To me this seems silly, defeating the whole point of a Horst Link. The impact on the virtual axle path (and therefore most things besides anti-rise)...
To me this seems silly, defeating the whole point of a Horst Link. The impact on the virtual axle path (and therefore most things besides anti-rise) between a Horst link and a single pivot or spilt pivot is pretty minimal. The main benefit is that you can define your anti-rise.
Back before the Horst Link patent was up, and I was considering getting a Brake Therapy adapter for my Kona, I thought of the following workaround for single pivot, faux-four-bar suspension layouts to isolate brake forces. If you need to fine-tune your anti-rise indepenent of everything else, on a per-rider, per track basis, maybe its worth revisiting since having custom mounting positions for this extra control arm is going to be a lot less complicated and lighter than whatever Neko (and Cube in seasons past) is doing to bastardize their Horst Links
Most Horst links like the Frameworks have low anti rise values, and the floating brake can help further tune it without changing a thing else about the bike. Seems pretty normal to me. Cube was testing then out too a little while ago.
I also recognize that top link but can't place it. But I've absolutely seen it before.It looks a little like a Vitus Sommet 297 link, but...
I also recognize that top link but can't place it. But I've absolutely seen it before.
It looks a little like a Vitus Sommet 297 link, but it looks a lot like an Airdrop Edit MX link:. Did I scroll through this entire list of 186 bike companies to find these two examples? Maybe. Did it feel better to scratch that itch, and help me avoid doing homework? Absolutely.
I thought of Airdrop first too, but the headtube junction and down tube just aren't the same. Unless they are going to have an update for it soon.
To me this seems silly, defeating the whole point of a Horst Link. The impact on the virtual axle path (and therefore most things besides anti-rise)...
To me this seems silly, defeating the whole point of a Horst Link. The impact on the virtual axle path (and therefore most things besides anti-rise) between a Horst link and a single pivot or spilt pivot is pretty minimal. The main benefit is that you can define your anti-rise.
Back before the Horst Link patent was up, and I was considering getting a Brake Therapy adapter for my Kona, I thought of the following workaround for single pivot, faux-four-bar suspension layouts to isolate brake forces. If you need to fine-tune your anti-rise indepenent of everything else, on a per-rider, per track basis, maybe its worth revisiting since having custom mounting positions for this extra control arm is going to be a lot less complicated and lighter than whatever Neko (and Cube in seasons past) is doing to bastardize their Horst Links
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
77designz just released their new bar after parting ways with WeAreOne. Looks like they are using the same principle as before with a thinner 33mm bar...
77designz just released their new bar after parting ways with WeAreOne. Looks like they are using the same principle as before with a thinner 33mm bar and a thicker 35mm stem clamping area. Instead of a alloy sleeve it is just thicker layup. Their previous bar was 258g and this new one is 220g. Also much cheaper at 163.85 € compared to 279.95 € before
Thats the price for the handlebar only, stem not included. So it comes out close to $350 with a stem, compared to $279, where it was sold as package. Edit: sold as a package by weareone that is
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't...
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Does anyone have the anti-rise graph for the current Enduro? Its "common knowledge" that the Enduro has low anti-rise, or just high rise, or low brake jack, whatever you want to call it.
If you look at the video below, assuming the bike actually does have low antirise, very little pivot movement translates into lots of low antirise (I hate that term and all the double & triple negatives it creates)
77designz just released their new bar after parting ways with WeAreOne. Looks like they are using the same principle as before with a thinner 33mm bar...
77designz just released their new bar after parting ways with WeAreOne. Looks like they are using the same principle as before with a thinner 33mm bar and a thicker 35mm stem clamping area. Instead of a alloy sleeve it is just thicker layup. Their previous bar was 258g and this new one is 220g. Also much cheaper at 163.85 € compared to 279.95 € before
Thats the price for the handlebar only, stem not included. So it comes out close to $350 with a stem, compared to $279, where it was...
Thats the price for the handlebar only, stem not included. So it comes out close to $350 with a stem, compared to $279, where it was sold as package. Edit: sold as a package by weareone that is
77designz used to sell a la carte bar and stem no combos. The WeAreOne branded "Da Package" combo was cheaper especially during their black Friday sale last year for which I paid $228 CAD.
Here is the handlebar only price from their old store cached copy
77designz used to sell a la carte bar and stem no combos. The WeAreOne branded "Da Package" combo was cheaper especially during their black Friday sale...
77designz used to sell a la carte bar and stem no combos. The WeAreOne branded "Da Package" combo was cheaper especially during their black Friday sale last year for which I paid $228 CAD.
Here is the handlebar only price from their old store cached copy
Ah I see - Interesting that the price of their handlebar was the same as weareone charged for both stem/handlebar.
Definitely a decent price decrease from 77's side, but still quite the pricy combo. Im sure it is a very nice piece though
(And yes, the price I referred to was what I could see weareone charged in the past)
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't...
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and grime, and they have always been in a disgusting state whenever I've serviced the bearings on the 3 4-bar bikes I've owned. I recall reading somewhere that bushings are ideal for locations that consistently see small angle rotations, where bearings are better for larger angles (so that the bearings actually move further in the race). Main pivot and rocker/upper link - absolutely bearings. Rear pivot - bushings. I mean, a lot of brands are going with flex stays back there, so clearly a bearing isn't really necessary.
Does anyone have the anti-rise graph for the current Enduro? Its "common knowledge" that the Enduro has low anti-rise, or just high rise, or low brake...
Does anyone have the anti-rise graph for the current Enduro? Its "common knowledge" that the Enduro has low anti-rise, or just high rise, or low brake jack, whatever you want to call it.
If you look at the video below, assuming the bike actually does have low antirise, very little pivot movement translates into lots of low antirise (I hate that term and all the double & triple negatives it creates)
Not sure on the proper terminology but… my ‘21 Enduro didn’t feel as good on the brakes on harsh terrain as my old ‘17 Giant Reign SX did. The Reign was more actively following the ground leading to more traction and higher corner entry speed.
Orbea taking a step back from headset cable routing is a bigger deal to me than their DH bike!I was one click from ordering a Wild...
Orbea taking a step back from headset cable routing is a bigger deal to me than their DH bike!
I was one click from ordering a Wild, but after seeing the heaset in the flesh and reading the horrendous reports on forums I just couldn't do it. They quite litterally have the worst headset routing implementation (knockblock that breaks and knocks your spacers out, dedicated spacers + dedicated stem, need to disconnect your brake hose to get rid of all that stuff and mount an adaptor for a regular stem, horrendous looking cable angles to get into the headset no matter what you do).
Buddy of mine works for an mtb brand that did headset routing and they saw a noticeable dip in sales on these models. They’ve pivoted back...
Buddy of mine works for an mtb brand that did headset routing and they saw a noticeable dip in sales on these models. They’ve pivoted back on a newer model. Not sure if they’ve seen better success with that model but it will be interesting to see. My wife has a repeater and the headset routing has been a nightmare.
You can say your buddy works at Propain it's okay.
There's also this in the regular bike catalog. The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this: R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+SHIFTLEV...
There's also this in the regular bike catalog.
The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this:
R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+
SHIFTLEV. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250
CRANKSET Shimano XTR M9200-12 Carbon 32T
BOTTOM BR. Shimano MT900 pressfit PA29 MTB
SPROCKET Shimano XTR M9200-12 / 9-45
CHAIN Shimano M9100-12
So that's Shimano's first(?) carbon cranks confirmed?
And the brake name is in full view, the new protos we've seen aren't saint? M9220 seems it would be the 4 piston variant.
There's also this in the regular bike catalog. The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this: R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+SHIFTLEV...
There's also this in the regular bike catalog.
The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this:
R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+
SHIFTLEV. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250
CRANKSET Shimano XTR M9200-12 Carbon 32T
BOTTOM BR. Shimano MT900 pressfit PA29 MTB
SPROCKET Shimano XTR M9200-12 / 9-45
CHAIN Shimano M9100-12
So that's Shimano's first(?) carbon cranks confirmed?
And the brake name is in full view, the new protos we've seen aren't saint? M9220 seems it would be the 4 piston variant.
Orbea taking a step back from headset cable routing is a bigger deal to me than their DH bike!I was one click from ordering a Wild...
Orbea taking a step back from headset cable routing is a bigger deal to me than their DH bike!
I was one click from ordering a Wild, but after seeing the heaset in the flesh and reading the horrendous reports on forums I just couldn't do it. They quite litterally have the worst headset routing implementation (knockblock that breaks and knocks your spacers out, dedicated spacers + dedicated stem, need to disconnect your brake hose to get rid of all that stuff and mount an adaptor for a regular stem, horrendous looking cable angles to get into the headset no matter what you do).
Buddy of mine works for an mtb brand that did headset routing and they saw a noticeable dip in sales on these models. They’ve pivoted back...
Buddy of mine works for an mtb brand that did headset routing and they saw a noticeable dip in sales on these models. They’ve pivoted back on a newer model. Not sure if they’ve seen better success with that model but it will be interesting to see. My wife has a repeater and the headset routing has been a nightmare.
There's also this in the regular bike catalog. The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this: R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+SHIFTLEV...
There's also this in the regular bike catalog.
The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this:
R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+
SHIFTLEV. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250
CRANKSET Shimano XTR M9200-12 Carbon 32T
BOTTOM BR. Shimano MT900 pressfit PA29 MTB
SPROCKET Shimano XTR M9200-12 / 9-45
CHAIN Shimano M9100-12
So that's Shimano's first(?) carbon cranks confirmed?
And the brake name is in full view, the new protos we've seen aren't saint? M9220 seems it would be the 4 piston variant.
Orbea taking a step back from headset cable routing is a bigger deal to me than their DH bike!I was one click from ordering a Wild...
Orbea taking a step back from headset cable routing is a bigger deal to me than their DH bike!
I was one click from ordering a Wild, but after seeing the heaset in the flesh and reading the horrendous reports on forums I just couldn't do it. They quite litterally have the worst headset routing implementation (knockblock that breaks and knocks your spacers out, dedicated spacers + dedicated stem, need to disconnect your brake hose to get rid of all that stuff and mount an adaptor for a regular stem, horrendous looking cable angles to get into the headset no matter what you do).
Buddy of mine works for an mtb brand that did headset routing and they saw a noticeable dip in sales on these models. They’ve pivoted back...
Buddy of mine works for an mtb brand that did headset routing and they saw a noticeable dip in sales on these models. They’ve pivoted back on a newer model. Not sure if they’ve seen better success with that model but it will be interesting to see. My wife has a repeater and the headset routing has been a nightmare.
A collection of the Australian Scott importer's franchisees abandoned the brand entirely about a year or two ago because sales of the current models were "bad for business". Quite a fall considering the Spark was once the most common bike around here. Innovating its way out of the MTB market apparently... anyway further discussion about Scott specifically might belong more in the "will more companies be shutting down..." thread than here.
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't...
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and...
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and grime, and they have always been in a disgusting state whenever I've serviced the bearings on the 3 4-bar bikes I've owned. I recall reading somewhere that bushings are ideal for locations that consistently see small angle rotations, where bearings are better for larger angles (so that the bearings actually move further in the race). Main pivot and rocker/upper link - absolutely bearings. Rear pivot - bushings. I mean, a lot of brands are going with flex stays back there, so clearly a bearing isn't really necessary.
It's been done. Rocky, Banshee and others have experimented with bushings. They all creaked worse than a rusty shopping cart after a while... or immediately depending how lucky you were.
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't...
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and...
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and grime, and they have always been in a disgusting state whenever I've serviced the bearings on the 3 4-bar bikes I've owned. I recall reading somewhere that bushings are ideal for locations that consistently see small angle rotations, where bearings are better for larger angles (so that the bearings actually move further in the race). Main pivot and rocker/upper link - absolutely bearings. Rear pivot - bushings. I mean, a lot of brands are going with flex stays back there, so clearly a bearing isn't really necessary.
Any time you don't have full rotation (or slow rotation) a bushing is the better option. Technically bushing should be better for all pivots.
Two problems. We riders don't want the suspension being stiff and/or binding and we don't want the bike to clack around. Bushing require quite a bit more clearance (technically) vs. what a bearing needs to function (clearance of bearings is in the range of microns to hundreths of a mm when not axially preloaded, and bearings technically should be axially preloaded for best performance, which is a topic of discussion in another thread). That will make the axle in the bushing clack around when the loading of it changes direction.
Even with some clearance a bushing will usually be a bit more tight or will have more friction vs. what a bearing is like - case in point, try to move your shock when bolted to the frame only by one of the two eyelets. If you have a bearing mount on one side, it's the best way to actually compare the two variants - you can hardly move the bushing side vs. the shock falling down on the bearing side (and making a hole in the paint with the LSC adjuster knob -_- ).
O-ring supported/tightened bushings could possibly handle the clearance issue, but yeah, as @CuddlyToast said, it's been done and and abandoned. Besides Rocky and Banshee I know Ibis also used to do it (first Ripmo?) and I know Scott did it with the first Horst Link Genius (first modern one, not the pull shock one), but I'm not sure they abandoned it actually. Wouldn't be surprised if they didn't given how lightness focused their bikes are.
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't...
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and...
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and grime, and they have always been in a disgusting state whenever I've serviced the bearings on the 3 4-bar bikes I've owned. I recall reading somewhere that bushings are ideal for locations that consistently see small angle rotations, where bearings are better for larger angles (so that the bearings actually move further in the race). Main pivot and rocker/upper link - absolutely bearings. Rear pivot - bushings. I mean, a lot of brands are going with flex stays back there, so clearly a bearing isn't really necessary.
Any time you don't have full rotation (or slow rotation) a bushing is the better option. Technically bushing should be better for all pivots.Two problems. We...
Any time you don't have full rotation (or slow rotation) a bushing is the better option. Technically bushing should be better for all pivots.
Two problems. We riders don't want the suspension being stiff and/or binding and we don't want the bike to clack around. Bushing require quite a bit more clearance (technically) vs. what a bearing needs to function (clearance of bearings is in the range of microns to hundreths of a mm when not axially preloaded, and bearings technically should be axially preloaded for best performance, which is a topic of discussion in another thread). That will make the axle in the bushing clack around when the loading of it changes direction.
Even with some clearance a bushing will usually be a bit more tight or will have more friction vs. what a bearing is like - case in point, try to move your shock when bolted to the frame only by one of the two eyelets. If you have a bearing mount on one side, it's the best way to actually compare the two variants - you can hardly move the bushing side vs. the shock falling down on the bearing side (and making a hole in the paint with the LSC adjuster knob -_- ).
O-ring supported/tightened bushings could possibly handle the clearance issue, but yeah, as @CuddlyToast said, it's been done and and abandoned. Besides Rocky and Banshee I know Ibis also used to do it (first Ripmo?) and I know Scott did it with the first Horst Link Genius (first modern one, not the pull shock one), but I'm not sure they abandoned it actually. Wouldn't be surprised if they didn't given how lightness focused their bikes are.
Ancillotti did bushings as well, even on the main pivot. I believe they still do. A buddy of mine had one. He needed to break the bushings in, so I believe they come quite tight from the factory and then kind of grind themselves to the right tolerances. He was (is) rather sloppy with bike care, but the bike never creaked or so. Anecdotal, I know, but could hint that with the right execution bushings could work...
Edit: just got called out: a) by first friend not approving being called sloppy, b) by second friend wondering how I could have missed the noises coming from that bike... 😅
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't...
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and...
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and grime, and they have always been in a disgusting state whenever I've serviced the bearings on the 3 4-bar bikes I've owned. I recall reading somewhere that bushings are ideal for locations that consistently see small angle rotations, where bearings are better for larger angles (so that the bearings actually move further in the race). Main pivot and rocker/upper link - absolutely bearings. Rear pivot - bushings. I mean, a lot of brands are going with flex stays back there, so clearly a bearing isn't really necessary.
Any time you don't have full rotation (or slow rotation) a bushing is the better option. Technically bushing should be better for all pivots.Two problems. We...
Any time you don't have full rotation (or slow rotation) a bushing is the better option. Technically bushing should be better for all pivots.
Two problems. We riders don't want the suspension being stiff and/or binding and we don't want the bike to clack around. Bushing require quite a bit more clearance (technically) vs. what a bearing needs to function (clearance of bearings is in the range of microns to hundreths of a mm when not axially preloaded, and bearings technically should be axially preloaded for best performance, which is a topic of discussion in another thread). That will make the axle in the bushing clack around when the loading of it changes direction.
Even with some clearance a bushing will usually be a bit more tight or will have more friction vs. what a bearing is like - case in point, try to move your shock when bolted to the frame only by one of the two eyelets. If you have a bearing mount on one side, it's the best way to actually compare the two variants - you can hardly move the bushing side vs. the shock falling down on the bearing side (and making a hole in the paint with the LSC adjuster knob -_- ).
O-ring supported/tightened bushings could possibly handle the clearance issue, but yeah, as @CuddlyToast said, it's been done and and abandoned. Besides Rocky and Banshee I know Ibis also used to do it (first Ripmo?) and I know Scott did it with the first Horst Link Genius (first modern one, not the pull shock one), but I'm not sure they abandoned it actually. Wouldn't be surprised if they didn't given how lightness focused their bikes are.
my 2016 knolly warden developed quite significant stiction at the bushings.. lets say that foul weather required a lot of maintenance.. it was fine when freshly serviced but it would get to feel like shit quicker than bearings, may be I had shitty bushings , dont know..
It's been done. Rocky, Banshee and others have experimented with bushings. They all creaked worse than a rusty shopping cart after a while... or immediately depending...
It's been done. Rocky, Banshee and others have experimented with bushings. They all creaked worse than a rusty shopping cart after a while... or immediately depending how lucky you were.
He was talking about horst link only, nicolai had been using it for years, mine has it, doesn't require any attention and is creak free, only if you overtighten it it can wear faster and obviously increase friction. It's absolutely right place for bushing, just like shock eyelet is. Ancilotti as posted above use them in all pivots and there are no complaint around.
Dave Turner had bushing on his Turner Bikes and they worked great in Austin (mainly dry riding and plenty of creek crossings). I had an O2 and 5Spot which were some of my favorite frames.
Most Horst links like the Frameworks have low anti rise values, and the floating brake can help further tune it without changing a thing else about the bike. Seems pretty normal to me. Cube was testing then out too a little while ago.
Bumping this spicy rumor. Hoping more gossip to be teased about it.
I thought of Airdrop first too, but the headtube junction and down tube just aren't the same. Unless they are going to have an update for it soon.
Rear axle pivots, either faux bar or Horst link, are notorious for barely rotating at all going through the travel. It's quite possible your solution wouldn't do much to change the anti rise. Therefore the floating brake arm solutions. And as noted, you can test and tune the effect of it with a setup that Neko has. It's probably there as a test or proof of concept, not necessarily as an improvement or a necessity.
Thats the price for the handlebar only, stem not included. So it comes out close to $350 with a stem, compared to $279, where it was sold as package. Edit: sold as a package by weareone that is
Does anyone have the anti-rise graph for the current Enduro? Its "common knowledge" that the Enduro has low anti-rise, or just high rise, or low brake jack, whatever you want to call it.
If you look at the video below, assuming the bike actually does have low antirise, very little pivot movement translates into lots of low antirise (I hate that term and all the double & triple negatives it creates)
https://youtu.be/V1XYCVJt3VE?si=z2nPmoQqQ9iHLSxK&t=90
77designz used to sell a la carte bar and stem no combos. The WeAreOne branded "Da Package" combo was cheaper especially during their black Friday sale last year for which I paid $228 CAD.
Here is the handlebar only price from their old store cached copy
Ah I see - Interesting that the price of their handlebar was the same as weareone charged for both stem/handlebar.
Definitely a decent price decrease from 77's side, but still quite the pricy combo. Im sure it is a very nice piece though
(And yes, the price I referred to was what I could see weareone charged in the past)
Tangentially related, but it annoys me that most 4-bar designs run bearings in that rear pivot instead of bushings. That location gets showered with water and grime, and they have always been in a disgusting state whenever I've serviced the bearings on the 3 4-bar bikes I've owned. I recall reading somewhere that bushings are ideal for locations that consistently see small angle rotations, where bearings are better for larger angles (so that the bearings actually move further in the race). Main pivot and rocker/upper link - absolutely bearings. Rear pivot - bushings. I mean, a lot of brands are going with flex stays back there, so clearly a bearing isn't really necessary.
Not sure on the proper terminology but… my ‘21 Enduro didn’t feel as good on the brakes on harsh terrain as my old ‘17 Giant Reign SX did. The Reign was more actively following the ground leading to more traction and higher corner entry speed.
You can say your buddy works at Propain it's okay.
Looks like the new X2 is almost production ready.
No.
its all true,
we just have to wait till May to officially talk about it. The rear der is a work of art, especially if you hate how big and bulky T-Type is.
its all ready, along with a new 34 and 36 chassis and air spring. Maybe they will even show the new inverted prototype DH fork at sea otter too.
34 and 36 going reverse Arch too?
Whole lotta talk about crab bikes without naming the bikes by their one true name…
Tell them parts need to be available in the US.
Technically, not Shimano's first carbon crankset: https://weightweenies.starbike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34227
It would be their first carbon MTB crankset, though.
A collection of the Australian Scott importer's franchisees abandoned the brand entirely about a year or two ago because sales of the current models were "bad for business". Quite a fall considering the Spark was once the most common bike around here. Innovating its way out of the MTB market apparently... anyway further discussion about Scott specifically might belong more in the "will more companies be shutting down..." thread than here.
https://www.instagram.com/stories/nsbillet/3554943112793615759?igsh=MXE1bHgxcjFmNTB3Nw==
Someone having some fun tinkering away on a GT. Thanks for posting it NSB.
It's been done. Rocky, Banshee and others have experimented with bushings. They all creaked worse than a rusty shopping cart after a while... or immediately depending how lucky you were.
I've also heard rumors about a new fork that's similar to a current offering but different and will run beside the current model
Any time you don't have full rotation (or slow rotation) a bushing is the better option. Technically bushing should be better for all pivots.
Two problems. We riders don't want the suspension being stiff and/or binding and we don't want the bike to clack around. Bushing require quite a bit more clearance (technically) vs. what a bearing needs to function (clearance of bearings is in the range of microns to hundreths of a mm when not axially preloaded, and bearings technically should be axially preloaded for best performance, which is a topic of discussion in another thread). That will make the axle in the bushing clack around when the loading of it changes direction.
Even with some clearance a bushing will usually be a bit more tight or will have more friction vs. what a bearing is like - case in point, try to move your shock when bolted to the frame only by one of the two eyelets. If you have a bearing mount on one side, it's the best way to actually compare the two variants - you can hardly move the bushing side vs. the shock falling down on the bearing side (and making a hole in the paint with the LSC adjuster knob -_- ).
O-ring supported/tightened bushings could possibly handle the clearance issue, but yeah, as @CuddlyToast said, it's been done and and abandoned. Besides Rocky and Banshee I know Ibis also used to do it (first Ripmo?) and I know Scott did it with the first Horst Link Genius (first modern one, not the pull shock one), but I'm not sure they abandoned it actually. Wouldn't be surprised if they didn't given how lightness focused their bikes are.
Ancillotti did bushings as well, even on the main pivot. I believe they still do. A buddy of mine had one. He needed to break the bushings in, so I believe they come quite tight from the factory and then kind of grind themselves to the right tolerances. He was (is) rather sloppy with bike care, but the bike never creaked or so.
Anecdotal, I know, but could hint that with the right execution bushings could work...
Edit: just got called out: a) by first friend not approving being called sloppy, b) by second friend wondering how I could have missed the noises coming from that bike... 😅
my 2016 knolly warden developed quite significant stiction at the bushings.. lets say that foul weather required a lot of maintenance.. it was fine when freshly serviced but it would get to feel like shit quicker than bearings, may be I had shitty bushings , dont know..
He was talking about horst link only, nicolai had been using it for years, mine has it, doesn't require any attention and is creak free, only if you overtighten it it can wear faster and obviously increase friction. It's absolutely right place for bushing, just like shock eyelet is. Ancilotti as posted above use them in all pivots and there are no complaint around.
Dave Turner had bushing on his Turner Bikes and they worked great in Austin (mainly dry riding and plenty of creek crossings). I had an O2 and 5Spot which were some of my favorite frames.
Any idea what they are improving with the new 36 chassis? The 21/23 chassis hasn't been around for long, has it?
My guess