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75nm is a light ebike now. Wow i need to process this
Just to clarify, he didn't say it WAS a high pivot.
He said "design lends itself to a high pivot suspension design".
I think they should have used the black frames for all their lead marketing images as it looks better.
The Rocky Dyname is a fundamentally different motor to everything else on the market. Starts with a low KV motor that spins at a lower RPM and outputs higher base torque. That lower rpm and higher torque then require less gear reduction to get it to an output rpm for the rear wheel. If we think of this in car terms it's like a naturally aspirated engine vs turbo, both could have the same output but there will turbo lag in the high KV higher rpm motor. Unlike a turbo engine there isn't really a way to tune out the turbo lag (anti-lag systems or smaller turbo that spins at lower pressures) in that high rpm motor, there is going to be delay between pressure on the pedals and the torque reaction at the rear wheel.
looks like orbea has their control system ported to the new avinox wild
Your ankles do a good job of hiding the motor when you’re actually on the bike
Definitely looks like the avinox remote in this photo where he’s forgot to cover it over.
To change subject from the Avinox vs. everyone else dead horse...
What do people think the ideal travel is for an ebike that's <50 lbs? The classic 150/160 trail bike arrangement (argument: less is more, makes the bike poppier to offset the weight)? ~170 front/rear enduro arrangement (argument: need a bit more to compensate for the weight/inertia)? 180+ super enduro (argument: make it a self-shuttle DH bike)? For those 55-60lb behemoths (cough, Norco, cough), I don't think there's any point NOT running as much travel as is possible.
I’m a big fan of the 160-170 rear travel class of bikes. Partly because I’m over 200lbs and the smaller travel stuff can be pretty fragile at times. I would rather drag around extra weight for that piece of mind. (This is my view for mtb and e-mtb)
The current Range VLT is great. 50 lbs, 170/160, good kinematics for solid pop and jive yet still with a high pivot (mid pivot) that lets you plow. I like that for the 50lb mark.
The prior gen range VLT at 60 lbs was a good mauler at 180/170 but not much fun to throw around.
I’d love to keep full power 170/160 but shave it down to 45 lbs.
180 mm suspension feels like overkill on most trails on an E-Bike because with the added weight it will just feel dead on mellower trails.
But I think it's relative to rider weight/strength and skill plus obviously terrain. Same as motor power.
160-170 mm is where the Sweetspot is in my opinion if you want to ride natural trails mostly and maybe visit bike parks once in a while. If you wanna ride really rough Enduro/dh style tracks or bigger jumps more travel is probably better but the downside will be that with the added weight the bike will feel too planted and muted for tamer stuff. You can mitigate this with more pressure and faster rebound to some degree.
I still long for the hypothetical true dh ebike...
Part of the reason for my question is my Vala can be built up either with the stock 150/160, or ~163/170 by simply overforking and running 65mm stroke shock instead of 60mm. I did the long travel setup from day 1, never trying it in stock form. But I really like my Bronson (better than the Nomad I had before it), and had a ton of fun on a Heckler SL when I owned that (150/160 also). So I'm starting to have second thoughts on whether this might be a case of "less is more (fun)."
I briefly ran a 170 fork on the HSL, and while it made it a little bit more confident on a few steep features, I thought the bike was more fun in 160/150 form. Just a little bit snappier and more responsive. Similarly, when I had a Nomad 6, I did run it a bit firmer and in the high flip chip position to try and make it handle faster mellower trails better, and it just never had the same trail hooligan nature of the Bronson I replaced it with (even though the geometry is essentially identical).
But I'm also wondering broadly whether the reason most brands make 150/160 ebikes is because they're the most well rounded, or whether it's because the components in that travel bracket tend to be a bit lighter (for weight spec numbers).
I suppose its ez enough to run long travel and put a few extra psi's in it when you want to dig out the lycra grape smugglers
Seems like it would depend on where you live and what you ride, if it’s a mellow area less travel makes sense.
Faced with criticism regarding the power output of its latest motor system, Avinox has recently put out the following statement (which is essentially the same messages they provided in our forum hotseat on e-bike power a few months ago):
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In mountain biking, power is often misunderstood. For some, higher motor output raises concerns about safety, trail impact, or component wear. For Avinox, power is not about excess, but about possibility. Power can help more people ride farther, climb steeper, and tackle terrain that might otherwise be out of reach.
Our approach to power is rooted in a simple principle: technology should expand access to mountain biking while preserving safety, reliability, and rider control.
Power Is About Capability, Not Speed
When people hear that an eMTB motor delivers high power, they often express concerns about danger, assuming higher power also means higher speed. In reality, these are two very different things. Speed is what ultimately determines safety risk. Power is the force that helps riders accelerate, especially at low speeds and in demanding situations such as steep climbs, technical ascents, and navigation around obstacles.
Avinox systems comply fully with all applicable speed regulations, and we strongly support the implementation and enforcement of speed limits. That means our high power output is not designed to make riders go faster than allowed. It is designed to make difficult terrain more manageable. Whether it is clearing a rocky ledge, climbing a steep incline, or helping a less experienced rider maintain momentum, more power can make mountain biking both easier and safer.
Safety Is a Function of Control
Any bicycle can gain significant speed on a descent, whether it is powered or not. This is not unique to eMTBs. The safety challenge in mountain biking is managing speed, maintaining traction, and giving riders the confidence to overcome high-resistance obstacles in complex terrain.
Avinox focuses on delivering power precisely when it is needed. Our intelligent assistance algorithms provide smooth, predictable support that helps riders maintain control in various situations. In many cases, more available power improves safety by reducing the likelihood of stalling, losing balance, or being forced to dismount in difficult terrain.
Flexible Power for Real-World Riding
Different riders face different challenges. A steep technical climb requires a different level of support than a flowing cross-country trail. A loaded cargo bike climbing a hill has different needs than a lightweight commuter.
Avinox addresses this with customizable riding modes and user-adjustable settings, allowing riders to tailor assistance - including maximum output - to match the terrain and their personal preferences. This flexibility provides support when it matters most while maintaining efficiency and control.
Democratizing Mountain Biking
Mountain biking should be accessible to more people, regardless of fitness level, body type, age, or physical limitations. High-powered systems help make that vision a reality. With greater assistance, riders can:
For heavier riders, riders with disabilities, and those hauling cargo, higher power can be considered essential, rather than a luxury. A rigid, one-size-fits-all power limit risks excluding riders who benefit most from additional assistance.
Designed to Protect the Bike
Power only matters if the system remains reliable. Avinox carefully balances performance with durability, avoiding the trap of increasing output solely to claim bigger numbers. Advanced sensors and software continuously monitor riding conditions and adjust torque delivery to protect key components.
For example, the system automatically reduces power during gear shifts, minimizing drivetrain stress and extending the life of chains, cassettes, and derailleurs. Smooth, precisely controlled power delivery also reduces wear on tires, brakes, and wheelsets.
System-Level Optimization
A high-performance motor cannot be developed in isolation. Avinox takes a complete system approach, optimizing the entire bicycle platform to handle elevated power output, including:
This integrated engineering ensures that riders benefit from maximum capability without compromising safety or reliability.
Higher Power Does Not Threaten the Industry
Some argue that offering more powerful motors could invite regulatory scrutiny or harm the industry. We believe that view oversimplifies a much more nuanced issue. Avinox supports responsible regulation and strict compliance with all applicable laws. At the same time, we believe innovation should not be constrained by arbitrary power limits that lack a clearly explained basis.
The industry benefits when manufacturers focus on solving real rider challenges and respecting the diverse needs of users. Progress should be guided by safety, performance, and accessibility, not by assumptions that more power is inherently problematic.
Beyond Power: The Full Avinox Advantage
Power is only one part of what makes Avinox different. Our commitment to innovation is reflected in every aspect of the system, including:
Together, these technologies create a riding experience that feels intuitive, natural, and remarkably capable.
The Future of eMTB Performance
At Avinox, maximum power is not about pushing limits for the sake of headlines. It is about empowering more riders to experience mountain biking in ways that are safer, more enjoyable, and more inclusive. By combining high power with intelligent control, system-level engineering, and rider-focused innovation, Avinox is redefining what an eBike motor can do. Because when technology is thoughtfully designed, more power means more opportunity.
Focusing on speed on the descent is a fascinating way to dodge the issue. It's speed on the ascents that is the concern. And people are already finding ways round the limiters.
I'm also deeply skeptical that anyone truely needs 800% assistance.... Show me a use case where 400% assistance is just not enough....
Politics, religion and emtb power limits. People are dug in, better for Avinox to not try to change minds.
You missed those 5 bullet points right in the middle of the article didn’t you
Hot take: I agree with them.
Keep the 20mph mode? 700 watts, 1200 watts, it's a non issue. Bikes with throttles can be an issue for <20mph, but DJI doesn't make one.
No I read them. I just don't agree that we need 800% for that. It's sooo much power.
The amount of power you use is a choice and is totally tuneable.
No one ever criticises the power of cars or motorbikes but even the shittest car can break the speed limits…. The end user is responsible and culpable for how they use/abuse it.
Then we get on the hot topic of guns… whether you like them or not it’s the person that decides to pull the trigger. I appreciate this is a sore point in the US but there are fair comparisons here in how these things are regulated and governed and how much freedom of choice you want to take away from people.
They're dodging the issues regarding impacts to access that having stupid levels of power create. Besides the fact that they make it easy to exceed the speed limit using only a VPN, that absurd level of power makes it easy for riders to hit the 20mph limit in locations that other trail users are not expecting to encounter bikes going 20mph uphill. Saying that all that extra power makes it easier for beginners to control their bikes and improves skills is also a flat out lie - even without that extra power beginner riders were overwhelmed by run-on and controlling the bike in corners or over technical terrain. They don't have years of muscle memory that enable them to ratchet cranks, track stand, or even modulate brakes. Letting them get up to the speed limit faster is just going to create more accidents.
For me its not a huge issue. It'd be fun climbing otherwise impossible climbs but with that much power i don't think youre going very far even on a 800w battery.
Im more concerned with servicing them, customer care, and that skinny battery. Bosch may make more sense on all those possible issues. Rebuildable and great supply network and the bosch battery is well protected. Avinox is still an unknown quantity. I'd love to have a skinny battery , and down tube, and run a triple clamp fork but the battery casing is giving me red flags. Maybe its fine but i havent really seen any battery comparisons
Then why is it fine for a 16/17 year old to buy a muscle car without years of driving experience?
No one hates Ford/GM for making more powerful cars.
DJI/Avinox are not like Lewis who have photocopied and the improved something. They have designed, engineered and built something from scratch and done it way batter than everyone else. Giving them all a kick in their blasé arse in the process… Bosch and Spesh have hitched their skirts up a bit but they can do better.
The new 700w Avinox battery is incredible (not just another repackaged Panasonic. Complete cell and wiring redesign with only 6% less burn time than the 800. Fuckin fair play to them.
For years we’ve been voting in leaders who stifle and throttle advancement (in the name of equality and environmental whatevers) so the Chinese took on the task on our behalf. They’ve smashed it. And you hate them for it. The irony is hilarious.
Trail access is the biggest thing they are threatening to upend. A ton of effort was invested to get Class 1 access, now the power war could threaten this effort. Manufactures have to respond to consumer demand to stay competitive. Slightly related, you can see NJ law responding to the Sur-Ron popularity, there has to be arbitrary line set somewhere.
This whole power war situation sucks. I spent years fighting for MTB trail access and I'm quite worried with the Class 1 eMTB players blatantly flaunting the spirit of the rules. For the first time, the anti-MTB crowd actually have a valid point. DJI and Specialized DGAF. None. Burn it all down.
Thats exactly the same response that the equine/hiking/hunting crowd had when mtb first started. The same from Skiers when snowboarding became a thing.
“NIMBY”
You're just way off on this. I ride an eMTB.
Doesn’t sound like it
I'd prefer it if we give it time to gain the proof that it will cause conflicts. That extra evidence would help get regulation amount correct
I’m sure this access thing is going to be different in whatever area we are talking about. Different land managers, and perspectives.
Here in Southern Oregon there are E bikes everywhere. Hikers and other groups have complained about them, but the forest service and the city of Ashland don’t have the manpower or the resources to enforce any of it. Basically like trying to stop a tsunami. The amount of rogue trails that have sprung up has went nuclear. The unexpected benefit is that everybody is spread out and it has seemingly decreased conflicts.
This power argument is just a TINY bit of the conversation. The Surron people are going to be the ones who cause any cataclysmic access issues. I think if it resembles a traditional MTB, nobody’s going to give a shit. I know this because I’m already seeing it.
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