Hello Vital MTB Visitor,
We’re conducting a survey and would appreciate your input. Your answers will help Vital and the MTB industry better understand what riders like you want. Survey results will be used to recognize top brands. Make your voice heard!
Five lucky people will be selected at random to win a Vital MTB t-shirt.
Thanks in advance,
The Vital MTB Crew
I just mentioned this is about the wild card riders or lower positioned riders who have either no sponsors or are flow (so free bikes/parts/gear but no contract) and maybe some dudes with TINY contracts and basically NO bargaining power/leverage to ask for a better contract. Like if these dudes even have a contract at all, it could be as low as 1-2k a month.
My understanding is not only is not every event like this but not every CRANKWORX is actually run the way Rotorua is. The travel expenses are pretty gnarly for non aus/nz riders, and if there's no appearance fee to HELP (not even cover) with the flight, as well as no help for lodging and catering... The lowest guys on the totem pole are just eating shit. Straight up.
Again. Rogatkin is FINE. Lemoine is FINE. Emil is FINE. The riders all decided to take a pay cut on this event to argue that compensation for the least paid riders is not FAIR and the way the event is run isn't even logical. They brought up a LOT of points beyond pay. Practice times, course safety, making sure they are riding in the right weather most likely, catering, lodging, etc.
We really need to stop trying to compare it to things lol. This isn't the NFL. It's not your mechanic. Let's just talk about what it is... Why not?
But, on the other hand, there are plenty of Redbull riders that weren't at Hardline.. Specialized told their DH guys no...
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that the people who already didn't like unions mostly sided with the Crankworx organizers and the people who already liked unions agreed with the athletes. Call it a hunch.
One could argue the riders need Crankworx more than Crankworx needs the riders. If there's no slopestyle contest, Crankworx is still a massive mountain bike festival that helps grow the sport, and all that changes is one event gone. If the riders lose the Crankworx slopestyle, that's a big media exposure gone for them and their sponsors now. It's a bit of a tightrope they have to walk. Would not be surprised if Crankworx plays a bit of hardball
sounds likely haha
I've been on both sides in various roles - Most, atleast in NZ Unionized Companies struggle as Unions push push push, They dont care if the company survives which is actually worse. however, pay agreements are simpler as its just a wide sweep overal but there is always so much arguing from members who dont agree blah blah.
currently in a management role At a unionized company and its Cut throat stuff trying to balance markets while all the workers want to strip us of any revenue/profits - Our main complaint is machinery thats broken down etc We cant afford to fix it when the union pushes for 15% every year.
The worst Part is, everyone knows what everyone else is getting so the minor small easy jobs want paid near the top dogs.
In my own opinion, Unions Are out for themselves to short term bank as much $$ as possible with no care to ones actually paying them - Crankworx Isnt an employer of these riders so I hope They hold their ground and tell those riders to get stuffed.
Key word. Incentives. Not mandatory. They can pick and choose. 100k for 1 day may seem good untill your blow your knee and miss 6 months... It's a gamble.
sort of, I'm a unionist in the sense that if your job was to stop, society would to a degree falter. For example, I work in Electricity Transmission. A service that not many think about, but critical to almost everything we do as a society.
12 dudes stop riding some bikes, world keeps spinning my dude. The bike industry literally wouldn't blink an eyelid.
So to a degree, have a union, but make sure your actions have impact on the industry you are in.
Union guy here and they definitely have their positives and negatives especially as they get larger.
The reason people compare this to other sports even though they are making millions more is that the events are not paying them the sponsors or teams are. Even look at Olympic sports they literally put their lives on the line and train/compete for years to get a gold medal. Yeah the government kicks in some money but most work full time jobs as well. They do it because they want to compete and be the best not for the payday.
I don't think there was that much on the line... Maybe if he won the Hardline series.. But, who knows what's in his Redbull and Santa Cruz contracts..
Just wanted to throw this out there. But for X-games, we all got paid for showing up. For our rights to be on the broadcast. Got a cheque from the Walt Disney Corp. It was 1000 USD. This was in 2013. Every athlete invited, including alternates got paid for appearing. that was blanket across all the sports.
Crazy to think back and say I an X games athlete
I support the riders 100%.
X games Had worldwide Recognition, non sports people knew about it or the people involved.
Nobody outside of knowing full well what crankworx is, knows about slopestyle... They wouldnt even have a clue to who the riders were.
Slopestyle is a Very small part of the bike world. small enough the sponsors dont pay heaps because........... its a small market that has no value..................
X games has a network TV deal though. I doubt CW has that type of revenue stream...
CW should just be grateful they get to do something they like.
It's not the riders fault CW can't get enough sponsors because they are'nt good enough at their jobs. They could oraganise parties as a side gig for extra cash and if they can't do that they should do something else and give the chance to other up and coming events who will do it for less money.
It is just supply and demand. If the market does'nt think CW is worth the money then they deserve to fail.
If they don't like the paying the riders they can ride the course themselves instead.
They can't expect riders to underwrite their 'lifestyle', if they can't afford to run events maybe they should consider getting better jobs /s
Slopestyle Riders - Boycott for Better Pay
Also Slopestyle Riders - Go home & double backflip in the desert with no health insurance & post to Tik Tok 8 hrs later.
here's a press conference from a couple days ago with some specifics. just seeing this morning b/c the youtube algorithm...could be old news.
I guess rather than comparing to NFL, NHL, MLB, etc, why don't we compare to enduro, dh and xc privateers? How many go years without a decent sponsorship, but manage to make it work. Lot of these guys work their asses off in the off season so they can do spend the summer racing all over Europe and North America. What makes the slope guys different? What makes them different than the other disciplines at CW? If they start to get appearance fees and travel expenses, is CW going to start giving the same to the other CW athletes?
I sympathize with the position the riders are in, but I absolutely believe it is the athlete's responsibility if they want to make a living from riding, not the event organizers. Some jobs are ridiculous difficult to make a living in, but people still choose to pursue them. Making a living from mountain biking is one of them. Making a living from a tiny little niche within mountain biking is even harder.
*edit* - I definitely agree with the riders when it comes to having a say regarding course safety, competition timing, etc.
I mean, you just said it right there. Why go to a competition with little chance of getting paid, when you can do that thing in your own backyard then post a video that does get you paid?
I'm not well versed in what they get paid or what they want, so I'm not picking a side here. But traveling to NZ isn't cheap. The riders are simply saying that if Crankworx wants a big competition with a deep field, they will need to help out finiancially. Otherwise the riders will choose to do things with a better ROI.
Also, the riders have said elsewhere the bigger thing they want is the safety aspect, and that Crankworx is making it all out to be about money knowing the general public will largely side with CW on the money front.
crankworx is 20 years old now. that first year it was basically just slopestyle (and a DH race, but that was still a side event to slopestyle). if it weren't for slopestyle, crankworx as we know it today wouldn't exist.
Stand with the riders.
https://www.bikemag.com/news/crankworx-responds-to-slopestyle-athletes
Did Crankworx have a response to the riders' requests? Is the series open to appearance fees?
"After receiving the athletes’ letter, Crankworx and the local organizing committee (LOC) assessed and addressed all three demands. While two of the demands have been answered with immediate action as well as written commitment, the third demand requested a EUR 2,000 appearance fee per athlete per Crankworx World Tour festival (a total of EUR 184,000 for the 2024 Crankworx World Tour). As Crankworx is the organizer of professional sports events within the Crankworx FMBA Slopestyle World Championship (SWC), no attendance fee can be offered to athletes. To support the athletes in attending Slopestyle events throughout the Crankworx World Tour, Crankworx has offered to raise the prize money by 37% as opposed to the initially planned 10%, compared to 2023.
The two demands that have been actioned immediately revolved around accommodation for alternates and more involvement in event scheduling and weather decisions prior to the event.
All changes and adjustments Crankworx committed to, will also automatically apply to all female Slopestyle athletes."
Is it feasible to provide housing and transportation? Is there a way to provide more for the riders? Is Crankworx open to a redistribution of the allotted prize budget to be more equitable?
"Housing, transportation, and snacks on site for competing athletes have been taken care of by Crankworx in the past. After the early conversations between Crankworx and the male athletes this week, Crankworx has agreed to offer upgraded accommodation and transportation for all athletes, including alternates.
After conversations with the (male) Slopestyle athletes over the past years, they made it clear that lower-ranked athletes need more support which led to the redistribution of the increased prize money from 2023 to 2024.
In addition to the prize money, Crankworx is committed to establishing a collaborative climate and making introductions between the athletes and the mountain bike industry to foster athlete support and sponsorship.
All changes and adjustments Crankworx committed to, will also automatically apply to all female Slopestyle athletes."
Have brands sponsoring the slopestyle event reached out to comment on the news?
"Crankworx has no information on whether sponsors have reached out to the male Slopestyle athletes."
How much money does Red Bull make off Crankworx?
Probably nothing. It's all part of their massive marketing budget. If they don't sponsor crankworx it wouldn't change their sales either.
Red Bull's profits in 2023: €1.56 billion
They print money. Crankworx is a rounding error on a balance sheet.
Exactly what I thought.
I don't toss all the nuance of my thoughts into these quips. But yes...and NO.
Part of the irony (huge fan) is they want input on safety but have careers being the most unsafe guys there are for zero dollars.
And the TikTok thing was to point out they don't make money either way.
95% of slopestyle guys make nothing online.
They make nothing on paper.
They get a frame and some parts and some clothes.
Maybe a per diem for food.
It's a vagabond sport.
Tom V literally rides a bike that doesn't exist for sale anywhere...for the better part of a decade.
Either your parents have a business in the background or you're just really good at rubbing 2 nickels together.
There are NO other athletic ventures that hide rider salary, their 1099 income, their sponsorship income.
These guys will always starve the longer the contracts are secrets.
VitalMTB can't publish annual salaries, product endorsement salaries or 1099 income for mountain bikers.
Not any other sport in the world has secret income.
The day GM, Gwin, Tom V, Semenuk, Zink get the balls to post their income from the sport is the day riders & racers get a foothold and a seat at the table.
I think social media has been a blessing and a curse for slopestyle/freeriders. In the early days of Crankworx, social media wasn't what it is today. I remember the days of getting mountain bike magazines in the mail and first seeing pictures of events, then you would have to wait until New World Disorder or some other movie to see actual video of events. Those DVD's I would order were usually the only way to see these athletes do crazy tricks. This truncated the number of times I would see these riders and tricks to a few times a year when I would get a magazine or new riding movie.
Today, nearly every freeride or slopestyle athlete has a decent social media presence, so we get to see crazy tricks every day of the week. In some cases, they make YouTube videos or Instagram posts showing them doing crazier tricks in their backyard than they do in competitions. Some riders have been able to leverage this to great effect, and in some cases, it's given guys a longer "career." But, in my opinion, it's made these events feel less "special." I think this is the same thing that happened to the X-games, in the early days that was the only time a year I would see skateboarding, FMX, or Freestyle BMX, etc, it was appointment viewing. Today, I can go to YouTube and watch 37 videos in a row of "extreme" sport clips that are crazier/more exciting than anything that's ever been in the X-games.
I hate to be a pessimist, but if Slopestyle was a Business, I get the feeling that it's currently in the Decline part of the lifecycle.
That's fine, but that doesn't really make any difference to the current landscape
Similar to what you were touching on, I think that exploring appearance fees could lead to very unequal outcomes. I bet Emil makes bank while people like Isted were scouring ebay to find a frame to compete a year ago. If the riders' value is that disparate for sponsors, it will also be for the people with the purse strings of an appearance fee.
Except the Emil’s of the sport are the ones sitting out to try to get an appearance fee for the rest of the field. The riders have said the whole reason they are asking for one is to ensure the best of the rest can afford to go to the show.
considering the majority of the field has to travel across continents for 3/4 events or a minimum of 2/4 events it’s not unreasonable to want food and some travel money to participate. Slopestyle contracts are often structured very different to racing contracts where the rider is paid a salary/frame/parts and has to take care of all travel and housing costs themselves.
now hopefully both sides can come to a middle ground that works for everyone. But if the athletes continue to compete with no progress made there is no incentive for crankworks to come up with a better business plan to accommodate the needs to the riders.
The top guys will join in for 3 reasons..
1) It still benefits them.. That is extra money in their pockets.
2) They know they have a limited time to make money in this sport. Get as much as you can while you can. And it can all go away in a split second.
3) Do you want all of you bros pissed off at you?
Post a reply to: Slopestyle Riders Boycott Crankworx Rotorua Because of Low Prize Pay, Lack of Appearance Fee