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@Slavid666 Thanks for the Sinter Green suggestion. I did a big ride in the snow and they were dead quiet the whole time. Even after a nice crash in powder which got the rotors/calipers soaking wet and it only took 5 seconds for the noise to go away. With the Hayes metallic pads, they would be insanely loud for at least 5 minutes if not the rest of the ride. Great modulation and power to boot. Excited to run them on my summer bikes too.
You can definitely build very good wheels just by pitch - I'm basically tone deaf and can still achieve adequately even tension by plucking. The problem becomes after a month of riding - can you verify the pitch is still the same? And theres no way to quantify the absolute tension of each spoke in different wheels - a CX-ray in a carbon rim will sound very different to a thicker round spoke in an alloy rim. if a wheel comes back after a month with a broken spoke, you need some way of confirming that it was built to the correct tension so you can be sure its not your fault that it broke. When people are charging thousands of dollars for a carbon wheelset they need to be doing every possible to make sure its as reliable as it can be.I know for a fact most wheel breakages or spoke breakages are due to the tension being too low, uneven or spokes being the wrong length. The only way to do that consistently every time is with good tools. It's sadly become too common for when someone breaks a spoke they get blamed for doing something wrong or "must have got a stick in it" when actually the wheel wasn't built properly. Thats why I linked to wheelworks - he didn't want to accept that spokes always break so learned how to prevent it and has proven its possible. Another example of how low the bar has gotten is Brian Cahals revent video on ENVE wheels - he seemed genuinely shocked that they lasted a year when really that should be a realistic expectation! Wire spoke bicycle wheels are very good so you shouldn't need to touch them outside of a World Cup DH weekend (DH is a bit of an exception - its pretty tough to be invincible to full blown rock strikes, but the typical enduro rider shouldn't be seeing that)
If you only build the occasional wheel then you don't have to go all out on tools, but if you are regularly doing high end builds then I think its essential, and a shop should at least be aware of its limits and maybe leave the most expensive & lightweight builds to someone better equipped. Or be prepared to suck up the repair cost if it comes back after a month and not put it back on your customer. People got trained to accept things like spokes coming loose after a few rides, or brakes needing a few squeezes to "pump them up" when really that is totally preventable and not really that hard to do!
figure putting brage's latest AK insanity in here is appropriate 🤣
Impossible, Shimano brakes are terrible according to a majority of this thread. 🤠
They still are
Get the job done but they’re nothing special, plus, he could do all that on v brakes
Another way of saying "it's not the bike, it's the rider" 😉
My point being, if Saints are good enough for a rider of the skill of Brage, it will do for most of us mortals.
Different strokes for different folks, i was joking a bit, this is a tech derailment thread in the end.
How is pulling a vacuum supposed to be done?
Clamp the syringe and try to degas the fluid the fluid that you will be bleeding with. Is this useful for both for and mineral fluids?
Attach the syringe to one end of the brakes and pull while leaving the other end closed to pull out small air bubbles. How do you prevent bubbles from going right back into the system ones you release the vacuum?
Correct, close the opposite end of where you're trying to pull a vacuum. With the syringe vertical hold the slight vacuum and you'll see bubbles rise past the "surface" of the fluid in the syringe. Poof, gone forever
My apologies if I'm way late to the party on this one, but I was pretty surprised. Want to make 110% sure I've got it right, and post may be a nice PSA if I do.
SRAM "Dot Grease" is now labeled "hydraulic brake grease," and even though seals only play well will DOT or mineral oil, the hydraulic brake grease is what you us for all of their brakes, DOT and mineral oil.
The formula / chemical makeup of this grease has never changed. SRAM says, "The formula for Hydraulic Brake Grease has remained consistent since it was branded under AVID or PitStop"
The bottom line is that it appears I can use the ancient tub of SRAM brake grease labeled "DOT" on my Maven's and it's just fine. It just seems heretical, given how much everyone freaks out about not using anything DOT with anything mineral oil and vice versa.
Is this right?
I would have to look up the data sheet to be sure but its probably right - mineral oil systems and their seals are fairly tolerant of a wide range of grease/oils so grease made for DOT brakes will usually be fine in mineral oil. Its the dot fluid itself that can be harsh on some rubbers. The biggest issue is using anything mineral oil based (ie 99% of greases) in a DOT system as the seals will rapidly swell and ruin the whole thing
people missing the part that Brage is scrubbing the speed.....
When sponsored... you tend to make do with what you have.
Pretty much every single person i've spoken to who have changed away from shimano to brands from TRP, SRAM to trickstuff all enjoy how much better they are than shimano.
Shimano have the benefit of being easy to setup... perfect for pinkies to say "they are better" because they can lever bleed with a cup.
You've probably already seen them, but there are a lot of very inexpensive vacuum bleeders available for automotive work that might be good for any experimentation you wanted to do with mechanizing this a bit more. They don't all have gauges but here is one with a gauge for under $30: https://www.harborfreight.com/brake-bleeder-and-vacuum-pump-kit-63391.html
I'd used one without a gauge many years ago, to bleed some Hope brakes, back when no one in the bike world was offering anything like the nice "Pro" bleed kits that exist now. Compared to the crap syringes that we were working with at the time, it was a step up, but we didn't really have it dialed in terms of getting a good enough seal at the fittings, so air leakage could be a problem. That really isn't any different than pulling a vacuum on syringes though, so if you already have good airtight fittings to use with your brake system now, then splicing them into the vacuum bleeder shouldn't be a big deal. The neat thing about these devices vs. a syringe is, even without a power source, they can maintain a vacuum and leave your hands free to do other work, and they also have a large catch can, you don't run out of capacity if you are needing to move a lot of fluid.
Sram just changed the name, it's the same product.
https://www.sram.com/en/service/articles/Hydraulic-Brake-Grease-Formerly-DOT-Grease
Bs. Shigura is best bang for the buck if you know how to set it up with plutonline and like the hard bite point.
i can argue in the long run Hope is the best bang for buchk, shigura is dogshit, if the master leaks it goes in the bin, levers are made of cheese so every couple crashes you need a new one, if something happens to the caliper side you can't service that one either, so no, definitely not good value
does anyone have any hint of media release date for the new shimano brakes?
In november I was told End of Feb but not sure if still the case?
Are you talking about Magura or Shigura?
Shifura, but it’s the same on both, on Magura you get the 5 year leak proof, on shimano you get the normal warranty and no parts to fix/service the brakes
I would pretty much just use a shock vacuum bleeder - only smaller and with seals made for DOT fluid (and a separate machine for mineral oil, or even the same one used on dampers). Maybe have a split hose to tap in to both ends but the machine itself wouldn't need much changed. I don't pressurise the fluid at the end, other than to make sure there is a bubble of fluid in the bleed port and air doesn't get sucked back in. The bladder compensates for extra volume anyway, and any firmer lever feel will disappear once the pads have worn slightly. If you wanted something like that I would rather use a product like the @CascadeComponents brake adjuster
Also if anyone is interested, you can get push-loc and threaded fittings off ali express dirt cheap, along with syringes and luer adapters if you want to play with bleeding techniques (or rebuilding 4 ohlins TTX25 shocks at once....)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002817631533.html?spm=a2g0o.store_pc_home.promoteWysiwyg_6000894952908.1005002817631533 (just an example)
But Shimano levers are not cheese to the level Magura are...
Feels a bit like ranting for the sake of ranting...
FWIW, based on a tightness testing fixture we have at work (measuring pressure drop at 50 mbar pressure levels and the like), I'd use compression fittings instead of push in fittings. Somewhat stiff hoses so they don't buckle and close off under vacuum is a good choice too.
As for luerlock fittings off Aliexpress, I don't have the best experience... I've had to crank down on them with pliers to make them seal at least somewhat reliably...
EDIT: as for separate machines, what about using the machine just to apply vaccum and pressure and using external fluid tanks? That way you can have separate tanks for mineral or dot fluid. There is still the chance of vapour getting pulled further into the system and mixing with the other fluid though...
the blades on Shimano are as strong as the lip on a can of beer, crash once and they're fatigued, crash twice and you need a new one, on magura the sort of carbotecture master is more of an issue, it not ranting, it makes sense, both options, especially when paired together are a worse combo bang for buck in the long run than say Hope as you miss both companies warranties and get both levers and calipers that are officially un serviceable
Servicability wise Sram is probably the best option.
i'd say so, but if you take performance and value for money then it's quite horrible as well
Formula offers every single part needed even for brakes that are 20years old 😉
you have made your opinion on Shimano known, repeating it every time someone talks about it won’t change anything
I want more digital photo forensics instead please
Yes.
I think you've just encountered the concept of a "mechanical fuse".
Shimano seems to always be in a weird spot. I've friends who've had no issues to report and others who quit the brakes due to too many issues, myself included. When they were new they were damn good, but they didn't age well. Every brake is easy to set up as they're all just a variation on a theme, you just have to find their note differences to interpret their take right. Where I think Shimano gets things right is their fluid paths. Every unit I've worked on has had air in the reservoir, whether that was new on a bike or from a box. When mounted, you would never notice it til you came to near the end of the pad life or flipped the bike upside down. Their fluid paths guide the air up out of the active part of the system really well. I've bemoaned the issues I've had with em here and elsewhere so I'll just say where they're wrong is service parts availability, and arguably that some brakes are strictly designed not to be serviced at all due to permanent fasteners (lookin' at you, non series Deore).
Post a reply to: Nerding out on Brakes shall we? Not another tech deraliment