It’s a hydraulic bottom out. The new Zeb has its too.
You will see in a few weeks.
No, this particular thing looks to be related to the air spring side of the system, not damping. "Linear XL" same name for their new larger air cans to make shocks more linear. This looks to be a fully integrated Seccus. We will also likely see the HBO or tunable bottom out bumpers in conjunction with this as the method for preventing harsh bottoms.
they really need to take a look at their carbon layup. the phoenix is i think the lightest current DH bike out there despite that complex...
they really need to take a look at their carbon layup. the phoenix is i think the lightest current DH bike out there despite that complex suspension layout with 2 chains and chainrings. maybe a bit too close to the edge construction wise.
The frame is LIGHT. Just over 37 lbs complete for mine. Same parts except for the cranks on a Supreme were just under 43 lbs.
they really need to take a look at their carbon layup. the phoenix is i think the lightest current DH bike out there despite that complex...
they really need to take a look at their carbon layup. the phoenix is i think the lightest current DH bike out there despite that complex suspension layout with 2 chains and chainrings. maybe a bit too close to the edge construction wise.
Looking at the failures, it's past the edge. All she did was go nose heavy off a drop and it snapped way worse than those GTs people have been riding into trees at speed. Pretty sure Devinci just recalled a bunch of bikes for something similar
they really need to take a look at their carbon layup. the phoenix is i think the lightest current DH bike out there despite that complex...
they really need to take a look at their carbon layup. the phoenix is i think the lightest current DH bike out there despite that complex suspension layout with 2 chains and chainrings. maybe a bit too close to the edge construction wise.
Looking at the failures, it's past the edge. All she did was go nose heavy off a drop and it snapped way worse than those GTs...
Looking at the failures, it's past the edge. All she did was go nose heavy off a drop and it snapped way worse than those GTs people have been riding into trees at speed. Pretty sure Devinci just recalled a bunch of bikes for something similar
Not sure it’s related, but I just saw a pic of Pivot team running a new firmer compression tune in the shock, CL130. They could be searching for more support to prevent bottom out events that stress the frame, without increasing spring further.
Definitely a lack of information to say what may have caused that failure.. To simply say the rider wasn't very heavy leaves a lot to be...
Definitely a lack of information to say what may have caused that failure.. To simply say the rider wasn't very heavy leaves a lot to be answered about events leading up to this..
I will say that where it broke is interesting and makes me think potential defect, but you can't really tell enough from those pics..
Quote from Nicolas: "My guess is that its either a manufacturing defect or the frame was previously crashed and weakened at the downtube."
Leogangbikeclub comments and says that the little girl is about 50kg, while no doubt she shreds, it feels like the bike should be able to take...
Leogangbikeclub comments and says that the little girl is about 50kg, while no doubt she shreds, it feels like the bike should be able to take that abuse.
Some more pics borrowed from instagram
Not that this couldn’t happen on an alloy frame, but getting stabbed by that shredded carbon tube has to be a worst case scenario.
No surprises here, the front fell off again. I hope she's okay!! Pivot needs to acknowledge these faults and start putting reinforcing material in all those...
No surprises here, the front fell off again. I hope she's okay!! Pivot needs to acknowledge these faults and start putting reinforcing material in all those weak spots, and probably do a recall too.
I don't know if the production bikes use metal or carbon "lugs" still but thats broken exactly along the lines of where the lugs were on the prototype bike.
It definitely irks me this type of failure - you don't need to make production bikes that light and you are really risking your customers by not simply beefing them up a little bit or doing more/better testing.
There has been far too many public breakages of these to be a coincidence and Pivot just haven't acknowledged that there is either a flaw in the design or their particular manufacturing process. Not sure if its sunk cost fallacy or something else but they need to deal with this fast. I just don't hear of breakages like this from any other brand - sure bikes break but never in the ways that the phoenix does
I don't know if the production bikes use metal or carbon "lugs" still but thats broken exactly along the lines of where the lugs were on...
I don't know if the production bikes use metal or carbon "lugs" still but thats broken exactly along the lines of where the lugs were on the prototype bike.
It definitely irks me this type of failure - you don't need to make production bikes that light and you are really risking your customers by not simply beefing them up a little bit or doing more/better testing.
There has been far too many public breakages of these to be a coincidence and Pivot just haven't acknowledged that there is either a flaw in the design or their particular manufacturing process. Not sure if its sunk cost fallacy or something else but they need to deal with this fast. I just don't hear of breakages like this from any other brand - sure bikes break but never in the ways that the phoenix does
It'll only get worse from here if they don't acknowledge it publicly. We might be seeing them in the next edition of Jeff Brines' "will brands go bust" thread if they dont rub their braincells together.
No surprises here, the front fell off again. I hope she's okay!! Pivot needs to acknowledge these faults and start putting reinforcing material in all those...
No surprises here, the front fell off again. I hope she's okay!! Pivot needs to acknowledge these faults and start putting reinforcing material in all those weak spots, and probably do a recall too.
No surprises here, the front fell off again. I hope she's okay!! Pivot needs to acknowledge these faults and start putting reinforcing material in all those...
No surprises here, the front fell off again. I hope she's okay!! Pivot needs to acknowledge these faults and start putting reinforcing material in all those weak spots, and probably do a recall too.
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event and this one..
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event...
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event and this one..
I'm not keeping a spreadsheet or anything but I think I've seen about 4 or 5 now.
I'm not keeping a spreadsheet or anything but I think I've seen about 4 or 5 now.
Do you recall if they all seem to have broken in a similar fashion to the one posted here? If I see 4 or 5 broken the same way, that's enough to call it a pattern..
Do you recall if they all seem to have broken in a similar fashion to the one posted here? If I see 4 or 5 broken...
Do you recall if they all seem to have broken in a similar fashion to the one posted here? If I see 4 or 5 broken the same way, that's enough to call it a pattern..
I know a few forks have negative air volume spacer but most of the time they are not meant to be switched around (ohlins, Fox 34SC)...
I know a few forks have negative air volume spacer but most of the time they are not meant to be switched around (ohlins, Fox 34SC) so this would the first fork to have adjustable negative air spring volume spacer ? And it would make sense that only the Zeb and Boxxer get this as their overall air spring volume is much bigger than the Sid/Pike/Lyrik.
The EXT Vaia uses volume spacers in the negative chamber. Ultra adjustable!
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event...
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event and this one..
BK had a broken seat stay with the production bike. Our rental shop Phoenix had a broken seat stay.
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event...
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event and this one..
The new demo has me a little confused. Is the new drivetrain that they are using specifically just to mitigate kickback? I was looking at it wondering if this is going to be a bike designed for those who want to put in an aftermarket gearbox in the future. They just replace the whole… box? Thing? When this originally came out I didnt pay it much attention since it seemed every week it was being changed drastically anyways.
The new demo has me a little confused. Is the new drivetrain that they are using specifically just to mitigate kickback? I was looking at it...
The new demo has me a little confused. Is the new drivetrain that they are using specifically just to mitigate kickback? I was looking at it wondering if this is going to be a bike designed for those who want to put in an aftermarket gearbox in the future. They just replace the whole… box? Thing? When this originally came out I didnt pay it much attention since it seemed every week it was being changed drastically anyways.
The old one had a lower pivot, which performed well enough, but it seemed like Specialized were concerned about it being too low down and at risk of being scuffed or bashed on rocks. When they moved the linkage out of the way, it changed the pedalling characteristics a heck of a lot, and not for the better. So either they could have made it with an idler that doesn't let the chain wrap around the chain ring for more than 8 or so teeth, or they go for the 2 chain route. IMO the chain system is a packaging compromise to fit the linkage they want in a way that isn't at risk of breaking on rocks etc.
Do you recall if they all seem to have broken in a similar fashion to the one posted here? If I see 4 or 5 broken...
Do you recall if they all seem to have broken in a similar fashion to the one posted here? If I see 4 or 5 broken the same way, that's enough to call it a pattern..
There was one posted here from a DHSE race at Ride Rock Creek that broke in the same way this one did.
Kate Courtney is in Brazil already, posted a ride 31/3 with a pic of what I guess is her regular BC40 with red SIDs. Yesterday 1/4 posted...
Kate Courtney is in Brazil already, posted a ride 31/3 with a pic of what I guess is her regular BC40 with red SIDs. Yesterday 1/4 posted a ride called new bike day, she’s Called the bike BC40 sparkle, can only see that it’s got purple-ish forks; and has otherwise kept the bike hidden. Possibly new, possibly just a custom paint job, possibly new rockshox stuff about to be revealed?
It could be a new bike; she posted a pic from Allied HQ w/ a frame in the stand that was blacked out but you could...
It could be a new bike; she posted a pic from Allied HQ w/ a frame in the stand that was blacked out but you could see a chainstay pivot and afaik Allied doesn't have a crab-link bike.
My guess is just new paint on a BC40 though...
Couldn’t find if anyone has posted about this since. But looks like a new Allied trail or enduro bike? Given the BC40 is 120mm I’d bet over 160mm. Ridden by Anna Yamagucci (sp?) at Trans Cascadia. I just hope they keep that raw linkage…
No, this particular thing looks to be related to the air spring side of the system, not damping. "Linear XL" same name for their new larger air cans to make shocks more linear. This looks to be a fully integrated Seccus. We will also likely see the HBO or tunable bottom out bumpers in conjunction with this as the method for preventing harsh bottoms.
The frame is LIGHT. Just over 37 lbs complete for mine. Same parts except for the cranks on a Supreme were just under 43 lbs.
Looking at the failures, it's past the edge. All she did was go nose heavy off a drop and it snapped way worse than those GTs people have been riding into trees at speed. Pretty sure Devinci just recalled a bunch of bikes for something similar
Not sure it’s related, but I just saw a pic of Pivot team running a new firmer compression tune in the shock, CL130. They could be searching for more support to prevent bottom out events that stress the frame, without increasing spring further.
Surely, we’ll be seeing this bike soon...
Chunky road ride: Chode Ride
When sustained for a longer duration it becomes a: Grundle Grind'r
Quote from Nicolas: "My guess is that its either a manufacturing defect or the frame was previously crashed and weakened at the downtube."
or third option: construction defect.
Not that this couldn’t happen on an alloy frame, but getting stabbed by that shredded carbon tube has to be a worst case scenario.
I don't know if the production bikes use metal or carbon "lugs" still but thats broken exactly along the lines of where the lugs were on the prototype bike.
It definitely irks me this type of failure - you don't need to make production bikes that light and you are really risking your customers by not simply beefing them up a little bit or doing more/better testing.
There has been far too many public breakages of these to be a coincidence and Pivot just haven't acknowledged that there is either a flaw in the design or their particular manufacturing process. Not sure if its sunk cost fallacy or something else but they need to deal with this fast. I just don't hear of breakages like this from any other brand - sure bikes break but never in the ways that the phoenix does
It'll only get worse from here if they don't acknowledge it publicly. We might be seeing them in the next edition of Jeff Brines' "will brands go bust" thread if they dont rub their braincells together.
It looks like that pivot snapped on the downtube first- in an area where you do get lots of rocks kicked up, so maybe it was damaged previously.
On the other hand- it’s the downtube of a downhill bike- probably should be overbuilt.
Edit- skip to 5 minutes:
https://youtu.be/w5eMMf11uhM?si=Ed0-cZSZaSZxbBcZ
This will forever be associated with Pivot.
With all due respect, outside of BK's prototype, how many have we seen broken? There were rumors about a production frame broke at a Hardline event and this one..
I'm not keeping a spreadsheet or anything but I think I've seen about 4 or 5 now.
Do you recall if they all seem to have broken in a similar fashion to the one posted here? If I see 4 or 5 broken the same way, that's enough to call it a pattern..
BK's snapped seat stay from Hardline. Video of it - https://www.youtube.com/shorts/PgKqMeKE_Xw
Vitalgrundle.com
The EXT Vaia uses volume spacers in the negative chamber. Ultra adjustable!
BK had a broken seat stay with the production bike.
Our rental shop Phoenix had a broken seat stay.
This one is a totally different location.
Yeah, those are all locations that definitely should not pivot.
I heard it's gotta go back to prototype phase, wasn't quite ready
Adding a third chain this time and maybe another shock but its just for the bottom bracket bash guard to compress.
An extra 1-2#'s of CF reinforcement on a DH bike just makes sense.
What am I looking at exactly here?!
Ride wrap announced they are sponsoring the team.
The new demo has me a little confused. Is the new drivetrain that they are using specifically just to mitigate kickback? I was looking at it wondering if this is going to be a bike designed for those who want to put in an aftermarket gearbox in the future. They just replace the whole… box? Thing? When this originally came out I didnt pay it much attention since it seemed every week it was being changed drastically anyways.
The old one had a lower pivot, which performed well enough, but it seemed like Specialized were concerned about it being too low down and at risk of being scuffed or bashed on rocks. When they moved the linkage out of the way, it changed the pedalling characteristics a heck of a lot, and not for the better. So either they could have made it with an idler that doesn't let the chain wrap around the chain ring for more than 8 or so teeth, or they go for the 2 chain route. IMO the chain system is a packaging compromise to fit the linkage they want in a way that isn't at risk of breaking on rocks etc.
There was one posted here from a DHSE race at Ride Rock Creek that broke in the same way this one did.
Couldn’t find if anyone has posted about this since. But looks like a new Allied trail or enduro bike? Given the BC40 is 120mm I’d bet over 160mm. Ridden by Anna Yamagucci (sp?) at Trans Cascadia. I just hope they keep that raw linkage…