World Cup Downhill MTB Race Talk

unskilled
Posts
23
Joined
11/8/2010
Location
irmo, SC US
5/22/2019 10:31am
Well, this all has forced me to go through all of my "spares" in the garage and throw out some of those "i'll keep it because someday i'll use this XT derailleur i smashed against a rock, even though it's 10spd, for another build" components and throw them out.

I feel good about it.
Loki87
Posts
47
Joined
2/14/2015
Location
AT
5/22/2019 10:41am
fun house wrote:
Interesting to compare how differently things were handled between breaking something relatively small like a crank in this case to when a rival team's leading man...
Interesting to compare how differently things were handled between breaking something relatively small like a crank in this case to when a rival team's leading man smashed a frame in half.
I think they are two totally different instances though. For starters, E13 have had known quality problems with certain cranks, whereas Santa Cruz did not have...
I think they are two totally different instances though. For starters, E13 have had known quality problems with certain cranks, whereas Santa Cruz did not have a known issue with V10s snapping (although I'm sure it can happen, as with anything). Secondly, the E13 crank broke under normal riding conditions and not due to an impact with a wooden post. Had the E13 crank broke by running into a wooden post or a tree, it would have been seen differently but it broke during a relatively normal landing in a race run. Likewise, if Minnaar's V10 had snapped during a normal landing people would have reacted to it completely differently.

So because of pre-existing quality problems and breaking under normal riding conditions, I think E13 feared some public backlash that Santa Cruz never had to worry about. And because of this fear, the parties involved jumped to defend their image more so than normal. I'm not justifying how "E13" handled it, just providing an explanation as to how & why these are two different scenarios.
This is such an important point.
We have all these communication channels today, but sometimes it is better to not use them.
Santa Cruz have not jumped on twitter claiming how Marshy was experimenting with frame flex on that particular frame and had made cuts in the downtube and toptube the night before. They accepted that stuff breaks on the top level of racing. Especially when smashed into a post. Even if there´s a perfect excuse, people won´t ever know if it´s the truth and there are too many companies out there using these lame prototype/pre production excuses on a daily basis, so people are just fed up with it and start calling bs on any excuse made.
Maybe it´s a symptom of todays twitter mob mentality to instantly release a statement, but in this case it would have been better to just leave it up to peoples interpretation.
Personally, i saw the whole thing as one of the gnarliest riders alive breaking stuff on an overshoot. Simple as that.
Yes, the known quality issues of e13 were in the back of my head, but this wasn´t the straw to break the camels back and surely it wasn´t for most other people out there.
A lot of things came together to make this whole thing blow up the way it did and i assume it is just another lesson learned for Aaron and the team.

I will also say, there is another angle to this, Aaron.
People really wanna like you.
Their reactions will be more harsh, the more they like/idolize you.
I´m pretty sure most people were most angry because of the whole thing being "blamed" on John.
People reacting in this manner to your actions might not be pleasant, but it does show they do care.
I´m damn sure most people in this thread weren´t just blindly hating, they were disappointed BECAUSE they like you.
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Erotomania90
Posts
17
Joined
11/21/2018
Location
Cumming, GA US
5/22/2019 11:10am
Loki87 wrote:
This is such an important point. We have all these communication channels today, but sometimes it is better to not use them. Santa Cruz have not...
This is such an important point.
We have all these communication channels today, but sometimes it is better to not use them.
Santa Cruz have not jumped on twitter claiming how Marshy was experimenting with frame flex on that particular frame and had made cuts in the downtube and toptube the night before. They accepted that stuff breaks on the top level of racing. Especially when smashed into a post. Even if there´s a perfect excuse, people won´t ever know if it´s the truth and there are too many companies out there using these lame prototype/pre production excuses on a daily basis, so people are just fed up with it and start calling bs on any excuse made.
Maybe it´s a symptom of todays twitter mob mentality to instantly release a statement, but in this case it would have been better to just leave it up to peoples interpretation.
Personally, i saw the whole thing as one of the gnarliest riders alive breaking stuff on an overshoot. Simple as that.
Yes, the known quality issues of e13 were in the back of my head, but this wasn´t the straw to break the camels back and surely it wasn´t for most other people out there.
A lot of things came together to make this whole thing blow up the way it did and i assume it is just another lesson learned for Aaron and the team.

I will also say, there is another angle to this, Aaron.
People really wanna like you.
Their reactions will be more harsh, the more they like/idolize you.
I´m pretty sure most people were most angry because of the whole thing being "blamed" on John.
People reacting in this manner to your actions might not be pleasant, but it does show they do care.
I´m damn sure most people in this thread weren´t just blindly hating, they were disappointed BECAUSE they like you.
Exactly, I’d be willing to bet most of us watched the clip to make sure Aaron’s foot was still attached, not to hate on e13.
3
bturman
Posts
2104
Joined
8/1/2009
Location
Durango, CO US
5/22/2019 12:50pm
Back to Maribor, this video from Sleeper.co sheds some light on Phil Atwill's process and some behind the scenes bits:



Full immersion, focus, involvement, and enjoyment of a process. In essence, flow is characterized by complete absorption in what one does, resulting in a loss in one's sense of space and time.

For athletes, flow is essential but elusive. This is a story of working with the flow state and the consequential ups and downs of a professional mountain bikers career.
4
grinch
Posts
252
Joined
10/15/2013
Location
CA
5/22/2019 6:45pm
grinch wrote:
E-13 carbon cranks on sale in the "deal" pop up on the vital home page. Anyone getting a pair?
Milkman55 wrote:
I've had 2 pairs for about a year. Still trust them more than the RF and SRAM carbon cranks I broke in well under a year...
I've had 2 pairs for about a year. Still trust them more than the RF and SRAM carbon cranks I broke in well under a year. I agree the older cranks were sub par (but no worse than the early SRAM X01 carbon cranks out there that broke a ton). The new cranks released this year and reviewed on PB recently come with a 5 year warranty. Cant say for sure but I would assume they will be good with a warranty like that or no $ would be made...
Dont know why those stats haven't been mentioned until now but good to know. Hope hour cranks continue as is. What model of race face cranks did you break?
Big Bird
Posts
2292
Joined
2/1/2011
Location
Oceano, CA US
5/22/2019 8:21pm Edited Date/Time 5/22/2019 8:41pm
Sweet Bar Drag. Sweet everything else.

I was about to say, why does this man with so much flow not win every race? From the first time I saw him? That last line says it all. Soon come Phil. Soon come.
harorider13
Posts
37
Joined
3/22/2011
Location
Irvine, CA US
5/23/2019 7:37am
Wow the #GwinSaga is really something else, went down quite the rabbit hole this morning
1
Loki87
Posts
47
Joined
2/14/2015
Location
AT
5/23/2019 10:36am Edited Date/Time 5/23/2019 10:36am
That whole interview really is something else.
I don´t know what to say to that.
This is getting blown way out of proportion by them.
2
LLLLL
Posts
298
Joined
8/30/2015
Location
IE
5/24/2019 1:01am
Old style cranks? Photos and email from e13 or I'm not buying it. Sorry.
1
Oz_Taylor
Posts
180
Joined
8/13/2013
Location
SE
5/24/2019 7:46am Edited Date/Time 5/24/2019 7:46am
Loki87 wrote:
That whole interview really is something else.
I don´t know what to say to that.
This is getting blown way out of proportion by them.
The whole thing is ridiculous. It's such a non story that has been made into a massive thing. I can't believe how badly this was handled by everyone involved (the PB interview doesn't help either).

Part the reason for going racing is about product development. Having someone like Gwin testing products to destruction so that us mortals can benefit from better products. Hell, he rides harder and faster than anyone on Earth, I'm surprised he doesn't break more stuff.

Things break. Everybody knows this. No need to make a song and dance about it.


5
5/24/2019 11:57am


You can see in this photo that the cranks are the older style. They have the white letters that say "ethirteen components" and the newer 4th gen on e13's website are different cosmetically.
1
Loki87
Posts
47
Joined
2/14/2015
Location
AT
5/24/2019 2:25pm
[img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2019/05/24/8148/s1200_cranks.jpg[/img] You can see in this photo that the cranks are the older style. They have the white letters that say "ethirteen components" and the newer...


You can see in this photo that the cranks are the older style. They have the white letters that say "ethirteen components" and the newer 4th gen on e13's website are different cosmetically.

Unicycle
Posts
10
Joined
12/30/2015
Location
Dunbarton, NH US
5/24/2019 3:26pm
Here’s the positive spin-“My HT pedals are too strong!”

I’m a DH fan. Been riding DH since ‘94 and now have a 15 yro that rips and loves the sport as well. I couldn’t ask for more. American DH “fans” are horrible...at least the ones living their lives online. As a whole, there is more bitching and complaining about DH related stuff than I’ve ever seen in any other sport.

I’ve never understood why AG has been ridden so hard..and half of it has nothing to do with the sport. People have issue with someone who acknowledges something in his life that he feels helps make him a better person (faith)? Seriously!? WTF? I don’t care if you acknowledge Buhda, the tooth fairy, or John Jacob Jingle Heimer Schmidt..if it helps you be a better person, good for you.

I personally think AG is the best thing that has happened to DH in the US (and the world) in a long time. I’m also a Palmer fan. I think he’s one of the greatest athletes this country has seen...but I also think he was one of the worst things that happened to DH in the US. People didn’t see below the surface and basically thought the way to be rad was to act like a punk and party even harder. I’m no saint, not even close, but I would much rather my son model himself as an athlete, and human being, after Gwin than Palmer.

So yeah, was I disappointed in the IG post etc. yeah, I was. But i’m glad I didn’t go spouting off about it until hearing the full story. The guy is human. End of story.

That being said; Aaron, the only way to truly save face in this scenario is to punch Lance Armstrong straight in the face.

Hoping he returns strong and stays healthy through the rest of the season.
4
1
5/24/2019 4:32pm
[img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2019/05/24/8148/s1200_cranks.jpg[/img] You can see in this photo that the cranks are the older style. They have the white letters that say "ethirteen components" and the newer...


You can see in this photo that the cranks are the older style. They have the white letters that say "ethirteen components" and the newer 4th gen on e13's website are different cosmetically.
Loki87 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2019/05/24/8150/s1200_shopped.jpg[/img]

Shopped my @ss I took the video that went viral. Neko came up to us and asked for the crank and pedal back and we gave it to him. The video was air dropped to a Canadian rider who also broke a crank there and he sent it to Vital. Believe it if you want but that’s how it went.
1
1
Loki87
Posts
47
Joined
2/14/2015
Location
AT
5/24/2019 4:44pm
It´s a meme dude.
Lighten up a bit.
3
1
5/24/2019 4:54pm
Alright well didn’t mean to get all up in arms but I think Gwin is telling the truth. Maybe it wasn’t the most thought out press release but those look like third gen e13 cranks. Either way I still wouldn’t run them or any carbon crank for that matter. Ti is the way to go but not affordable.
1
1
Loki87
Posts
47
Joined
2/14/2015
Location
AT
5/24/2019 6:37pm
Yup, i hadn´t even doubted the crank story before any proof.
The problem is when an athlete or manufacturer gets all up in arms over such a trivial thing, people will inevitably start to doubt the story. Now, after that interview, these things will pop up like mushrooms. That´s what i wanted to express.

jeff.brines
Posts
1227
Joined
8/29/2010
Location
Grand Junction, CO US
5/28/2019 7:23am Edited Date/Time 5/28/2019 7:24am
Bummer for Gwin! I guess this will sort out what size he's going to run Wink

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sspomer
Posts
6114
Joined
6/26/2009
Location
Boise, ID US
Fantasy
5/28/2019 7:27am
ugh, that sucks!!!
Snakes
Posts
17
Joined
6/6/2014
Location
SI
5/28/2019 8:34am
Did you ask Gwin for an interview or at least if you are allowed to publish it?
13
3
5/28/2019 8:39am
At least that takes out the Large vs XL debate.
3
kwapik
Posts
89
Joined
8/31/2017
Location
NAS Fallon, NV US
5/28/2019 9:17am
Gwin & company can't catch a break this month.
2
5/28/2019 11:06am


Nukeproof joining the DH 29er game.
peecee
Posts
425
Joined
5/12/2013
Location
Brisbane AU
Fantasy
5/28/2019 3:38pm
I wonder why one of the most important bikes on the race circuit was stored in a van with windows and not the big safe secure box Intense were towing ? and why was the bike fully built if they only just arrived in the country ?
tullie
Posts
82
Joined
12/19/2011
Location
Pine Valley, CA US
5/28/2019 8:09pm
peecee wrote:
I wonder why one of the most important bikes on the race circuit was stored in a van with windows and not the big safe secure...
I wonder why one of the most important bikes on the race circuit was stored in a van with windows and not the big safe secure box Intense were towing ? and why was the bike fully built if they only just arrived in the country ?
1st year team owner and 1st year in business might be like most businesses where you just can't catch a break and learn a bunch of lessons when you are starting off.....
1
danposs86
Posts
153
Joined
11/23/2018
Location
GB
5/29/2019 1:43am
peecee wrote:
I wonder why one of the most important bikes on the race circuit was stored in a van with windows and not the big safe secure...
I wonder why one of the most important bikes on the race circuit was stored in a van with windows and not the big safe secure box Intense were towing ? and why was the bike fully built if they only just arrived in the country ?
Is it just me, or does the trailer look like it has been forced open? (Second photo on their IG)
1
shreda
Posts
208
Joined
10/2/2018
Location
GB
5/29/2019 2:14am
Seems like they are taking every little bit of publicity they can get at them moment... Wink
5/29/2019 3:18am
Fort William/Nevis Range local Mikayla Parton is about to tackle her second ever World Cup, on home soil. Check in with this talented rider who only picked up bikes in 2015 and learn a bit more about what it's like to have such an iconic race track track right next door:

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