I've got a Mondraker Crafty E bike with Shimano XT brakes (standard pads and 203 centre lock discs). After long steep descents at the weekend, the...
I've got a Mondraker Crafty E bike with Shimano XT brakes (standard pads and 203 centre lock discs). After long steep descents at the weekend, the brakes were cooked. Levers pulling closer to the bars and brake fade was more than present. What's the best solution to improve this (apart from braking less)?
Changing to an e-bike specific pad like the purple Galfers?
Changing to 220/223 discs and 2.0mm rotors rather than the 203mm 1.8mm ones?
Or a combination of both?
Fresh mineral oil in the brakes so that doesn't need changing. Thanks for any suggestions.
I run 220 and thick rotors with mtx gold pads - but any bigger, thicker rotor and more aggressive pads will help.
If you've cooked your brakes on the ride as described, I would flush your brakes with new fluid as well.
Purple pads have become extremely popular recently - they really are good. we run them with galfer wave rotors 2mm, often 223 upfront and 203 rear on XT brakes.
Purple pads have become extremely popular recently - they really are good.we run them with galfer wave rotors 2mm, often 223 upfront and 203 rear on...
Purple pads have become extremely popular recently - they really are good. we run them with galfer wave rotors 2mm, often 223 upfront and 203 rear on XT brakes.
The real answer is Mavens with hs2 rotors.
+ 1 on the mavens to be the one to rule them all. My set has been flawless and hasnt been touched and i dont even have to worry about aftermarket pads or different rotors as the whole package is pretty much perfect to me.
When i first got my new bike with mavens on i wasnt pleased at all. I have been on the dominion bandwagon for a long time. After ridding the mavens for a while now i must say i got used to them. I put the contact point almost all the way in wich made it easier to modulate the brakeforce (and not to perform a full on brake manouver when i just sligthly touch the lever). Depending on what i ride i switch betweem a bike with dominions and the new one with mavens. I feel like the hayes need considerable more fingerstrength to get them to brake powerful compared to the mavens.
I've got a Mondraker Crafty E bike with Shimano XT brakes (standard pads and 203 centre lock discs). After long steep descents at the weekend, the...
I've got a Mondraker Crafty E bike with Shimano XT brakes (standard pads and 203 centre lock discs). After long steep descents at the weekend, the brakes were cooked. Levers pulling closer to the bars and brake fade was more than present. What's the best solution to improve this (apart from braking less)?
Changing to an e-bike specific pad like the purple Galfers?
Changing to 220/223 discs and 2.0mm rotors rather than the 203mm 1.8mm ones?
Or a combination of both?
Fresh mineral oil in the brakes so that doesn't need changing. Thanks for any suggestions.
I run 220 and thick rotors with mtx gold pads - but any bigger, thicker rotor and more aggressive pads will help. If you've cooked your brakes...
I run 220 and thick rotors with mtx gold pads - but any bigger, thicker rotor and more aggressive pads will help.
If you've cooked your brakes on the ride as described, I would flush your brakes with new fluid as well.
I am a really big fan of MTX pads, I gave the reds a shot about a year ago. Compared to Shimano resin/metallic and TRP resin/semi metallic: -Bedded in so quickly and easily it was comical. -Never seemed to fade or falter regardless of heat/moisture -Bike sat for over 3 months during the winter, first ride out they felt like when parked (Have had issues with Shimano pads). They are just now at 1mm remaining with over 1,750km's/55,000m of descending on them. There might be more powerful pads available but they just work so damn well I am hard pressed to run anything else (other then maybe the golds).
I've got a Mondraker Crafty E bike with Shimano XT brakes (standard pads and 203 centre lock discs). After long steep descents at the weekend, the...
I've got a Mondraker Crafty E bike with Shimano XT brakes (standard pads and 203 centre lock discs). After long steep descents at the weekend, the brakes were cooked. Levers pulling closer to the bars and brake fade was more than present. What's the best solution to improve this (apart from braking less)?
Changing to an e-bike specific pad like the purple Galfers?
Changing to 220/223 discs and 2.0mm rotors rather than the 203mm 1.8mm ones?
Or a combination of both?
Fresh mineral oil in the brakes so that doesn't need changing. Thanks for any suggestions.
I am a really big fan of MTX pads, I gave the reds a shot about a year ago. Compared to Shimano resin/metallic and TRP resin/semi...
I am a really big fan of MTX pads, I gave the reds a shot about a year ago. Compared to Shimano resin/metallic and TRP resin/semi metallic: -Bedded in so quickly and easily it was comical. -Never seemed to fade or falter regardless of heat/moisture -Bike sat for over 3 months during the winter, first ride out they felt like when parked (Have had issues with Shimano pads). They are just now at 1mm remaining with over 1,750km's/55,000m of descending on them. There might be more powerful pads available but they just work so damn well I am hard pressed to run anything else (other then maybe the golds).
Been thinking about reds. Gold were a little finicky on setup.
Hmm, I think I found why… my lever syringe was still pulling a vacuum when I picked it up to put it away, so I don’t...
Hmm, I think I found why… my lever syringe was still pulling a vacuum when I picked it up to put it away, so I don’t think I let the system equalize when i unscrewed it.
Guess there’s tomorrow…
Alright, now I got the lever feeling rock hard which is awesome. Got the pistons moving synchronized so no uneven contact.
however now it has almost no power because of my rotors having been used with organic pads and I only have Code semi metallic pads (the bronze SRAM ones), even though I have cleaned the rotor, maybe I didn’t clean enough?
Did you run in the pads? Installing fresh pads (even on a rotor that's seen only metallic pads) gives no power at first but you can feel the power coming on during the first or second hard braking event when running them in.
Did you run in the pads? Installing fresh pads (even on a rotor that's seen only metallic pads) gives no power at first but you can...
Did you run in the pads? Installing fresh pads (even on a rotor that's seen only metallic pads) gives no power at first but you can feel the power coming on during the first or second hard braking event when running them in.
I had to grind these particular pads a little because the previous owner most definitely did not have the correct spacers on his caliper; these pads had that 2/3rds wear pattern where the top third was unused and they had developed a ridge. Plenty of material left on them, though.
I have 4 pairs of Sram bronze pads: 2 from my own Codes (replaced with TruckerCo golds currently on my enduro bike), 2 from the RSCs I purchased.
I just grabbed a random pair to install, and they happen to come from the brakes I bought. I would have had to flatten them in the future anyways to get rid of that ridge. I thoroughly wiped the rotor with isopropyl and microfiber. Should I rough-up the rotor? They are 8 years old and only ever saw organic pads.
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
i have had my eye on the mavens and from what I am hearing the new base model seems like the best balance of power and modulation. anyone have experience on both?
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
i have had my eye on the mavens and from what I am hearing the new base model seems like the best balance of power and...
i have had my eye on the mavens and from what I am hearing the new base model seems like the best balance of power and modulation. anyone have experience on both?
yes, get the Base, can often be found quite cheap online
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I went ahead and left them up front but moved to metal in the back. The combo works for me in how I ride and brake.
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I...
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I went ahead and left them up front but moved to metal in the back. The combo works for me in how I ride and brake.
One other thing I've noticed with the stock Maven pads is the sintered ones will squeak for a second or two after cooling down (in dry, dusty conditions) but shut up after that. This happens to me consistently after I first drop into a descent - the first 1 or 2 times I brake (especially lightly modulating on a traverse) they are noisy but quiet the rest of the descent. I don't have this happen with the organic pads.
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
@Jason_Schroeder What stood out to me was Dak saying that you have to work for the power on a Shimano brake when we have the reputation for having an on/off feel. One thing that's different about just about every pro bike is that they cheat out the pistons to get a super quick bite point. I don't remember specifically if the Mondraker mechanics said they were doing this but when I've polled teams in the past it was near 100%. Because the servo-wave is meant to quickly move through a lot of free stroke (relative to our super wide pad clearance) and then ramp up the power once the pads hit the rotor, when you cheat the pistons out the bite point will happen when the servo-wave is still in it's low power phase.
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of speed, but I do push for my age/skill/weight and Saint brakes (caliper and levers) are adequate for even 60+% grade sections with excellent modulation and power. With proper maintenance, they should last 10+ years and I have never really experienced the wandering bite point (keep them bled properly folks!).
I’ve been curious about the TRP, Mavens, even the Hayes, but to keep the muscle memory consistent, I’d need to put a new brake system on 4 bikes, which is expensive…
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of...
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of speed, but I do push for my age/skill/weight and Saint brakes (caliper and levers) are adequate for even 60+% grade sections with excellent modulation and power. With proper maintenance, they should last 10+ years and I have never really experienced the wandering bite point (keep them bled properly folks!).
I’ve been curious about the TRP, Mavens, even the Hayes, but to keep the muscle memory consistent, I’d need to put a new brake system on 4 bikes, which is expensive…
Consider yourself lucky, it's scarier than the fundamentalist Spaniards when it finally happens.
i have had my eye on the mavens and from what I am hearing the new base model seems like the best balance of power and...
i have had my eye on the mavens and from what I am hearing the new base model seems like the best balance of power and modulation. anyone have experience on both?
I just got the Maven Base to test for Vital, but nothing to report yet.
Consider yourself lucky, it's scarier than the fundamentalist Spaniards when it finally happens.
Consider yourself lucky, it's scarier than the fundamentalist Spaniards when it finally happens.
I have had several sets of Shimano brakes but only experienced on XT brakes. XTR and Saints have always been fine. Bled them the same way, do leaver bleeds frequently to make sure they feel good, never had that issue those specific models.
I am curious how/where Saints fall in a lineup of just power rating on all modern brakes. I always thought they were pretty good but I’m also not trying lots of new stuff.
They are powerful but not as powerful as the shigura. I'm wondering about the new shimano brakes. In the german forum they already made shiguras out of them. Any experiences with them here so far?
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of...
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of speed, but I do push for my age/skill/weight and Saint brakes (caliper and levers) are adequate for even 60+% grade sections with excellent modulation and power. With proper maintenance, they should last 10+ years and I have never really experienced the wandering bite point (keep them bled properly folks!).
I’ve been curious about the TRP, Mavens, even the Hayes, but to keep the muscle memory consistent, I’d need to put a new brake system on 4 bikes, which is expensive…
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I...
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I went ahead and left them up front but moved to metal in the back. The combo works for me in how I ride and brake.
One other thing I've noticed with the stock Maven pads is the sintered ones will squeak for a second or two after cooling down (in dry...
One other thing I've noticed with the stock Maven pads is the sintered ones will squeak for a second or two after cooling down (in dry, dusty conditions) but shut up after that. This happens to me consistently after I first drop into a descent - the first 1 or 2 times I brake (especially lightly modulating on a traverse) they are noisy but quiet the rest of the descent. I don't have this happen with the organic pads.
I have this exact same behavior under these exact same conditions with my Intend White Magic Pads.
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of...
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of speed, but I do push for my age/skill/weight and Saint brakes (caliper and levers) are adequate for even 60+% grade sections with excellent modulation and power. With proper maintenance, they should last 10+ years and I have never really experienced the wandering bite point (keep them bled properly folks!).
I’ve been curious about the TRP, Mavens, even the Hayes, but to keep the muscle memory consistent, I’d need to put a new brake system on 4 bikes, which is expensive…
Low hydraulic leverage combined with short levers = lower power. Attached is a chart that I put together calculating hydraulic leverage based on MC piston and caliper piston diameters. There are some obvious components missing from this, notably mechanical leverage that is a result of the cam geometry and lever length. But it overall follows what I have felt with the brakes that I have tried.
Personally, its been a long time since I've felt that Saints were top in the class, with the issues of Shimano's needing lever bleeds pretty regularly and the weird feel of the servo wave compared to other cam designs out now, its just not what it once was. When that design came out it was above the rest, but that was 2012, Avid just released the Elixers to replace the Juicys, both of which were utter garbage hence Saint being best in class (that was a pretty low bar.) At the end of the day, you can achieve good'enough power from any of the brakes out there, but the amount of force required at the lever is a whole 'nother story. TRP's, Saints, XT's, and my old MT7's take significantly more force at the lever than my A4's, Radic's or T4V4's to stop my 215lbs on a 40lb enduro bike when my confidence extends beyond my skill.
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
@Jason_Schroeder What stood out to me was Dak saying that you have to work for the power on a Shimano brake when we have the reputation...
@Jason_Schroeder What stood out to me was Dak saying that you have to work for the power on a Shimano brake when we have the reputation for having an on/off feel. One thing that's different about just about every pro bike is that they cheat out the pistons to get a super quick bite point. I don't remember specifically if the Mondraker mechanics said they were doing this but when I've polled teams in the past it was near 100%. Because the servo-wave is meant to quickly move through a lot of free stroke (relative to our super wide pad clearance) and then ramp up the power once the pads hit the rotor, when you cheat the pistons out the bite point will happen when the servo-wave is still in it's low power phase.
I found shimano brakes to offer quick bite which gives them their on/off feel, but they don't offer much more power after that even when you pull harder. Shimano brakes also seem to produce less power the closer you run them to the bars.
I switched from XT 4 piston brakes to Code RSCs.
The Codes have less aggressive bite, but produce more ultimate stopping power if you keep pulling.
After biking over to single track nearby and using those hills to attempt to bed in the pads, no luck. Tried for a while. I may have to buy new rotors
It is a shame because the lever feel is amazing, and I can tell there is a lot of power there, just no friction between the pads and rotor; not the fault of the combo, just bedding in metallic pads wasn’t working with the rotor.
I swapped back to the Guide caliper, but using the same method of bleeding, it’s impossible to get the Guides to feel as firm as they were with Code calipers. But, I scuffed the rotor and put some lightly torched organic pads in and boom, bedded-in in 3 minutes.
If I pursue this combo over buying new brakes, should they be called Grodes or Cruides?
I put this in my longer post a few months ago but Saints are good brakes, but what is really mind blowing about them is how good they are for being unchanged the past, what, 10 years? longer?
I do agree they aren't as powerful as newer, modern options, though. I think the past few years has had some really good options that push brakes into a more powerful, less force required category: Intend, Radic, Hope, Maven, Maxima, and Hope being the main examples I found. The Saints, while usable, just didn't have the power of these options and required more clenching to get power down consistently, but the fact they are even in the running still is crazy. What was the closest competitor when they were released? Guides? I don't even remember
I think brakes lagged behind the transition to 29in wheels and esp as bikes got heavier, the options we had before just don't work as well, but it's remarkable Saints still do as well as they do despite this. The others are catching up now and hopefully the new iterations come up to par with the other options on the market. I'm not a huge Shimano fanboy but their build kits are a better priced value than most of what SRAM is putting out atm.
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about...
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I...
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I went ahead and left them up front but moved to metal in the back. The combo works for me in how I ride and brake.
One other thing I've noticed with the stock Maven pads is the sintered ones will squeak for a second or two after cooling down (in dry...
One other thing I've noticed with the stock Maven pads is the sintered ones will squeak for a second or two after cooling down (in dry, dusty conditions) but shut up after that. This happens to me consistently after I first drop into a descent - the first 1 or 2 times I brake (especially lightly modulating on a traverse) they are noisy but quiet the rest of the descent. I don't have this happen with the organic pads.
Completely normal for Sram sintered pads. If we stop mid descent my Codes also squeak for the first 100 meters and are then OK.
Was finally able to hit the trails with my new set of trinity brakes
Using formula monolithic 220mm 2.3mm thickness rotors, front back, I also get the same high pitch squeal on light lever feathering and the loud howling upon harder breaking, especially on the front. This time I think I was about 96-100kg total kitted.
That sticky piston issue I had on the front seems better. Not exactly sure now if it is completely resolved or still there or in my head
My skill level is dogshit, that means I am happy I don't die after going down an easy to medium trail through roots. That also means I am all the time using the brakes, instead of knowing exactly when to and when not to. Have to say this is the best modulation I have ever felt and easiest on the fingers. I wanted to get them really hot for that sticky piston so I managed to hold them used throughout almost the whole of the descent. Didn't get them to fade (not using fridges). Maybe I was pulling a bit closer to the bar on the rear at the end, or it was just me not wanting to die going down.
The power is great, I lose traction if I go for more lever pull on the trail. I still would've wanted that 2 finger hard pull power I have on perfect traction on asphalt, more so that it adds even more modulation on trail, but they hold well for my weight and skill level
Had 1 fall, scratched the front brake lever, my soul hurts now
I run 220 and thick rotors with mtx gold pads - but any bigger, thicker rotor and more aggressive pads will help.
If you've cooked your brakes on the ride as described, I would flush your brakes with new fluid as well.
Purple pads have become extremely popular recently - they really are good.
we run them with galfer wave rotors 2mm, often 223 upfront and 203 rear on XT brakes.
The real answer is Mavens with hs2 rotors.
+ 1 on the mavens to be the one to rule them all. My set has been flawless and hasnt been touched and i dont even have to worry about aftermarket pads or different rotors as the whole package is pretty much perfect to me.
When i first got my new bike with mavens on i wasnt pleased at all. I have been on the dominion bandwagon for a long time. After ridding the mavens for a while now i must say i got used to them. I put the contact point almost all the way in wich made it easier to modulate the brakeforce (and not to perform a full on brake manouver when i just sligthly touch the lever). Depending on what i ride i switch betweem a bike with dominions and the new one with mavens. I feel like the hayes need considerable more fingerstrength to get them to brake powerful compared to the mavens.
I am a really big fan of MTX pads, I gave the reds a shot about a year ago. Compared to Shimano resin/metallic and TRP resin/semi metallic:
-Bedded in so quickly and easily it was comical.
-Never seemed to fade or falter regardless of heat/moisture
-Bike sat for over 3 months during the winter, first ride out they felt like when parked (Have had issues with Shimano pads).
They are just now at 1mm remaining with over 1,750km's/55,000m of descending on them. There might be more powerful pads available but they just work so damn well I am hard pressed to run anything else (other then maybe the golds).
Been thinking about reds. Gold were a little finicky on setup.
Alright, now I got the lever feeling rock hard which is awesome. Got the pistons moving synchronized so no uneven contact.
however now it has almost no power because of my rotors having been used with organic pads and I only have Code semi metallic pads (the bronze SRAM ones), even though I have cleaned the rotor, maybe I didn’t clean enough?
Did you run in the pads? Installing fresh pads (even on a rotor that's seen only metallic pads) gives no power at first but you can feel the power coming on during the first or second hard braking event when running them in.
I had to grind these particular pads a little because the previous owner most definitely did not have the correct spacers on his caliper; these pads had that 2/3rds wear pattern where the top third was unused and they had developed a ridge. Plenty of material left on them, though.
I have 4 pairs of Sram bronze pads: 2 from my own Codes (replaced with TruckerCo golds currently on my enduro bike), 2 from the RSCs I purchased.
I just grabbed a random pair to install, and they happen to come from the brakes I bought. I would have had to flatten them in the future anyways to get rid of that ridge. I thoroughly wiped the rotor with isopropyl and microfiber. Should I rough-up the rotor? They are 8 years old and only ever saw organic pads.
Mondraker Factory Racing went from riding Shimano brakes/drivetrain in 2024, to SRAM brakes/drivetrain in 2025. In the latest B Practice Podcast we asked Dak Norton about how it's been going from Shimano XTR/Saint to SRAM Mavens. It's interesting to hear how even a rider of his caliber has still had to adjust to the power/modulation of Mavens.
** Hope I'm not disrupting the conversation above too much
i have had my eye on the mavens and from what I am hearing the new base model seems like the best balance of power and modulation. anyone have experience on both?
yes, get the Base, can often be found quite cheap online
Totally agree re Dr. Norton's assessment of organic pads on the Mavens when they heat up - the ramp down from power is pretty quick. I went ahead and left them up front but moved to metal in the back. The combo works for me in how I ride and brake.
One other thing I've noticed with the stock Maven pads is the sintered ones will squeak for a second or two after cooling down (in dry, dusty conditions) but shut up after that. This happens to me consistently after I first drop into a descent - the first 1 or 2 times I brake (especially lightly modulating on a traverse) they are noisy but quiet the rest of the descent. I don't have this happen with the organic pads.
@Jason_Schroeder What stood out to me was Dak saying that you have to work for the power on a Shimano brake when we have the reputation for having an on/off feel. One thing that's different about just about every pro bike is that they cheat out the pistons to get a super quick bite point. I don't remember specifically if the Mondraker mechanics said they were doing this but when I've polled teams in the past it was near 100%. Because the servo-wave is meant to quickly move through a lot of free stroke (relative to our super wide pad clearance) and then ramp up the power once the pads hit the rotor, when you cheat the pistons out the bite point will happen when the servo-wave is still in it's low power phase.
I thought it interesting that Dak mentioned that the Saints (w/XTR levers) are pretty much under gunned these days. I’m definitely not in his category of speed, but I do push for my age/skill/weight and Saint brakes (caliper and levers) are adequate for even 60+% grade sections with excellent modulation and power. With proper maintenance, they should last 10+ years and I have never really experienced the wandering bite point (keep them bled properly folks!).
I’ve been curious about the TRP, Mavens, even the Hayes, but to keep the muscle memory consistent, I’d need to put a new brake system on 4 bikes, which is expensive…
Consider yourself lucky, it's scarier than the fundamentalist Spaniards when it finally happens.
I just got the Maven Base to test for Vital, but nothing to report yet.
I have had several sets of Shimano brakes but only experienced on XT brakes. XTR and Saints have always been fine. Bled them the same way, do leaver bleeds frequently to make sure they feel good, never had that issue those specific models.
I am curious how/where Saints fall in a lineup of just power rating on all modern brakes. I always thought they were pretty good but I’m also not trying lots of new stuff.
They are powerful but not as powerful as the shigura. I'm wondering about the new shimano brakes. In the german forum they already made shiguras out of them. Any experiences with them here so far?
For better or for worse, I find myself 'double tapping' when riding shimanos and it gives me the consistent bite that I want.
I have this exact same behavior under these exact same conditions with my Intend White Magic Pads.
Low hydraulic leverage combined with short levers = lower power. Attached is a chart that I put together calculating hydraulic leverage based on MC piston and caliper piston diameters. There are some obvious components missing from this, notably mechanical leverage that is a result of the cam geometry and lever length. But it overall follows what I have felt with the brakes that I have tried.
Personally, its been a long time since I've felt that Saints were top in the class, with the issues of Shimano's needing lever bleeds pretty regularly and the weird feel of the servo wave compared to other cam designs out now, its just not what it once was. When that design came out it was above the rest, but that was 2012, Avid just released the Elixers to replace the Juicys, both of which were utter garbage hence Saint being best in class (that was a pretty low bar.) At the end of the day, you can achieve good'enough power from any of the brakes out there, but the amount of force required at the lever is a whole 'nother story. TRP's, Saints, XT's, and my old MT7's take significantly more force at the lever than my A4's, Radic's or T4V4's to stop my 215lbs on a 40lb enduro bike when my confidence extends beyond my skill.
I found shimano brakes to offer quick bite which gives them their on/off feel, but they don't offer much more power after that even when you pull harder. Shimano brakes also seem to produce less power the closer you run them to the bars.
I switched from XT 4 piston brakes to Code RSCs.
The Codes have less aggressive bite, but produce more ultimate stopping power if you keep pulling.
Update on Guide RSC/Code combo:
After biking over to single track nearby and using those hills to attempt to bed in the pads, no luck. Tried for a while. I may have to buy new rotors
It is a shame because the lever feel is amazing, and I can tell there is a lot of power there, just no friction between the pads and rotor; not the fault of the combo, just bedding in metallic pads wasn’t working with the rotor.
I swapped back to the Guide caliper, but using the same method of bleeding, it’s impossible to get the Guides to feel as firm as they were with Code calipers. But, I scuffed the rotor and put some lightly torched organic pads in and boom, bedded-in in 3 minutes.
If I pursue this combo over buying new brakes, should they be called Grodes or Cruides?
I put this in my longer post a few months ago but Saints are good brakes, but what is really mind blowing about them is how good they are for being unchanged the past, what, 10 years? longer?
I do agree they aren't as powerful as newer, modern options, though. I think the past few years has had some really good options that push brakes into a more powerful, less force required category: Intend, Radic, Hope, Maven, Maxima, and Hope being the main examples I found. The Saints, while usable, just didn't have the power of these options and required more clenching to get power down consistently, but the fact they are even in the running still is crazy. What was the closest competitor when they were released? Guides? I don't even remember
I think brakes lagged behind the transition to 29in wheels and esp as bikes got heavier, the options we had before just don't work as well, but it's remarkable Saints still do as well as they do despite this. The others are catching up now and hopefully the new iterations come up to par with the other options on the market. I'm not a huge Shimano fanboy but their build kits are a better priced value than most of what SRAM is putting out atm.
Has anyone experimented with different DOT fluids?
Low viscosity ones vs higher boiling point ones? ( that are usually higher viscosity)
This picture from Supersonic Parts got me thinking
I haven’t tried it personally, but I know a few people who swear by race fluids. The boiling point increase can be pretty dramatic.
https://emotive.engineering/blogs/the-logbook/the-ultimate-track-day-and-racing-brake-fluid-guide#brake-fluid-comparison-chart
Completely normal for Sram sintered pads. If we stop mid descent my Codes also squeak for the first 100 meters and are then OK.
Was finally able to hit the trails with my new set of trinity brakes
Using formula monolithic 220mm 2.3mm thickness rotors, front back, I also get the same high pitch squeal on light lever feathering and the loud howling upon harder breaking, especially on the front. This time I think I was about 96-100kg total kitted.
That sticky piston issue I had on the front seems better. Not exactly sure now if it is completely resolved or still there or in my head
My skill level is dogshit, that means I am happy I don't die after going down an easy to medium trail through roots. That also means I am all the time using the brakes, instead of knowing exactly when to and when not to. Have to say this is the best modulation I have ever felt and easiest on the fingers. I wanted to get them really hot for that sticky piston so I managed to hold them used throughout almost the whole of the descent. Didn't get them to fade (not using fridges). Maybe I was pulling a bit closer to the bar on the rear at the end, or it was just me not wanting to die going down.
The power is great, I lose traction if I go for more lever pull on the trail. I still would've wanted that 2 finger hard pull power I have on perfect traction on asphalt, more so that it adds even more modulation on trail, but they hold well for my weight and skill level
Had 1 fall, scratched the front brake lever, my soul hurts now
Are the Maven Bronze's the way to go if you're buying new? Lighter lever feel than the Silver and Ultimate?
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