Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to differentiate the Vala from their other bikes.
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to...
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to differentiate the Vala from their other bikes.
Not pedantic but easily explained with a quick google search. Easiest thing to distinguish 4bar/horst link is the pivot near the rear axle. Their new ebike has it, all the VPP bikes do not.
Not sure if this was caught by anyone else, but Open might have just leaked some details on a new Shimano derailleur while promoting a new...
Not sure if this was caught by anyone else, but Open might have just leaked some details on a new Shimano derailleur while promoting a new gravel frame of theirs?
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to...
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to differentiate the Vala from their other bikes.
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to...
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to differentiate the Vala from their other bikes.
Not pedantic but easily explained with a quick google search. Easiest thing to distinguish 4bar/horst link is the pivot near the rear axle. Their new ebike...
Not pedantic but easily explained with a quick google search. Easiest thing to distinguish 4bar/horst link is the pivot near the rear axle. Their new ebike has it, all the VPP bikes do not.
Horst link is one of the variants of a 4 bar design.
Not sure if this was caught by anyone else, but Open might have just leaked some details on a new Shimano derailleur while promoting a new...
Not sure if this was caught by anyone else, but Open might have just leaked some details on a new Shimano derailleur while promoting a new gravel frame of theirs?
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to...
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to differentiate the Vala from their other bikes.
Not pedantic but easily explained with a quick google search. Easiest thing to distinguish 4bar/horst link is the pivot near the rear axle. Their new ebike...
Not pedantic but easily explained with a quick google search. Easiest thing to distinguish 4bar/horst link is the pivot near the rear axle. Their new ebike has it, all the VPP bikes do not.
None of these bosch bikes are that exciting to me right now, the Vala being in direct competition with the Rise LT and AMflow is kinda nuts considering how poorly it compares on paper (obviously SC will have a major win in build quality and customer service).
The crestline S180 is dreamy, but well outside of my budget, I have put 2-3 frames in the landfill over the last 10 years, so a 10k bike seems like a bad idea.
French brand moustache will announce their concept this week, look like they rotated the motor and slid the battery almost below the motor, similar idea to the lapierre GLP aiming to centralise the weight as much as possible. Orbea are rumoured to release a 170/170 wild, but unclear which battery it will fit.
Also isn't this the second time Bosch have announed their motor and partner frames, but then refused to show the frame mounted display, I find this 100% insane, just show us a render or a plastic mockup if you don't have it ready, why hide it? It's going to be small screen with power mode and battery level, what exactly do you think we are missing here?
If only the AMflow was a 160+ rear travel bike with a non-trunnion shock the decision would be so easy!
Not sure if this was caught by anyone else, but Open might have just leaked some details on a new Shimano derailleur while promoting a new...
Not sure if this was caught by anyone else, but Open might have just leaked some details on a new Shimano derailleur while promoting a new gravel frame of theirs?
Given UDH is an open standard and becoming industry wide it would make sense for Shimano to utilize it............so of course they won't do it.
If the frame is UDH and also compatible with new Shimano derailleur, likely the frame standard is the same and the Shimano mount bolt (T-Type for SRAM) will be different.
2025 Rail is up on Trek EU websites with all builds & prices, but the bike is still not released or shown anywhere else (no US/CAN...
2025 Rail is up on Trek EU websites with all builds & prices, but the bike is still not released or shown anywhere else (no US/CAN prices/builds or review out).
This might be the most unexciting bike I've seen in ages
Removable battery at least! Idk if I'd ever own a Trek other than my old Trek 8000 SL but I really like how they've stayed committed to removable batteries. I didn't even realize the Fuel Ex-E had a removable battery until recently, which makes total sense for a tiny 360wh unit.
Given UDH is an open standard and becoming industry wide it would make sense for Shimano to utilize it............so of course they won't do it.
Not quite an open standard. SRAM will grant you a license, at no cost, if you apply (I've done it). But it isn't open, and there's nothing saying they have to grant said license. When you apply, you interface with the SRAM legal team. I wouldn't be surprised if they're doing everything they can to make things challenging for Shimano, it's what big brands do to each other.
Not quite an open standard. SRAM will grant you a license, at no cost, if you apply (I've done it). But it isn't open, and there's...
Not quite an open standard. SRAM will grant you a license, at no cost, if you apply (I've done it). But it isn't open, and there's nothing saying they have to grant said license. When you apply, you interface with the SRAM legal team. I wouldn't be surprised if they're doing everything they can to make things challenging for Shimano, it's what big brands do to each other.
Isn’t the license for the frame manufacturer? Assuming that’s the case, anyone can build a derailleur to mount to those frame specs. Or am I missing something?
Not quite an open standard. SRAM will grant you a license, at no cost, if you apply (I've done it). But it isn't open, and there's...
Not quite an open standard. SRAM will grant you a license, at no cost, if you apply (I've done it). But it isn't open, and there's nothing saying they have to grant said license. When you apply, you interface with the SRAM legal team. I wouldn't be surprised if they're doing everything they can to make things challenging for Shimano, it's what big brands do to each other.
Yeppers, same as when ISIS was a thing. I'll wager there's probably a bit of IP swapping happening in the background as well since SRAM were particular in their patent for their derailleurs.
2025 Rail is up on Trek EU websites with all builds & prices, but the bike is still not released or shown anywhere else (no US/CAN...
2025 Rail is up on Trek EU websites with all builds & prices, but the bike is still not released or shown anywhere else (no US/CAN prices/builds or review out).
Why does the Rail+ look like something old people would ride on the bike path next to a river on a sunny weekend dayalso can we...
Why does the Rail+ look like something old people would ride on the bike path next to a river on a sunny weekend day
also can we please call Horst link bikes „crab link“ from now on it is fantastic
Sounds like you work in a Trek dealer.
It looks like it, because it is. It's a comfort tourer for oldies that equate suspension to comfort. They get loaded up with kickstands (in the provided mounting holes), mirrors, smartphone holders and Ergon wing grips.
Sounds like you work in a Trek dealer.It looks like it, because it is. It's a comfort tourer for oldies that equate suspension to comfort. They...
Sounds like you work in a Trek dealer.
It looks like it, because it is. It's a comfort tourer for oldies that equate suspension to comfort. They get loaded up with kickstands (in the provided mounting holes), mirrors, smartphone holders and Ergon wing grips.
They ride like a pig and have done since gen1.
How come when I say this I get shit 😂 well said tho
Bought by people who want tyres that are really knobbly and fast on road.And have 'gel' saddle covers.
Does someone know which fork was Dario Lilio riding this weekend in Lake Placid?
Black fox, i presume a 34 - with a new arch design.
BikeYoke did a limited edition dropper with a silver lower tube, now PNW has taken it up a notch with a silver stanchion as well:
https://www.pnwcomponents.com/collections/ltd-dropper-posts/products/th…
Why does the Rail+ look like something old people would ride on the bike path next to a river on a sunny weekend day
also can we please call Horst link bikes „crab link“ from now on it is fantastic
Apologies if this is pedantic or already discussed. Is VPP not also a 4 bar suspension design? Confused why Santa Cruz is using that terminology to differentiate the Vala from their other bikes.
Not pedantic but easily explained with a quick google search. Easiest thing to distinguish 4bar/horst link is the pivot near the rear axle. Their new ebike has it, all the VPP bikes do not.
Oh good, ANOTHER "standard"... 🙄
It is.
Horst link is one of the variants of a 4 bar design.
The first bullet says it’s a UDH frame, so whatever Shimano is doing is compatible with that standard.
Good job, and the ebike in question is a horst link
None of these bosch bikes are that exciting to me right now, the Vala being in direct competition with the Rise LT and AMflow is kinda nuts considering how poorly it compares on paper (obviously SC will have a major win in build quality and customer service).
The crestline S180 is dreamy, but well outside of my budget, I have put 2-3 frames in the landfill over the last 10 years, so a 10k bike seems like a bad idea.
French brand moustache will announce their concept this week, look like they rotated the motor and slid the battery almost below the motor, similar idea to the lapierre GLP aiming to centralise the weight as much as possible. Orbea are rumoured to release a 170/170 wild, but unclear which battery it will fit.
Also isn't this the second time Bosch have announed their motor and partner frames, but then refused to show the frame mounted display, I find this 100% insane, just show us a render or a plastic mockup if you don't have it ready, why hide it? It's going to be small screen with power mode and battery level, what exactly do you think we are missing here?
If only the AMflow was a 160+ rear travel bike with a non-trunnion shock the decision would be so easy!
Given UDH is an open standard and becoming industry wide it would make sense for Shimano to utilize it............so of course they won't do it.
If the frame is UDH and also compatible with new Shimano derailleur, likely the frame standard is the same and the Shimano mount bolt (T-Type for SRAM) will be different.
This has to be a typo right? Aren't most people on size L (M on some brans now) which is 470-480 reach??
Removable battery at least! Idk if I'd ever own a Trek other than my old Trek 8000 SL but I really like how they've stayed committed to removable batteries. I didn't even realize the Fuel Ex-E had a removable battery until recently, which makes total sense for a tiny 360wh unit.
I'd argue the Vala is slightly more unexciting.
It makes no sense, especially as S->M is +2cm, M->L is +4cm, but L to XL is 2.5cm.
The only question mark is their headset cups, they could allow reach adjust, they only briefly mention them adjusting head angle.
Hate to post a link to the other site, but its the only reference I could find - could well be Shimano's own direct mount...
https://www.pinkbike.com/news/shimano-patent-shows-direct-mount-electro…
Not quite an open standard. SRAM will grant you a license, at no cost, if you apply (I've done it). But it isn't open, and there's nothing saying they have to grant said license. When you apply, you interface with the SRAM legal team. I wouldn't be surprised if they're doing everything they can to make things challenging for Shimano, it's what big brands do to each other.
Isn’t the license for the frame manufacturer? Assuming that’s the case, anyone can build a derailleur to mount to those frame specs. Or am I missing something?
FFS, it's just a hole!
One of my favorite comments in a while 😂 Horst link = crab
Also, @cantstop you best be getting that crab-link trademark buttoned up...
Yeppers, same as when ISIS was a thing. I'll wager there's probably a bit of IP swapping happening in the background as well since SRAM were particular in their patent for their derailleurs.
It's not the first time the Rail is getting some negative feedback for weird sizing/geo.
The L is more XL and their XL is XXL so you're right that they're not offering any size large...not sure how they can mess that up in 2024.
Santa Cruz Vala sizing is much better as a reference.
Anyway, what kind of product launch is this from Trek ? Bike kind of soft launched in Europe only.
Sounds like you work in a Trek dealer.
It looks like it, because it is. It's a comfort tourer for oldies that equate suspension to comfort. They get loaded up with kickstands (in the provided mounting holes), mirrors, smartphone holders and Ergon wing grips.
They ride like a pig and have done since gen1.
This could be the start of a new thread....
New Orbea ebike
How come when I say this I get shit 😂 well said tho
new kona hei hei mid 2025