MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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Jotegr
Posts
339
Joined
6/28/2024
Location
Interior, BC CA
11/14/2024 6:29am
bikelurker wrote:

Mini-mullet should be a thing already, what's holding freeride from coming back?

They don't need to buy new bikes to make it happen, plenty of long travel bikes from a couple years ago have slightly too high BBs and slightly too steep head angles. On a platform where STA doesn't matter, just slap a 26 inch wheel out back and good to go. 

5
amaranth
Posts
176
Joined
10/19/2023
Location
Nutley, NJ US
11/14/2024 7:12am

Are there any reviews out for the Forbidden Supernought yet? It was released end of last year, yet I haven't seen any of the major outlets do a review yet. 

7
bikelurker
Posts
172
Joined
3/23/2023
Location
Bilbao, Vizcaya ES
11/14/2024 8:00am Edited Date/Time 11/14/2024 8:01am

I get your point about freeride guys, thank you very much. But then (and I'm sorry if I end up derailling the thread) What is going on with the way Fox is positioning Marzochi? Now that they "downgraded" the Z1 to rail damper and finally have a pair of oem options to offer even bellow the fox rhythm lineup... The other two options they have, the more premium ones, are the 58, that its been only available in 27.5 since the begining, and the new super z, wich oposing to some opinions here, has been released in both 27.5 and 29 (I am assuming there are some substantial differences between this and a 38, as the later one tops out at 180mm and the new one goes 10mm further)

I mean, fork availability is key if you want to design that certain type of bike, I know brands keep legacy components in the market, so old bikes can still be serviced an kept running but... Thats a new, my2025 fork, so?

I cant wrap my head around this, the same about those new 26" conti enduro tyres... Of course you can get minions in that size, they have been available since forever... But wasn't 26" dead? Maybe i am just looking at it from a wrong point of view...

1
Nobble
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9/24/2010
Location
Lakewood, CO US
11/14/2024 9:20am Edited Date/Time 11/14/2024 9:21am

I think they’re trying to do two things with the brand simultaneously.


They’re trying to position it as the cool freeride brand with things like the Bomber DJ, the 58 and Super Z.

But they’re also trying to create an offering to compete with the ultra cheap RS offerings in the OEM space (like the 35 Gold and Silver) without devaluing the Fox brand image.

5
lickmycrinkle
Posts
210
Joined
1/27/2021
Location
Beverly Hills, CA US
11/14/2024 9:45am
Nobble wrote:
I think they’re trying to do two things with the brand simultaneously.They’re trying to position it as the cool freeride brand with things like the Bomber...

I think they’re trying to do two things with the brand simultaneously.


They’re trying to position it as the cool freeride brand with things like the Bomber DJ, the 58 and Super Z.

But they’re also trying to create an offering to compete with the ultra cheap RS offerings in the OEM space (like the 35 Gold and Silver) without devaluing the Fox brand image.

I often pondered this, but then they go ahead and release absolute turds like the AWL series for (yuk) e-suvs. In that case, sacrificing image can't be all that important to them, all for a segment that probably doesn't notice who makes anything on their bike.

 

FOX 34 AWL | 27.5 - 120mm

3
Jotegr
Posts
339
Joined
6/28/2024
Location
Interior, BC CA
11/14/2024 9:52am
Nobble wrote:
I think they’re trying to do two things with the brand simultaneously.They’re trying to position it as the cool freeride brand with things like the Bomber...

I think they’re trying to do two things with the brand simultaneously.


They’re trying to position it as the cool freeride brand with things like the Bomber DJ, the 58 and Super Z.

But they’re also trying to create an offering to compete with the ultra cheap RS offerings in the OEM space (like the 35 Gold and Silver) without devaluing the Fox brand image.

I often pondered this, but then they go ahead and release absolute turds like the AWL series for (yuk) e-suvs. In that case, sacrificing image can't...

I often pondered this, but then they go ahead and release absolute turds like the AWL series for (yuk) e-suvs. In that case, sacrificing image can't be all that important to them, all for a segment that probably doesn't notice who makes anything on their bike.

 

FOX 34 AWL | 27.5 - 120mm

Love the phrasing but hard disagree on the last point, in the interior of BC people notice FOX because... interior BC. Marzocci simply wouldn't cut it. 

1
1
Eae903
Posts
348
Joined
10/20/2023
Location
Laramie, WY US
11/14/2024 10:19am
bikelurker wrote:

Mini-mullet should be a thing already, what's holding freeride from coming back?

Government land management

6
metadave
Posts
1242
Joined
2/15/2016
Location
Revelstoke, BC CA
11/14/2024 10:27am Edited Date/Time 11/14/2024 10:28am
bikelurker wrote:
I get your point about freeride guys, thank you very much. But then (and I'm sorry if I end up derailling the thread) What is going...

I get your point about freeride guys, thank you very much. But then (and I'm sorry if I end up derailling the thread) What is going on with the way Fox is positioning Marzochi? Now that they "downgraded" the Z1 to rail damper and finally have a pair of oem options to offer even bellow the fox rhythm lineup... The other two options they have, the more premium ones, are the 58, that its been only available in 27.5 since the begining, and the new super z, wich oposing to some opinions here, has been released in both 27.5 and 29 (I am assuming there are some substantial differences between this and a 38, as the later one tops out at 180mm and the new one goes 10mm further)

I mean, fork availability is key if you want to design that certain type of bike, I know brands keep legacy components in the market, so old bikes can still be serviced an kept running but... Thats a new, my2025 fork, so?

I cant wrap my head around this, the same about those new 26" conti enduro tyres... Of course you can get minions in that size, they have been available since forever... But wasn't 26" dead? Maybe i am just looking at it from a wrong point of view...

I have a project brewing for next summer that's a mini mullet park bike and honestly I've been surprised at the fact I can have matching modern Conti tires and matching 27.5/26" rims at this point that can handle bike park riding. Basically, I haven't had to go down any rabbit holes to find good stuff that can handle me, a 200lb, poor line choice hack riding in a bike park and even working in shops, I'm blown away by that considering it was like pulling teeth the last 5-6 years. 

6
Onawalk
Posts
344
Joined
7/5/2021
Location
CA
11/14/2024 2:20pm

I'm sure most of you have seen this,

but this seems really interesting to me, 

An "elastic" pawl system that could be both high engagement, but also provide some elasticity in the system to "quiet" chain movement, Which I think is what most people feel as "pedal kickback"

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/lauf-are-working-on-a-wild-freehub-with-s…

1
Whattheheel
Posts
192
Joined
6/11/2014
Location
Spearfish, SD US
11/14/2024 2:24pm Edited Date/Time 11/14/2024 2:25pm

Jonkranked posted about it one page ago and didn’t link people to the competitor’s website. 

5
1
Onawalk
Posts
344
Joined
7/5/2021
Location
CA
11/14/2024 2:24pm

Lauf hub mechanism,

Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!

Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire in the world"

p5pb27492784

 

p5pb27492805

 

p5pb27492785.jpg?VersionId=Fmtvjy1CZcqbGBJsxdzRjIfqbrIPP08
1
Onawalk
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344
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Location
CA
11/14/2024 2:27pm

Jonkranked posted about it one page ago and didn’t link people to the competitor’s website. 

Completly missed it,

my bad @jonkranked, good find.  Thats a really interesting freehub design

Whattheheel
Posts
192
Joined
6/11/2014
Location
Spearfish, SD US
11/14/2024 3:01pm

I wasn’t trying to be a Richard in my post I can’t tell if it comes across that way. My B. 

1
Onawalk
Posts
344
Joined
7/5/2021
Location
CA
11/14/2024 3:09pm

I wasn’t trying to be a Richard in my post I can’t tell if it comes across that way. My B. 

All good,

As a side note, he did link to a competitors website (Bike Rumour) which is where PB prolly robbed it from.  Bike rumours page has much more info, and more detailed pics/drawings.  

So @jonkranked, appreciate you posting it, and @Whattheheel appreciate you pointing out a better source,

 

Who's Richard......wait, wait........I think i got it,      Love it

5
dolface
Posts
1657
Joined
10/26/2015
Location
CA US
11/14/2024 4:23pm
Onawalk wrote:
Lauf hub mechanism,Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire...

Lauf hub mechanism,

Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!

Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire in the world"

p5pb27492784

 

p5pb27492805

 

p5pb27492785.jpg?VersionId=Fmtvjy1CZcqbGBJsxdzRjIfqbrIPP08

Would that be @WheelBased?

4
Onawalk
Posts
344
Joined
7/5/2021
Location
CA
11/14/2024 4:37pm
Onawalk wrote:
Lauf hub mechanism,Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire...

Lauf hub mechanism,

Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!

Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire in the world"

p5pb27492784

 

p5pb27492805

 

p5pb27492785.jpg?VersionId=Fmtvjy1CZcqbGBJsxdzRjIfqbrIPP08
dolface wrote:

Would that be @WheelBased?

Absolutely correct,

Thank You

Went and took a quick look, didnt see anything on their IG about it.  So maybe straight from Lauf, or Tyler at Bike Rumour.

Surprisingly, the comments on BR, and pretty negative, which is a bummer to me.  Negative comments about an actual product, that failing in the market, I can understand.  $hitty comments about an idea or innovation that appears to be in R&D phase at best, those kinda suck.  

I like cool things, and sometimes just cause their cool.  

3
Jotegr
Posts
339
Joined
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Location
Interior, BC CA
11/14/2024 5:01pm Edited Date/Time 11/14/2024 5:03pm
Onawalk wrote:
I'm sure most of you have seen this,but this seems really interesting to me, An "elastic" pawl system that could be both high engagement, but also provide...

I'm sure most of you have seen this,

but this seems really interesting to me, 

An "elastic" pawl system that could be both high engagement, but also provide some elasticity in the system to "quiet" chain movement, Which I think is what most people feel as "pedal kickback"

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/lauf-are-working-on-a-wild-freehub-with-s…

Sorry, you may only refer to that website as "the other website" around here. Know the rules. However, "self proclaimed biggest mtb media empire in the world" is an acceptable alternative. Good correction.

1
5
ballz
Posts
465
Joined
7/30/2024
Location
Ouagadougou EH
11/14/2024 5:20pm

That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.


11
TannerVal
Posts
128
Joined
2/6/2016
Location
Hampton, NH US
11/14/2024 6:07pm
IMG 3595
7
dolface
Posts
1657
Joined
10/26/2015
Location
CA US
11/14/2024 6:09pm
TannerVal wrote:
IMG 3595

LBS told me their Conti rep said the OEM ones are already out there but not to expect after-market versions in the shop until spring...

2
Eae903
Posts
348
Joined
10/20/2023
Location
Laramie, WY US
11/14/2024 8:51pm
Onawalk wrote:
Lauf hub mechanism,Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire...

Lauf hub mechanism,

Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!

Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire in the world"

p5pb27492784

 

p5pb27492805

 

p5pb27492785.jpg?VersionId=Fmtvjy1CZcqbGBJsxdzRjIfqbrIPP08

To upset the guy from earlier, I don't see how this is a beneficial innovation. It is novel for sure, using 1 piece pawls/springs under tension to create "ramped" engagement, but I've never felt like I needed my engagement to be anything more than binary. I would expect this design to feel spongy, kind of like original Onyx sprag clutch hubs but without the benefit of having instant engagement, and I don't think this design would lead to the lower amounts of wear on the other drivetrain components and frame like was mentioned in the other articles. Still, hope they're able to make a functioning prototype if one doesn't exist already and I would try it out if I had the opportunity. 

2
sprungmass
Posts
236
Joined
3/1/2023
Location
Calgary, AB CA
11/14/2024 9:39pm
TannerVal wrote:
IMG 3595
dolface wrote:

LBS told me their Conti rep said the OEM ones are already out there but not to expect after-market versions in the shop until spring...

There have been reports of people ordering these OEM tires directly from YT. Hoping there is a less convoluted way to getting them by next season. I really don't need a DH casing tire up front.

3
metadave
Posts
1242
Joined
2/15/2016
Location
Revelstoke, BC CA
11/14/2024 11:50pm
TannerVal wrote:
IMG 3595
dolface wrote:

LBS told me their Conti rep said the OEM ones are already out there but not to expect after-market versions in the shop until spring...

sprungmass wrote:
There have been reports of people ordering these OEM tires directly from YT. Hoping there is a less convoluted way to getting them by next season...

There have been reports of people ordering these OEM tires directly from YT. Hoping there is a less convoluted way to getting them by next season. I really don't need a DH casing tire up front.

But they're sooooo nice to have where we ride 😂

2
11/15/2024 12:44am Edited Date/Time 11/15/2024 12:45am
ballz wrote:
That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.

That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.


Or this one 

 

2
AgrAde
Posts
196
Joined
5/21/2015
Location
AL US
11/15/2024 1:41am Edited Date/Time 11/15/2024 1:42am

Front freewheels are great aside from all the drag, and your entire drivetrain and rear wheel exploding as soon as your chain comes off or anything gets caught in your derailleur at speed.

4
Cheesus
Posts
2
Joined
7/31/2023
Location
Liberec CZ
11/15/2024 2:17am

Hey guys, I came across this shop that is selling new norco range vlt which is not on the official store, it has less travel 170/160 and vertical shock. In the specification there is electric shimano XT Di2 RD-M8250 12 speed, which i did not see anywhere except one page that is not accesible but on google says that this derailleur is 200 euros. 

That page is in Czech

I apologize if somebody posted about this already.norco vlt.png?VersionId=8pg DsG3dFPf3ovojR7lbsKhw7norco vlt3.png?VersionId=T2

20
jofish
Posts
262
Joined
8/24/2009
Location
GB
11/15/2024 2:44am
I often pondered this, but then they go ahead and release absolute turds like the AWL series for (yuk) e-suvs. In that case, sacrificing image can't...

I often pondered this, but then they go ahead and release absolute turds like the AWL series for (yuk) e-suvs. In that case, sacrificing image can't be all that important to them, all for a segment that probably doesn't notice who makes anything on their bike.

 

FOX 34 AWL | 27.5 - 120mm

This is basically a different category though. Turd product for real mountain bikers but this is for the retired $10k+ e-bike trekkers who want suspension for comfort. Those bikes are high end in their own lane so the fox branding makes sense.

8
austin-NC
Posts
104
Joined
12/22/2022
Location
Lincolnton , NC US
11/15/2024 5:08am
Onawalk wrote:
Lauf hub mechanism,Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire...

Lauf hub mechanism,

Pics prolly courtesy of that chap that reviews patent application (name escapes me) but hes great!

Pinched from the self proclaimed "biggest mtb media empire in the world"

p5pb27492784

 

p5pb27492805

 

p5pb27492785.jpg?VersionId=Fmtvjy1CZcqbGBJsxdzRjIfqbrIPP08
Eae903 wrote:
To upset the guy from earlier, I don't see how this is a beneficial innovation. It is novel for sure, using 1 piece pawls/springs under tension...

To upset the guy from earlier, I don't see how this is a beneficial innovation. It is novel for sure, using 1 piece pawls/springs under tension to create "ramped" engagement, but I've never felt like I needed my engagement to be anything more than binary. I would expect this design to feel spongy, kind of like original Onyx sprag clutch hubs but without the benefit of having instant engagement, and I don't think this design would lead to the lower amounts of wear on the other drivetrain components and frame like was mentioned in the other articles. Still, hope they're able to make a functioning prototype if one doesn't exist already and I would try it out if I had the opportunity. 

Yeah its just a lot of complication and I'm sure cost that's just unnecessary. Seems like we have hopefully moved away from the engagement wars from a few years ago. Everyone was racing to see who could have the highest engagement hubs and in reality on the trails after 36 or so POE its hardly noticeable. 

4
11/15/2024 5:35am
ballz wrote:
That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.

That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.


No riding for me this weekend, my new spokes didn't come in so I can't lace up a set of fresh cranks. 

12
dwhere
Posts
187
Joined
10/5/2023
Location
dirty, DE US
11/15/2024 6:11am
ballz wrote:
That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.

That Lauf freehub would go great together with these cranks.


the original O-chain

1
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