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Sixfinity is the number of zeros in the price tag right?

Had to say it.

As though the the gearbox wasn't also invented in the 1800s... Feel free to hate the lightest, simplest, most serviceable, most efficient method of changing gears on a bicycle that humanity has invented so far, but the rest of us will accept derailleurs where they make sense.

Yeti Sixfinity enduro bike from la thuile pits here - https://www.vitalmtb.com/forums/hub/yeti-sixfinity-enduro-bike-spotted-… (in its own thread as to not disturb efficiency discussions : )

Much love! I'm just stoked to be part of a brand (Vital) that I grew up being such a fan of. We might be small, but I love what we stand for and everyone out there who connects with it.

Because they consume 2+ % more of your wattage, and that only gets worse the worse your chain maintenance gets! In addition, the idler produces more noise and potentially a rougher feel when pedaling, which can create a greater than 2% change in a subjective sense. Those losses are from chain link articulation on the highly tensioned top run of the chain: https://www.pinkbike.com/news/tested-how-much-slower-are-idler-bikes-wh… If you find evidence that electronic suspension will provide 2% gains, then it could offset the idler losses, when compared to a non idler/non electronic suspension bike, but you would still be 2% behind a non idler...

I typically use the climb switch once per ride. I like to turn it on halfway up the climb when I remember I have it and might as well use it. I tend to turn it off halfway down the descent when I’m puzzling over why my suspension isn’t working. I suspect I am not in the minority.

Electronic suspension is just an automatic lockout. The convo should be "does a lockout benefit idler equipped bikes" As has been said before, lockouts, whether manual or electronically activated, don't offer unique benefits to idler equipped bikes. Think of a hard tail with an idler- it would still pedal noticeably less efficient than a regular hard tail because of chain drag. Nothing to do with rear suspension.

Losses from bearings are extremely minimal and not noticeable. ~0.1w. The losses in an idler bike are coming from forcing the chain to articulate under tension. Most mtb riders probably have somewhere between 5-10+% loss from the drivetrain (chain). Those losses come from making the chain articulate under load via internal chain friction. Forcing that extra loaded articulation I would expect losses to increase by 30-50%. So your typical dirty oiled mtb chain goes from losing 20w to 30w at 200w chill pedaling load and only gets worse from there. 5w increases are generally considered noticeable. The only thing you...

The reason flight attendant has a huge uptake in XC is because SRAM sponsored teams are required to run it. I know four different world cup athletes and they have all said they would just prefer a manual lockout. When it works properly it's alright but it's heavy and frequently has connectivity problems between all the components. It seems more casual users like it with one less thing to think about while riding and the weight doesn't matter to a more casual rider. As for trail/enduro bikes, ever wonder why every single SRAM EWS athlete stopped riding LYRIK and started...

Yes, but I think other people in this thread have clearly explained why those efficiencies don't offer any unique benefits to high pivot, gearbox, or idler-based designs. Yes, electronics would make high pivot, gearbox, and idler-based bikes more efficient, but at the same time they'd be making all the other bikes more efficient, too. If Dave has four apples and Lisa has six apples, and you give them both four apples, Lisa still has more apples than Dave. Now, I guess if you're saying that electronic lockouts give them both the equivalent of 100 additional apples, then I would concede...

Wait… does no one ever standup when climbing their bikes? Maybe thats why I like lockout so much.

That's generally very fair, but the larger Pedro's torque wrench has a drive tang that pushes through the head, so the increased cost to have it work both directions is very minimal. I bought one a few years ago, and it was nice to stop guessing (or at least get a feel for the right amount of torque) for things above 20Nm.

Thanks to this thread I have learned that torque wrenches don’t work anti-clockwise… but I was able to find a workaround when installing a new UDH this afternoon.