MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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rludes025
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78
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Nowhere, OK, USA
10/21/2024 8:52am

You wouldn’t experience pedal kickback*

*until you use your brakes right, when your wheel is rotating at as little as 0m/s? 

As soon as you lock up all bets are off course. To be honest I’ve never really ridden anything where I found pedal kickback to be...

As soon as you lock up all bets are off course. To be honest I’ve never really ridden anything where I found pedal kickback to be annoying beyond when the wheel is locked up. Even going back to back with and without chain. There’s a part of me that actually kind of likes being able to use chain tension to keep it a little higher. Let the cranks rotate backwards a little on landing and the impact is lessened using more travel. Keep feet entirely flat and push through it for more efficiency. 

I feel that heavy braking is the largest contributor/least discussed for pedal kick. The situation where you might be locking up the rear brake but still...

I feel that heavy braking is the largest contributor/least discussed for pedal kick. The situation where you might be locking up the rear brake but still using a good amount of travel is the exact situation where you’d really want your suspension performing at its best

@Blake_Motley Agreed, steep chunky stuff is really the only place I notice it. 

2
Eae903
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10/21/2024 11:07am
I asked ChatGPT what Sesame Seed was talking about and to be okay with being brutally honest and distasteful if it wants. Enjoy:This comment seems to...

I asked ChatGPT what Sesame Seed was talking about and to be okay with being brutally honest and distasteful if it wants. Enjoy:


This comment seems to be a convoluted attempt at drawing parallels between professional bike racing and motorsports, particularly Formula 1, but it’s a jumbled mess of loose associations and misplaced terminology. Let’s break it down brutally:


 

1. Chain Drive Skepticism: The commenter kicks off with skepticism about recent changes to bike racing due to “chain drive,” but gives no real details or context for what exactly they are skeptical about. It feels like they are grasping at straws, trying to sound knowledgeable while being vague about their actual critique.

2. Motility and Suspension Nonsense: They throw in the term “motility” from motorsports, trying to sound profound by equating it with bike suspension and the manipulation of gravity. This is a bizarre, over-complicated analogy that tries to link the biological term with bike mechanics in a way that doesn’t really make sense or add anything to the argument. It feels like an attempt to sound smart, but ends up being pretentious and confusing.

3. Useless F1 Comparison: The person rambles about how there is no connection between downhill (DH) biking and Formula 1, but goes on to compare them anyway, just to say there’s no point in comparing them. They even mention they’ve never heard anyone call a Formula 1 car “the DH Bicycle of Motorsport”—which is, unsurprisingly, irrelevant because no one in their right mind would make that comparison in the first place. It’s a strawman argument that detracts from any valid point they might have tried to make.

4. Cost Cap Irrelevance: They seem to miss the mark entirely on the concept of cost caps. In motorsport, cost caps are imposed to level the playing field between teams with different budgets. But how this is relevant to UCI or professional biking is left unclear. They seem to want UCI to enforce stricter part regulations, but don’t explain why or how this would improve the sport.

5. Ship of Theseus Tangent: They throw in some pseudo-philosophical garbage about the “Ship of Theseus” to imply that the constant upgrading of parts in biking removes any claim to originality. This is an overblown and irrelevant philosophical detour that doesn’t help their argument—whatever it even is at this point.

6. Mass Dampers and Renault’s Aero Advantage: They attempt to end on a high note by throwing in technical jargon about “mass dampers,” likening them to a decade-old strategy used by Renault in F1 to reduce tire rebound. The implication here is that people relying on mass dampers in biking are compensating for poor skills. But this comparison feels forced and unclear, as the two sports have very different engineering challenges.


In conclusion, the comment is an incoherent mess. The author tries to blend unrelated concepts from motorsport and biking to sound insightful, but instead they come across as someone with surface-level knowledge throwing around technical terms to mask the lack of a coherent point. It’s a hodgepodge of overreaching analogies and poorly articulated frustration that ultimately says very little.

Eae903 wrote:
I just hope one day we as a community will stop trying to compare DH or any form of bike racing to motorsports. Now if you'll...

I just hope one day we as a community will stop trying to compare DH or any form of bike racing to motorsports. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go and try to figure out how to make high pivot moto suspension for ultimate enduro prowess. 

I'll just use a jack shaft and an extra chain with 1 to 1 cogs. Easy easy. 

1
thomas1965
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Burlington, VT, USA
10/21/2024 12:07pm

taking all recent discussion into account, I'm thinking this with an ochain will be my next ride.

22305280
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Whattheheel
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Spearfish, SD, USA
10/21/2024 12:12pm

And an e13 Sidekick hub for safety purposes. 

8
monarchmason
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Nevada City, CA, USA
10/21/2024 1:53pm
thomas1965 wrote:
taking all recent discussion into account, I'm thinking this with an ochain will be my next ride.

taking all recent discussion into account, I'm thinking this with an ochain will be my next ride.

22305280

Their rear suspension design must be horrible to warrant such a design to combat pedal kickback. Cant blame the owner. 1000 iq design. 

7
10/21/2024 10:19pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2024 10:22pm

Back to tech rumors! 
An interesting drivetrain on the KTMs! Wink

Looks like it’s wireless and the derailleur seems very close to the rear triangle…IMG 6605

17
boozed
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AU
10/21/2024 10:27pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2024 10:44pm
Back to tech rumors! An interesting drivetrain on the KTMs! ;)Looks like it’s wireless and the derailleur seems very close to the rear triangle…

Back to tech rumors! 
An interesting drivetrain on the KTMs! Wink

Looks like it’s wireless and the derailleur seems very close to the rear triangle…IMG 6605

Eleven speed linkglide too

Edit: Here's one that isn't blurred out, not that you see very much more.

Edit x2: oh...

7
thresh
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San Jose, CA, USA
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10/21/2024 10:40pm
Back to tech rumors! An interesting drivetrain on the KTMs! ;)Looks like it’s wireless and the derailleur seems very close to the rear triangle…

Back to tech rumors! 
An interesting drivetrain on the KTMs! Wink

Looks like it’s wireless and the derailleur seems very close to the rear triangle…IMG 6605

boozed wrote:

Eleven speed linkglide too

Edit: Here's one that isn't blurred out, not that you see very much more.

Edit x2: oh...

This one is TRP E.A.S.I. A12 as pictured thiugh

3
lickmycrinkle
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Location
Beverly Hills, CA, USA
10/22/2024 1:41am
image 70.png?VersionId=YEObq4UelPeO2QvjsnL0bEKZrP

 

There's also this in the regular bike catalog.

 

The text which has had a filter applied, when copied, spits out this:

 

R.DERAILL. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250-12 GS shadow+

SHIFTLEV. Shimano XTR Di2 M9250

CRANKSET Shimano XTR M9200-12 Carbon 32T

BOTTOM BR. Shimano MT900 pressfit PA29 MTB

SPROCKET Shimano XTR M9200-12 / 9-45

CHAIN Shimano M9100-12

 

So that's Shimano's first(?) carbon cranks confirmed?

And the brake name is in full view, the new protos we've seen aren't saint? M9220 seems it would be the 4 piston variant.

9
lickmycrinkle
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10/22/2024 1:42am Edited Date/Time 10/22/2024 1:43am

Sorry Shimano, but there's more:

image 72.png?VersionId=za06I8V2z3JTiWNxH

Shimano Deore XT Di2 M8250-12 GS shadow+
Shimano Deore XT Di2 M8250
Shimano Deore XT M8200-12 30T
Shimano MT800 pressfit MTB
Shimano Deore XT M8200-12 / 9-45
Shimano M8100-12

And M8200 brakes. So at least XTR and XT will be moving to the new lever shape?

 

7
bikelurker
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Bilbao, Vizcaya, ES
10/22/2024 2:06am Edited Date/Time 10/22/2024 2:06am

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

1
2
kuzlich
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Location
Lisichansk, UA
10/22/2024 2:26am
Sorry Shimano, but there's more:Shimano Deore XT Di2 M8250-12 GS shadow+Shimano Deore XT Di2 M8250Shimano Deore XT M8200-12 30TShimano MT800 pressfit MTBShimano Deore XT M8200-12 /...

Sorry Shimano, but there's more:

image 72.png?VersionId=za06I8V2z3JTiWNxH

Shimano Deore XT Di2 M8250-12 GS shadow+
Shimano Deore XT Di2 M8250
Shimano Deore XT M8200-12 30T
Shimano MT800 pressfit MTB
Shimano Deore XT M8200-12 / 9-45
Shimano M8100-12

And M8200 brakes. So at least XTR and XT will be moving to the new lever shape?

 

The source of the pics?

1
Primoz
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Location
SI
10/22/2024 2:57am
bikelurker wrote:
Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient...

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

9t is lighter though. 

The carbon crank is a Race Face. 

1
3
mtbboy1993
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Askim, NO
10/22/2024 3:03am
thomas1965 wrote:
taking all recent discussion into account, I'm thinking this with an ochain will be my next ride.

taking all recent discussion into account, I'm thinking this with an ochain will be my next ride.

22305280

Is this a joke?  I don't get the point of this.

19
10/22/2024 3:03am
bikelurker wrote:
Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient...

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

The more, the merrier! Why limit yourself with a 10t when you can go 9t?!?! This way people can go even lower on the chainring and still have a good-enough gear ratio for high speeds, together with a GS-derailluer for better clearance (as those SGS fuckers are too damn long!!!). Smile

2
lickmycrinkle
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229
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Location
Beverly Hills, CA, USA
10/22/2024 3:11am
bikelurker wrote:
Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient...

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

Primoz wrote:

9t is lighter though. 

The carbon crank is a Race Face. 

image 74.png?VersionId= SIbXYOi0lC2

Clearly not.

Download the catalog yourself and check.

7
1
TimBud
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544
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Location
GB
10/22/2024 3:25am

The Ecommerce guy at KTM who knows nothing about bikes got it wrong. 

We all know Shimano don’t make carbon cranks especially one thats compatible with a Bosch DU.

And we can all see its an RF crank

5
kuzlich
Posts
35
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Location
Lisichansk, UA
10/22/2024 3:28am
Clearly not.Download the catalog yourself and check.
image 74.png?VersionId= SIbXYOi0lC2

Clearly not.

Download the catalog yourself and check.

Can you give a link to the catalog, pls? 

1
bikelurker
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Location
Bilbao, Vizcaya, ES
10/22/2024 3:35am
TimBud wrote:
The Ecommerce guy at KTM who knows nothing about bikes got it wrong. We all know Shimano don’t make carbon cranks especially one thats compatible with a...

The Ecommerce guy at KTM who knows nothing about bikes got it wrong. 

We all know Shimano don’t make carbon cranks especially one thats compatible with a Bosch DU.

And we can all see its an RF crank

But im not referring ton the ebike, but the top end hardtail instead. We will get to know in due time

3
bikelurker
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Bilbao, Vizcaya, ES
10/22/2024 3:40am
bikelurker wrote:
Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient...

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

The more, the merrier! Why limit yourself with a 10t when you can go 9t?!?! This way people can go even lower on the chainring and...

The more, the merrier! Why limit yourself with a 10t when you can go 9t?!?! This way people can go even lower on the chainring and still have a good-enough gear ratio for high speeds, together with a GS-derailluer for better clearance (as those SGS fuckers are too damn long!!!). Smile

Arent most suspension designs optimized around a 32t chainring? Thats why it seems odd to me they are going that route

1
Primoz
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SI
10/22/2024 3:41am
bikelurker wrote:
Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient...

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

Primoz wrote:

9t is lighter though. 

The carbon crank is a Race Face. 

Clearly not.Download the catalog yourself and check.
image 74.png?VersionId= SIbXYOi0lC2

Clearly not.

Download the catalog yourself and check.

Ah, I was looking at the ebike which has Era cranks in the spec list too. 

Apparently Shimano made a limited edition Dura Ace crankset in carbon in 2010

3
TimBud
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GB
10/22/2024 3:46am

Even so, there are certain things we know with Shimano.

They will not be doing a carbon crank.

They will not be doing 1 9t high gear on their cassettes. They don't even offer 10t to the roadies because of the inefficiencies and slippage.   

9
lickmycrinkle
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Beverly Hills, CA, USA
10/22/2024 4:00am
TimBud wrote:
Even so, there are certain things we know with Shimano.They will not be doing a carbon crank.They will not be doing 1 9t high gear on...

Even so, there are certain things we know with Shimano.

They will not be doing a carbon crank.

They will not be doing 1 9t high gear on their cassettes. They don't even offer 10t to the roadies because of the inefficiencies and slippage.   

Looking forward to quoting this post when it drops.

20
TimBud
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10/22/2024 4:13am

Looking forward to quoting this post when it drops.

I've been wrong before and won't lose sleep over it.

But if that's how you get your boners then you enjoy it.

 

Shimano are more stubborn than I am and we'd have seen a production carbon crank (not an LE from 10 years ago) on their road groupsets already if there was one coming to mtb. And it being KTM suggests its just errors on their spec sheets which is super common across all brands.

For example a year or so ago Specialized had to give away a load of 700watt batteries with Levo sales because they were delivered with 500 when the spec stated 700 (in the UK).

2
8
bikelurker
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Bilbao, Vizcaya, ES
10/22/2024 4:39am
TimBud wrote:
Even so, there are certain things we know with Shimano.They will not be doing a carbon crank.They will not be doing 1 9t high gear on...

Even so, there are certain things we know with Shimano.

They will not be doing a carbon crank.

They will not be doing 1 9t high gear on their cassettes. They don't even offer 10t to the roadies because of the inefficiencies and slippage.   

A couple of days ago I Heard the crazyest thing, that shimano is about to drop a 1x ROAD groupset. Hey, maybe they are caling GRX a road groupset (it is) maybe they have something else...

1
TimBud
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GB
10/22/2024 4:50am

That’s no surprise as GRX has been 1x for a long time now

1
dolface
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USA
10/22/2024 5:03am
Primoz wrote:

9t is lighter though. 

The carbon crank is a Race Face. 

Clearly not.Download the catalog yourself and check.
image 74.png?VersionId= SIbXYOi0lC2

Clearly not.

Download the catalog yourself and check.

Primoz wrote:
Ah, I was looking at the ebike which has Era cranks in the spec list too. Apparently Shimano made a limited edition Dura Ace crankset in carbon...

Ah, I was looking at the ebike which has Era cranks in the spec list too. 

Apparently Shimano made a limited edition Dura Ace crankset in carbon in 2010

 

FC-7800C

Dura-Ace Carbon Crankset

16
10/22/2024 7:07am Edited Date/Time 10/22/2024 7:07am

1000040149 1.png?VersionId=DuuFaMVSIAzkL00G2 GNew Bike from Transition or just new colours? 

Simcik
Posts
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Location
Loma, CO, USA
10/22/2024 7:12am Edited Date/Time 10/22/2024 7:14am
bikelurker wrote:
Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient...

Still 12s, Carbon cranks (at least in xtr trim), and they don't look like direct mount derailleurs.

9-45t seems like an odd choice, arent 10t sprockets inefficient enough already?

Shimano has experience with 9t cogs. Shimano Capreo cassettes back in the 2010s offered that option. I ran it for a while and had fine luck though that was on a DH bike. 

I wonder if the cranks are carbon or if the ring is carbon... CRANKSET Shimano XTR M9200-12 Carbon 32T makes me think the ring is carbon. If it were phrased CRANKSET Shimano XTR Carbon M9200-12 32T my mind would lean toward crank. Complete speculation.

8
10/22/2024 7:13am
New Bike from Transition or just new colours? 

1000040149 1.png?VersionId=DuuFaMVSIAzkL00G2 GNew Bike from Transition or just new colours? 

New Sentinel tomorrow, not sure how much is changing, but in-frame storage will be there. There may also be another model, potentially the Scout? 

14
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