That frame also looks a bit less luggy and a bit less tubular than it usually does too?
It does look a little different. I know the pixels are bad but it really does look like there's a bend in the down tube and possibly in the top tube by the seat tube interface that angles towards the pivot. Possibly the production model? Masterful pixelation? Or my eyes are still wonky from making cross-eyed faces for kids earlier today
32" wheels w/ Aspens, 0-offset stem and weird-looking fork. Lots going on here...(And yeah, I know 32" wheels aren't new but I think Maxxis getting involved...
32" wheels w/ Aspens, 0-offset stem and weird-looking fork. Lots going on here...
(And yeah, I know 32" wheels aren't new but I think Maxxis getting involved is?)
Look at how big the flat pedals are, too. If you're a truly tall person, you'd be stoked on this thing. So much better than riding a circus bike.
32" wheels w/ Aspens, 0-offset stem and weird-looking fork. Lots going on here...(And yeah, I know 32" wheels aren't new but I think Maxxis getting involved...
32" wheels w/ Aspens, 0-offset stem and weird-looking fork. Lots going on here...
(And yeah, I know 32" wheels aren't new but I think Maxxis getting involved is?)
Everything on this bike seems a bit strange… So i am not surprised by the wheel size choice.
Unfortunately I know from an industry insider that teams are testing 32“ wheels and that the push comes from Scott (not surprised)
They did, but durability wasn't the issue. The surface was too smooth so had a tremendous amount of stiction.
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
PVD can be a fickle pain in the butt even on steel and when it fails it peels and flakes off almost like paint.
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
Wouldn't be too surprised if that was true, I had been suspicious all last season. His stanchions have a different sheen and the black seems a bit more dull than the typical deep black anodized stock stanchions. DLC?
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
Im sorry, Im a bit of a cultured ape. Would you mind explain what TiN is? Ive heard it before used in moto but thats about it…
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
I wouldn't object to that! Would be easier to make a strong/stiff fork at lower cost, plus steel is inherently lower friction and harder wearing than aluminium. Maybe not for everything but it could have its place in DH forks. Pressing a steel stanchion in to an alloy single crown could have a few issues I would guess
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle...
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
Yup probably one of the more common types of Physical Vapour Deposition which kind of squirts metal gas* on the part under vacuum. So its a thin coating applied over the top of the base metal, as opposed to something like anodising which transforms the outer surface in to an oxide layer with electricity and makes it harder that way. DLC is a similar process that applies a hard carbon layer instead, so the chemistry is a little different
They did, but durability wasn't the issue. The surface was too smooth so had a tremendous amount of stiction.
Fox on dhx2 had durability issues with TiN coating.On the other hand there are techniques to reduce stiction on very smooth surfaces that don't have pores.
It does look a little different. I know the pixels are bad but it really does look like there's a bend in the down tube and...
It does look a little different. I know the pixels are bad but it really does look like there's a bend in the down tube and possibly in the top tube by the seat tube interface that angles towards the pivot. Possibly the production model? Masterful pixelation? Or my eyes are still wonky from making cross-eyed faces for kids earlier today
You can also see the entire damper which is not the case with the current prototype as it is more integrated
Yup probably one of the more common types of Physical Vapour Deposition which kind of squirts metal gas* on the part under vacuum. So its a...
Yup probably one of the more common types of Physical Vapour Deposition which kind of squirts metal gas* on the part under vacuum. So its a thin coating applied over the top of the base metal, as opposed to something like anodising which transforms the outer surface in to an oxide layer with electricity and makes it harder that way. DLC is a similar process that applies a hard carbon layer instead, so the chemistry is a little different
*OK so a little more complicated than that
"OK so a little more complicated than that"
yes.
First you must perform the proper rituals to appease the machine spirits.
After that it's kinda like powder coating, except with plasma.
At this point I'm just kind of in awe at their steadfast support of Super Boost...
I think they've pigeonholed themselves into it at this point - they don't want to piss off current Pivot owners by changing standards more than anything.
Wouldn't be too surprised if that was true, I had been suspicious all last season. His stanchions have a different sheen and the black seems a...
Wouldn't be too surprised if that was true, I had been suspicious all last season. His stanchions have a different sheen and the black seems a bit more dull than the typical deep black anodized stock stanchions. DLC?
Wouldn't be too surprised if that was true, I had been suspicious all last season. His stanchions have a different sheen and the black seems a...
Wouldn't be too surprised if that was true, I had been suspicious all last season. His stanchions have a different sheen and the black seems a bit more dull than the typical deep black anodized stock stanchions. DLC?
That frame also looks a bit less luggy and a bit less tubular than it usually does too?
It does look a little different. I know the pixels are bad but it really does look like there's a bend in the down tube and possibly in the top tube by the seat tube interface that angles towards the pivot. Possibly the production model? Masterful pixelation? Or my eyes are still wonky from making cross-eyed faces for kids earlier today
Yeah it looks different on my phone with better image
I think its the beer goggles that the screenshot has. Quite possible but hell if my eyes could tell.
32" wheels w/ Aspens, 0-offset stem and weird-looking fork. Lots going on here...
(And yeah, I know 32" wheels aren't new but I think Maxxis getting involved is?)
Look at how big the flat pedals are, too. If you're a truly tall person, you'd be stoked on this thing. So much better than riding a circus bike.
Didn't RS do a TiN coating back in the 90s and early 2000s? I thought it wasn't durable enough and that's why it went away.
Everything on this bike seems a bit strange… So i am not surprised by the wheel size choice.
Unfortunately I know from an industry insider that teams are testing 32“ wheels and that the push comes from Scott (not surprised)
They did, but durability wasn't the issue. The surface was too smooth so had a tremendous amount of stiction.
It's also super hard to make TiN and other PVD coatings stick to aluminium properly without a lot of special preparation. They can be quite brittle so with the amount of flex a fork stanchion sees it would often flake off very easily. The coating itself doesn't even need to be that special for mtb products, its more important to get the clearances and surface finish dialled. Doing all of that and then applying an expensive coating is way overkill, especially mainstream products which is why chrome plating is being used on shocks like the Vorsprung Telum and most of Fox's products that aren't XC focussed. (The DHX2 used to be TiN as well btw)
Gonna posit a Flight Attendant Shapeshifter, pair it with Flight Attendant suspension and a power meter crankset, that'd be a helluva race bike.
Thoughts?
PVD can be a fickle pain in the butt even on steel and when it fails it peels and flakes off almost like paint.
Steel stanchions.
Heard it here first.
Wouldn't be too surprised if that was true, I had been suspicious all last season. His stanchions have a different sheen and the black seems a bit more dull than the typical deep black anodized stock stanchions. DLC?
Im sorry, Im a bit of a cultured ape. Would you mind explain what TiN is? Ive heard it before used in moto but thats about it…
Titanium Nitride, it's essentially a very hard ceramic: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium_nitride
Thanks for that.
I wouldn't object to that! Would be easier to make a strong/stiff fork at lower cost, plus steel is inherently lower friction and harder wearing than aluminium. Maybe not for everything but it could have its place in DH forks. Pressing a steel stanchion in to an alloy single crown could have a few issues I would guess
Yup probably one of the more common types of Physical Vapour Deposition which kind of squirts metal gas* on the part under vacuum. So its a thin coating applied over the top of the base metal, as opposed to something like anodising which transforms the outer surface in to an oxide layer with electricity and makes it harder that way. DLC is a similar process that applies a hard carbon layer instead, so the chemistry is a little different
*OK so a little more complicated than that
Fox on dhx2 had durability issues with TiN coating.On the other hand there are techniques to reduce stiction on very smooth surfaces that don't have pores.
Other site has a first look on the new Pivot bike(s) Trailcat SL and LT.
You can also see the entire damper which is not the case with the current prototype as it is more integrated
"OK so a little more complicated than that"
yes.
First you must perform the proper rituals to appease the machine spirits.
After that it's kinda like powder coating, except with plasma.
*still grossly oversimplified
At this point I'm just kind of in awe at their steadfast support of Super Boost...
I think they've pigeonholed themselves into it at this point - they don't want to piss off current Pivot owners by changing standards more than anything.
maybe they overpurchased during covid and have a massive OEM stockpile of superboost hubs
Adding unsprung mass is so hot right now
'SPRUNG' mass if we're talking about the stanchions... 😉 ( /<pedantic mode> )
Atherton unveiling the new S.200 alloy DH bike, on course at Red Bull Hardline Tasmania this week:
vital's pivot trailcat feature
https://www.vitalmtb.com/features/first-ride-pivots-all-new-trailcat-sl…