN1M

1
motomike
Posts
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10/12/2009
Location
Linville, NC US
3/30/2023 11:15am
Primoz wrote:
Don't have experience with MEMS gyros, but if it can be made in millions of units to handle airbags, ABS and ESC in cars, I'm sure...

Don't have experience with MEMS gyros, but if it can be made in millions of units to handle airbags, ABS and ESC in cars, I'm sure it's possible to make a sensor precise enough to handle a mountainbike riding down a hillside.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsjvaYAFN1M

Man I just gotta ask- how do you know something about everything?  lol

21
3/30/2023 3:46pm
I doubt its an inerter, its not connect to the lower legs, so only way it could be if its a oil based j-damper (McLarens code...

I doubt its an inerter, its not connect to the lower legs, so only way it could be if its a oil based j-damper (McLarens code for their original oil based inerter) running of the airpsring shaft somehow, way too complicated.

I think it could be there to monitor the airspring pressures for telemetry (explains why its bolted to air spring side.

Inerters aren't needed on a MTB, its what arms and legs are for. 

Primoz wrote:

Telemetry doesn't explain the rear one though...

Mr.Nally wrote:

Looks like a tunable mass damper of sorts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afa9L2ocZPY

 

Like that motorcycle tech.

Thats actually a good idea,

 

Size and position makes sense. I haven't seen somebody use them before on a MTB, wouldn't the front one need to be on the lower leg though (mounted to the unsprung mass)

3/30/2023 5:14pm Edited Date/Time 3/30/2023 5:17pm

Looks like Kilian Bron has the new Meta on Remy Metailler's latest YT vid. New colour way(?) and definitely has headset routing. Either that, or it's still the proto (filmed before Remy got injured). 

*Edit* - Or is it darn aggressive riding on a Tempo? Looks like it's got a bit of a kink in the top tube. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSLPMRx5ET0&t=276s

dolface
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Location
CA US
3/30/2023 5:33pm
saskskier wrote:
Looks like Kilian Bron has the new Meta on Remy Metailler's latest YT vid. New colour way(?) and definitely has headset routing. Either that, or it's...

Looks like Kilian Bron has the new Meta on Remy Metailler's latest YT vid. New colour way(?) and definitely has headset routing. Either that, or it's still the proto (filmed before Remy got injured). 

*Edit* - Or is it darn aggressive riding on a Tempo? Looks like it's got a bit of a kink in the top tube. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSLPMRx5ET0&t=276s

Enhance:

Screenshot 2023-03-30 at 5.32.20 PM

 

9
3/30/2023 5:38pm
saskskier wrote:
Looks like Kilian Bron has the new Meta on Remy Metailler's latest YT vid. New colour way(?) and definitely has headset routing. Either that, or it's...

Looks like Kilian Bron has the new Meta on Remy Metailler's latest YT vid. New colour way(?) and definitely has headset routing. Either that, or it's still the proto (filmed before Remy got injured). 

*Edit* - Or is it darn aggressive riding on a Tempo? Looks like it's got a bit of a kink in the top tube. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSLPMRx5ET0&t=276s

dolface wrote:
Enhance:  

Enhance:

Screenshot 2023-03-30 at 5.32.20 PM

 

Ha ha. Your CSI skills are much better than mine. 

Simpancz
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22
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Location
CA
3/30/2023 9:29pm
mattwright wrote:
 New SRAM brake levers to go with the new callipers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R47lxfLHm-g

Screenshot 2023-03-30 at 6.00.38 PM 1

 New SRAM brake levers to go with the new callipers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R47lxfLHm-g

Looks very similar, but the stealth levers have angled hose and the levers installed alongside with the new "Mave" calipers have straight hose.

2
3/30/2023 10:15pm
hardbash wrote:

Read in the pinkbike comments that the new SRAM Maven brakes will be mineral oil. Interesting

Primoz wrote:

Considering it's being run on existing levers, kinda doubt this one. But if true, I guess it's time to stock up on current (old?) Codes Smile

TannerVal wrote:
 Which existing lever is this? None I’ve seen

4D95EFA6-48C1-442F-89AC-B6F558ED8330.jpeg?VersionId=ESAX4.wtIqCj

 Which existing lever is this? None I’ve seen

F3628BA4-390D-4962-8682-8299598BD2F3.jpeg?VersionId=xQ5JIxYE3akd8UP8pkKQD0P

 The new lever body seems to match the shape of the new stealth levers. What stood out to me is bleed port plug that matches the one found on the DB8, which uses mineral oil and makes me believe there’s some truth behind the switch to mineral oil. 

11
sspomer
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Boise, ID US
Fantasy
3/31/2023 9:25am

pole e-bike goods

 

4
lickmycrinkle
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Beverly Hills, CA US
3/31/2023 10:33am
sspomer wrote:
pole e-bike goods  

pole e-bike goods

 

pole e-bike bads

17
1
Losifer
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407
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Location
Sandia Park, NM US
Fantasy
3/31/2023 11:11am
baronKanon wrote:

Formula is teasing new product launch on Friday. Is this the elusive Selva XL dual crown enduro fork? If so, I am tempted - very tempted.

It's a brake lever. A goddamned two piece brake lever.

 

 

 

4
Jakub_G
Posts
356
Joined
8/7/2019
Location
SK
3/31/2023 11:22am
baronKanon wrote:

Formula is teasing new product launch on Friday. Is this the elusive Selva XL dual crown enduro fork? If so, I am tempted - very tempted.

Losifer wrote:

It's a brake lever. A goddamned two piece brake lever.

 

 

 

Another product that was supposed to be released pre covid. Better late than never I guess?

1
Suns_PSD
Posts
362
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10/7/2015
Location
Austin, TX US
3/31/2023 11:37am

I looked it up. That hub weighs 2kilos! (4 1/2 pounds.) Holy unsprung weight Batman!

DirtyHal wrote:
48% heavier than a Transmission setup using my napkin math.  Would you really notice on an ebike though?  If you go through a cassette per year...

48% heavier than a Transmission setup using my napkin math.  Would you really notice on an ebike though?  If you go through a cassette per year with a transmission setup you would potentially be saving quite a few bucks annually with the no maintenance claim on the 3x3.

1) I swapped from a 12 speed AXS to an old school 11 speed and at least in my head I could feel the .5# unsprung weight loss. The suspension felt more supple and quicker to react. It wasn't a money issue nor was the AXS giving me any trouble, but I genuinely prefer the 11 speed's performance.

2) The proper solution for an e-bike is a combo motor/ transmission. The extra drag isn't a big deal cause you have a motor, and the extra weight, at the center of the frame but in exchange for vastly improved drivetrain wear/ tear is a fair trade off on a 42#+ bike. To top it off, once you combine the 2 housing in to one, there might be very little weight gain if any compared to say SRAM Transmission.

4
3/31/2023 12:42pm

Those are some lame hashtags2 pieces 0

 

8
3/31/2023 12:43pm
baronKanon wrote:

Formula is teasing new product launch on Friday. Is this the elusive Selva XL dual crown enduro fork? If so, I am tempted - very tempted.

Losifer wrote:

It's a brake lever. A goddamned two piece brake lever.

 

 

 

Jakub_G wrote:

Another product that was supposed to be released pre covid. Better late than never I guess?

Anticipating the Selva XL and get a brake lever. Definitely disappointing. 

6
3/31/2023 1:44pm

"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian brands should just let AI write their product copy.

20
dolface
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Location
CA US
3/31/2023 6:17pm
"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian...

"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian brands should just let AI write their product copy.

Or porn authors "...to fit perfectly in the hand for Cura, Cura 4, and Cura x, without any loss of sensation ..."

6
4/1/2023 1:16pm

I guess some of it comes down to not having a very good command of english. 

codahale
Posts
74
Joined
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Location
Fort Collins, CO US
4/1/2023 7:28pm
dolface wrote:

Is this the new AXS dropper? 

Edit: He said it's just reversed in the comments fwiw...

 

 

I’m pretty sure this is a new Reverb AXS, actually.

I tried flipping my current Reverb AXS around, but there’s no way to make it work. Saddle tilt is determined by the position of the barrel cut on the tilt adjuster screw, but the tilt adjuster screw is at an angle. If you flip the head around, you can drop the saddle to maybe +10° but definitely not get it level. The only way you could get it to work would be a new set of inner clamps with some kind of offset barrel nut pocket, maybe? The outer clamp definitely looks different from the current one, but it’s definitely not just a regular Reverb AXS.

I just hope they make a 200mm+ version.

4
4/1/2023 8:20pm
dolface wrote:

Is this the new AXS dropper? 

Edit: He said it's just reversed in the comments fwiw...

 

 

codahale wrote:
I’m pretty sure this is a new Reverb AXS, actually. I tried flipping my current Reverb AXS around, but there’s no way to make it work...

I’m pretty sure this is a new Reverb AXS, actually.

I tried flipping my current Reverb AXS around, but there’s no way to make it work. Saddle tilt is determined by the position of the barrel cut on the tilt adjuster screw, but the tilt adjuster screw is at an angle. If you flip the head around, you can drop the saddle to maybe +10° but definitely not get it level. The only way you could get it to work would be a new set of inner clamps with some kind of offset barrel nut pocket, maybe? The outer clamp definitely looks different from the current one, but it’s definitely not just a regular Reverb AXS.

I just hope they make a 200mm+ version.

Seth from Seth's Bike Hacks/Berm Peak messed around with his AXS dropper. Definitely hacked it up, but made it work. Lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2o4vd9RFf4&t=299s

4
codahale
Posts
74
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9/11/2018
Location
Fort Collins, CO US
4/1/2023 8:39pm
saskskier wrote:

Seth from Seth's Bike Hacks/Berm Peak messed around with his AXS dropper. Definitely hacked it up, but made it work. Lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2o4vd9RFf4&t=299s

“made it work” lol

Dude’s face at the end, sitting on the saddle with the battery poking him in the gooch, feels like a pretty conclusive answer as to whether or not it worked.

1
mamath7
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101
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6/17/2014
Location
FR
4/1/2023 11:17pm
"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian...

"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian brands should just let AI write their product copy.

It may sounds better in italian

4/2/2023 12:00am
"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian...

"Why not enjoy the exhilarating feeling of braking?" might be one of the funniest statements I've ever read. I think some of the European and Asian brands should just let AI write their product copy.

mamath7 wrote:

It may sounds better in italian

Won't sound like the symphony of a Sram brake on the wet, tho

1
4/2/2023 12:56am Edited Date/Time 4/2/2023 12:59am

f77741195669cebff116e49ee2b8a44c.png?VersionId=9c7a13de1f9ee05a2349a43c42699393

 New Pivot phoenix, Reverting away from the Horizontal to a vertical shock layout - assuming itll look like the rest of pivots bikes like the firebird.
Looks like its a Lugged carbon prototype. - does anyone have any Info on this and who is making these frames? Spesh and pivot both have these now... is athertons making them some lugs?
i believe This was BK doing some Private solo testing in QT before the journey to Rotorua.

 

2
4/2/2023 3:00am

Source? BTW on the other website there were some photos of it, they were reposted here a few pages back.

dolface
Posts
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10/26/2015
Location
CA US
4/2/2023 6:28am
 New Pivot phoenix, Reverting away from the Horizontal to a vertical shock layout - assuming itll look like the rest of pivots bikes like the firebird...

f77741195669cebff116e49ee2b8a44c.png?VersionId=9c7a13de1f9ee05a2349a43c42699393

 New Pivot phoenix, Reverting away from the Horizontal to a vertical shock layout - assuming itll look like the rest of pivots bikes like the firebird.
Looks like its a Lugged carbon prototype. - does anyone have any Info on this and who is making these frames? Spesh and pivot both have these now... is athertons making them some lugs?
i believe This was BK doing some Private solo testing in QT before the journey to Rotorua.

 

Chris Cocalis was on the other site's podcast and said they're making those frames in-house in AZ, iirc he said they could make one in ~3 weeks

3
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