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As much as I would like to see more bikes made here, I think it will come down to the size of the company.. I don't see a company the size of Trek bringing production back here, but a smaller company, like maybe Revel, could possibly benefit.. Allied is showing that high end carbon bikes can be made here.
Stages Cycling lays off entire workforce and has seemingly ceased operations.
https://escapecollective.com/stages-cycling-lays-off-entire-workforce/
Let me know if I'm missing any companies, but according to my notes from this thread our post-Covid bike brand graveyard so far is listed below, with some other companies like Evil, Orange, Schwalbe, Scott, Trek, etc staying afloat but seeing significant "internal restructuring":
1. Guerrilla Gravity
2. Ridefast Racing
3. Nukeproof/Ragley/Vitus/Chainreaction/Wiggle
4. Blackspire
5. Eminent Cycles
6. BLine indoor MTB park in Calgary
7. Pole
8. Kona
9. Planet Cyclery
10. Stages Cycling
I’m just saying what I’ve experienced first hand as someone who has worked in the bike industry at a company that produced some of their products in the US (which went under) and also worked at manufacturers in other industries. My experience is bicycle consumers are particularly bad about trying to by US made products compared to consumers in other industries. I hope I’m wrong and I hope that changes, but we don’t tend to be a particularly nationalistic group compared to other wheeled sports (which comes with pros and cons of course).
Kitsbow was one of the first to go under.
Is Colorado Cyclist the same company as Planet Cyclery? They’re also closing.
One is dealing with the namesake bike brand, the other (Chris?) does suspension design. And Revel uses one of his designs.
I'm still wondering if stamping or forging lugs in some way and bonding tubes is a viable way to get rid of welding in mass production...
Correct.. Chris is designing suspension (CBF) and Lance runs the bike company.
Oh I totally agree with this.
I don't think your statement and mine can't co-exist though.
Mass market products are never going to on-shore in an significant way.
High end, or boutique products have a better chance to on-shore now than ever. Now in sales figures, Taiwanese frames will still sell more and more each year (ignoring downturns) but as the overall market grows I think European and US made frames will also grow too.
I'm surprised the list of closures is so short to be honest.
In Portugal there's a "bike valley" where they have massively invested in welding robots. I think I read that a good chunk of Decathlon frames are now welded there.
It's in Europe but Portugal minimum wages are still much lower than some other countries in Europe so that's something that may not be possible in the US.
In France Moustache (rather high-end ebikes) are now producing their latest bike frame locally (one single part moulded front triangle) as well as 12 cycles who are producing a cargo bike.
Both bikes are not exactly cheap (5-7K€).
BTW, what's going on with Turner? They did fall off a clif ages ago, but still, they were very popular at one point.
They had a tent set up at 24HOP this year and seem to be doing fine. They had one model on display with a raw titanium fork that matched the frame and it was drool worthy.
I believe they have gone the route of very high end ti. All hardtails/rigid bikes. Peeked in their booth last year at Sea Otter and there were some gorgeous looking frames.
His focus now is on titanium frames. And Turner’s hardtail rides absolutely incredible.
I saw it's Ti only after listening to a really old (2021?) Cycling Tips podcast (clearing out my Google Podcasts playlist before they shut it down) and they mentioned a Ti frame. Wondered what's going on after remembering the DHR and the likes (DW Link based bikes) and didn't see any. So the business is up and running, they just did a pivot (no pun intended :D ) on the products they focus on?
America’s Portugal, South Carolina, has been giving tax incentives to bike manufacturers for years. Kent bikes (barbie, spiderman, Univega, Van Dessel, not the O’brien one) has a paint and assembly facility 90 minutes from the Shimano East warehouse. Kent has been saying for 8 years now that they are going to start welding in house, but they can’t just create skilled workers out of thin air.
Time is trying to setup an actual carbon factory about 45 minutes south of Rock Creek, and the State just bought Time and Boyd a German carbon wheel factory that is getting shipped over.
Wages in America are among the lowest in the world, but we don’t really have a good enough education system in the low-wage states like South Carolina to create the workers necessary for on-shoring much production.
(I just had lunch at the closest Waffle House to the Kent facility- my waitress mentioned there was nowhere anywhere close to work or where she lives to buy high quality shoes for work, just Walmart.)
Updated post-Covid bike brand graveyard:
1. Kitsbow
2. Guerrilla Gravity
3. Ridefast Racing
4. Nukeproof/Ragley/Vitus/Chainreaction/Wiggle
5. Blackspire
6. Eminent Cycles
7. BLine indoor MTB park in Calgary
8. Pole
9. Kona
10. Planet Cyclery/Colorado Cyclist
11. Stages Cycling
RIP
Hey now, let's keep that level of scrutiny and speculation to the tech rumors thread.
I feel like we could also make a list of "growing/expanding companies" since Covid as well. I know it's one example, and certainly not the volume of the big brands, but I purchased a custom steel hardtail from Neuhaus Metal Works about a year ago. At the time I got mine, Nick was still building frames in his garage. Since I received mine, Nick has moved into a much larger space presumably to increase production. While it sucks to see big companies go under and workers lose their jobs, it does create opportunities for smaller entrepreneurs/companies to fill those voids. Sometimes a short-term "gut punch" to an industry ends up being a good thing in the long run.
“Wages in America are among the lowest in the world”
what?
Stages Cycling executives join Giant after suit and apparent shut down
$7.25 per hour, no benefits, at all, an hour from where you live, with no public transportation…
Nowhere else in thr G20 does such shameful stuff happen.
That's a choice. Minimum wage is $15-17 an hour on the West Coast.
Indonesia, which is part of the G20, has a mandated monthly minimum wage of $315 in Jakarta, the most expensive city. It gets as low as $128 per month in the more remote islands. Note that businesses often pay lower especially if there's no one doing an audit.
India, also a member of the G20, has a minimum wage in the same ballpark in her big cities and highly urbanized areas. In the more rural states, it can get as low as 6,600 rupees a month, which is less than $80. The average minimum monthly wage in all of India is $95.
As Verbal Kint said above this is just totally wrong. Even the lowest paid jobs in America are supremely wealthy compared to other G20 countries.
India, Indonesia, Turkey, Argentina, China and South Africa are all in the G20.
If you think minimum wage in those countries is better than the US, your delusional.
But minimum wage only comes into play with manual labour production processes. That's why a lot of carbon manufacturing is off shored. A cnc costs what a cnc costs. And what is the price of electricity going around the world to power those machines?
That's part of the reason why a lot of stuff can still be made in the "western" world even though minimum wage is much higher. You just gotta automate the heck out of it.
Yeah absolutely.
It also shrinks supply chains, lowers inventory costs, improves turn around and development.
It's why lugged tubbed frames are so good for small size manufacturers. But also useless for large scale manufacturers. Their cost per unit is OK at high prices, but they really don't scale and get cheaper.
It's why brands like We are One have to reuse their molds for all their models and adjust links, they simply can't afford to have 15+ different moulds while do it in Canada. They found a technological solution of adapting a few molds to do a lot.
Whereas othe new high end frames now all have a specific front and rear triangle mould for every size, that's very expensive and has to be offset by lower labour costs in china/Taiwan.
I was purely just addressing the ridiculous claim that US minimum wage is terrible within the context of the G20, it ain't
now do wage/cost of healthcare
its not what you earn but what you have after your basic needs are paid
Apologies if this is too far off-topic for this thread; it's related and an interesting thought-exercise: https://escapecollective.com/who-will-sram-acquire-next/
Post a reply to: The Bikeconomics (Mega)Thread