2024 Racing Talk

hogfly
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4/15/2024 1:07pm Edited Date/Time 4/15/2024 1:08pm
hogfly wrote:
Sort of on topic:   Has anyone watched the season 2 of Race Tapes on Red Bull TV yet? I've watched two so far, and they're...

Sort of on topic:

 

Has anyone watched the season 2 of Race Tapes on Red Bull TV yet? I've watched two so far, and they're really good.

 

The Finn Iles one is just brutal, though. The other site's podcast had an interview with the creators where they basically said they're more interested in telling a good story than actually communicating reality. Evidently Finn was in the room at a public screening they had up in the PNW and they all said that was a little uncomfortable. I don't want to go into the specifics and spoil it too much, but I can imagine that would have been a little rough. Still love, Finn, though and wish him all the best this season. 

rludes025 wrote:

I just watched it; I didn't feel like it was cringy. Nothing wrong with telling the story of a young man figuring shit out. 

I mean... when they showed him talking about that hip and how cool it was and how he'll style it out but his scrub isn't as good in that direction... then they showed him getting DQ'd and zero points on that specific hip and overdubbed the French announcers saying something about not trying to be stylish/cute and just take care of business.

That's like some pretty significant editorializing, especially in that they painted a picture of Finn as cocky and bigheaded in the past.

 

rludes025
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4/15/2024 1:29pm
hogfly wrote:
Sort of on topic:   Has anyone watched the season 2 of Race Tapes on Red Bull TV yet? I've watched two so far, and they're...

Sort of on topic:

 

Has anyone watched the season 2 of Race Tapes on Red Bull TV yet? I've watched two so far, and they're really good.

 

The Finn Iles one is just brutal, though. The other site's podcast had an interview with the creators where they basically said they're more interested in telling a good story than actually communicating reality. Evidently Finn was in the room at a public screening they had up in the PNW and they all said that was a little uncomfortable. I don't want to go into the specifics and spoil it too much, but I can imagine that would have been a little rough. Still love, Finn, though and wish him all the best this season. 

rludes025 wrote:

I just watched it; I didn't feel like it was cringy. Nothing wrong with telling the story of a young man figuring shit out. 

hogfly wrote:
I mean... when they showed him talking about that hip and how cool it was and how he'll style it out but his scrub isn't as...

I mean... when they showed him talking about that hip and how cool it was and how he'll style it out but his scrub isn't as good in that direction... then they showed him getting DQ'd and zero points on that specific hip and overdubbed the French announcers saying something about not trying to be stylish/cute and just take care of business.

That's like some pretty significant editorializing, especially in that they painted a picture of Finn as cocky and bigheaded in the past.

 

I guess I don't equate scrubbing a jump as cocky. It oftentimes can be the fastest way through a section, and if his feet stayed on the pedals, it would have been perfect. I agree there was a safer way through that corner and that they teed that one up early for the story, though. 

hogfly
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4/15/2024 2:13pm
rludes025 wrote:
I guess I don't equate scrubbing a jump as cocky. It oftentimes can be the fastest way through a section, and if his feet stayed on...

I guess I don't equate scrubbing a jump as cocky. It oftentimes can be the fastest way through a section, and if his feet stayed on the pedals, it would have been perfect. I agree there was a safer way through that corner and that they teed that one up early for the story, though. 

I totally agree that it’s not cocky. Thafs my whole point. That’s what bothered me about it. I think they tried to paint it that way. They admitttd in the interview that they worn with archetypes and create stories. I mean: I get it. He pointed out this specific part of track as being cool. Then he screwed it up and his season went down from there. But they made it all about some deeper character flaw he’s battling or something. That’s what I thought was brutal. Admittedly: I had listened to a podcast about this before watching, so maybe I was just focused on it. 

bulletbass man
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4/15/2024 2:54pm

My only issue is they weren’t that clear about him winning in msa the year before.  Or showed how good his relationship with loic is.  Finn is usually the first guy out to congratulate loic in the finish area.  The insight to what went wrong in his race run was probably the best part of the episode.
 

the Rachel episode and the syndicate episode were the two that were best.

rludes025
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4/15/2024 6:07pm Edited Date/Time 4/15/2024 6:08pm
rludes025 wrote:
I guess I don't equate scrubbing a jump as cocky. It oftentimes can be the fastest way through a section, and if his feet stayed on...

I guess I don't equate scrubbing a jump as cocky. It oftentimes can be the fastest way through a section, and if his feet stayed on the pedals, it would have been perfect. I agree there was a safer way through that corner and that they teed that one up early for the story, though. 

hogfly wrote:
I totally agree that it’s not cocky. Thafs my whole point. That’s what bothered me about it. I think they tried to paint it that way...

I totally agree that it’s not cocky. Thafs my whole point. That’s what bothered me about it. I think they tried to paint it that way. They admitttd in the interview that they worn with archetypes and create stories. I mean: I get it. He pointed out this specific part of track as being cool. Then he screwed it up and his season went down from there. But they made it all about some deeper character flaw he’s battling or something. That’s what I thought was brutal. Admittedly: I had listened to a podcast about this before watching, so maybe I was just focused on it. 

Yeah, sorry. I didn't factor in the podcast piece to your observation. Your post did make me watch that episode and I think I'll watch the rest since it was at least entertaining. 

luisgutrod
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4/15/2024 11:09pm
My only issue is they weren’t that clear about him winning in msa the year before.  Or showed how good his relationship with loic is.  Finn...

My only issue is they weren’t that clear about him winning in msa the year before.  Or showed how good his relationship with loic is.  Finn is usually the first guy out to congratulate loic in the finish area.  The insight to what went wrong in his race run was probably the best part of the episode.
 

the Rachel episode and the syndicate episode were the two that were best.

I understand it's RB production, but the lack of participation of other riders, except Loris, is too unbalanced on the 2023 story.. they can do whatever they want of course, but letting out the little fact of who won the first race of the year, to me, is too much.

sspomer
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bizutch
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4/16/2024 7:54am

Congrats to the Pro Women's winner. Evil

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brash
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4/16/2024 7:41pm

this was seriously cool

 

 

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fartsack
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4/17/2024 4:09am
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

great watch. an props to josh.

4/17/2024 11:05am
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from where they could be. Especially on steeper tracks.. DH bikes could have 12 inches of travel, 4 inches wide tires, and different geo (longer wheelbase, higher stack....some numbers are already similar between mx and dh). it seems that the range of what is usable for DH racing is bigger than what the industry is playing with..

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veefour
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4/17/2024 12:51pm Edited Date/Time 4/17/2024 12:54pm
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from...

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from where they could be. Especially on steeper tracks.. DH bikes could have 12 inches of travel, 4 inches wide tires, and different geo (longer wheelbase, higher stack....some numbers are already similar between mx and dh). it seems that the range of what is usable for DH racing is bigger than what the industry is playing with..

I dunno, Josh was 14 seconds back on Dak on his race run and I'd expect him to be faster on an MX bike than a DH bike.

Anyone else remember this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqBy1R7IMGE

Fort Bill is pretty pedally by DH standards, with quite a few sections where you could open up an MX or Enduro motorbike. I'd also say DH bikes have gotten a fair bit quicker in the intervening years.

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bulletbass man
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4/17/2024 2:08pm
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

Watched that just to see him quad the step up!

brash
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4/17/2024 4:10pm
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from...

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from where they could be. Especially on steeper tracks.. DH bikes could have 12 inches of travel, 4 inches wide tires, and different geo (longer wheelbase, higher stack....some numbers are already similar between mx and dh). it seems that the range of what is usable for DH racing is bigger than what the industry is playing with..

this is good viewing on the subject

 

 

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bizutch
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4/18/2024 9:37am Edited Date/Time 4/18/2024 9:37am
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from...

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from where they could be. Especially on steeper tracks.. DH bikes could have 12 inches of travel, 4 inches wide tires, and different geo (longer wheelbase, higher stack....some numbers are already similar between mx and dh). it seems that the range of what is usable for DH racing is bigger than what the industry is playing with..

They conducted this same test last year with a Hard Enduro pro.
He was on a gasser with a clutch.
Josh's Varg has no clutch so going downhill with engine braking sucks.

The guy's times last year were virtually identical except the flat finish where he took the "win" on his moto.

Same thing with Josh.  He was able to throttle up the big hill and QUAD, yet still case, the lander and he hit the throttle on the finish. Those 2 spots were easily 4 seconds.  He went slower on some of the descents because of that engine braking and weight bias on the Stark.  Trying to get 200lbs of forward pulling motor to change directions on steep off camber is way harder than on a DH rig.

1
4/18/2024 11:39am
brash wrote:
this was seriously cool    

this was seriously cool

 

 

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from...

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from where they could be. Especially on steeper tracks.. DH bikes could have 12 inches of travel, 4 inches wide tires, and different geo (longer wheelbase, higher stack....some numbers are already similar between mx and dh). it seems that the range of what is usable for DH racing is bigger than what the industry is playing with..

bizutch wrote:
They conducted this same test last year with a Hard Enduro pro. He was on a gasser with a clutch. Josh's Varg has no clutch so...

They conducted this same test last year with a Hard Enduro pro.
He was on a gasser with a clutch.
Josh's Varg has no clutch so going downhill with engine braking sucks.

The guy's times last year were virtually identical except the flat finish where he took the "win" on his moto.

Same thing with Josh.  He was able to throttle up the big hill and QUAD, yet still case, the lander and he hit the throttle on the finish. Those 2 spots were easily 4 seconds.  He went slower on some of the descents because of that engine braking and weight bias on the Stark.  Trying to get 200lbs of forward pulling motor to change directions on steep off camber is way harder than on a DH rig.

Absolutely, It's why I'm wondering if the motor vs the weight penalty even out ..then maybe a moto without a motor is not far out from a usable DH bike. What is really interesting in this video is that we compare 2 runs with the same rider. A lot of the design requirements on Dh bike are based on a bike that can somewhat be pedaled efficiently but for many tracks it's not that important.

bizutch
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4/18/2024 1:28pm
Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from...

Really interesting that times are so close on 2 different machines.. maybe some food for thought than maybe our current DH bikes are still far from where they could be. Especially on steeper tracks.. DH bikes could have 12 inches of travel, 4 inches wide tires, and different geo (longer wheelbase, higher stack....some numbers are already similar between mx and dh). it seems that the range of what is usable for DH racing is bigger than what the industry is playing with..

bizutch wrote:
They conducted this same test last year with a Hard Enduro pro. He was on a gasser with a clutch. Josh's Varg has no clutch so...

They conducted this same test last year with a Hard Enduro pro.
He was on a gasser with a clutch.
Josh's Varg has no clutch so going downhill with engine braking sucks.

The guy's times last year were virtually identical except the flat finish where he took the "win" on his moto.

Same thing with Josh.  He was able to throttle up the big hill and QUAD, yet still case, the lander and he hit the throttle on the finish. Those 2 spots were easily 4 seconds.  He went slower on some of the descents because of that engine braking and weight bias on the Stark.  Trying to get 200lbs of forward pulling motor to change directions on steep off camber is way harder than on a DH rig.

Absolutely, It's why I'm wondering if the motor vs the weight penalty even out ..then maybe a moto without a motor is not far out from...

Absolutely, It's why I'm wondering if the motor vs the weight penalty even out ..then maybe a moto without a motor is not far out from a usable DH bike. What is really interesting in this video is that we compare 2 runs with the same rider. A lot of the design requirements on Dh bike are based on a bike that can somewhat be pedaled efficiently but for many tracks it's not that important.

The Hard Enduro guy last year did 2 side by side GoPro helmet cam runs on a split screen. 

https://youtu.be/I1AsBXMjh6I?si=z_tiD9MBE1jUzF6i

sspomer
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4/18/2024 8:59pm

sea otter pro dual slalom qualifying results

 

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hogfly
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4/19/2024 6:34am

Whoever was on Kona is probably looking for a ride, too...

Eddie and Caleb are both way too sick of riders to end up without a sponsor. 

Batts
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4/19/2024 7:23am
sspomer wrote:

that track is sick!!!

It is, XC going in the right direction.  Tracks that require mtb skill, the right tire choice, full suspension and knowing how to use a dropper post will help.  When push comes to shove the stronger rider will come out on top but they have to get down these technical sections.

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jwillp
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4/19/2024 7:41am
sspomer wrote:
sea otter pro dual slalom qualifying results  

sea otter pro dual slalom qualifying results

 

good to see dak in there.  Under-rated on the little bike...

Snfoilhat
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4/19/2024 10:12am Edited Date/Time 4/19/2024 1:56pm

In racing news that surely belongs next to Dakotah Norton’s result, i just qualified (barely!) for dual slalom intermediate men 40-49 Tongue

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bizutch
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4/19/2024 10:44am

To the woke morons thinking I was slandering anyone when I said Congrats to the Women's winner, Bailey Goldstone...please...just look at who posted the original link to the results.  

image-20240419134404-1

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drakefan705
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4/19/2024 10:48am
bizutch wrote:
To the woke morons thinking I was slandering anyone when I said Congrats to the Women's winner, Bailey Goldstone...please...just look at who posted the original link...

To the woke morons thinking I was slandering anyone when I said Congrats to the Women's winner, Bailey Goldstone...please...just look at who posted the original link to the results.  

image-20240419134404-1

ALN won the women’s division 

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bizutch
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4/19/2024 11:08am
BGoldstone wrote:

and I'm not Bailey.

I knew that.
Dang it.  My jokes even when I think they're funny tank.

I'll leave and go be lonely.

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