MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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RiderMikeCheck1 2/20/2022 11:12pm
2/20/2022 11:12pm
If you guys want to see the 2022 Rockshox lineup that's about to drop (minus the 38 Boxxer)... Just look at Flight Attendant parts that came out last fall. New Pike, New Lyrik, New Super Deluxe. They're all right there. They just haven't shipped the non Flight Attendant versions. Clearly because of supply chain issues. 38 Boxxer will be all over bikes in a couple weeks now that it's finally broke cover and World Cup around the corner.


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Primoz
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Primoz 2/21/2022 10:29am
2/21/2022 10:29am
Good point on the shock, forgot about it as the service manual wasn't available yet when I was taking a look at the forks right after release then forgot about it. I've mentioned the updates on the forks above though.

Regarding the shock changes (seen from the manual):
-there is a negative volume token now available on air shocks
-we'll see if only the new (purple) positive tokens will be compatible with the new shocks (it's a yes for Flight Attendant)
-the aircan doesn't have replaceable glide rings anymore, it has a factory installed backup ring that's non replaceable -similar for the main piston that has an additional non-replaceable bushing on the positive chamber side
-the main piston/sealhead has 34 mm wrench flats below the main seal (used to have them on the top, in the positive chamber, 17 mm?)
-the vise block for the sealhead service is still the old 3-hole brass block, no new tools needed there
-no obvious changes in the Flight Attendant version when it comes to the damping circuit and the sealhead, at least when it comes to the service procedure

So a bit more tuning options (up to 4 positive chamber tokens and 1 negative chamber token), improved guiding of the sliding components, likely decreasing friction, especially in side-loaded situations, likely helping out trunnion variants of the shocks, plus the hydraulic bottom out and adjustable high speed compression in top of the line analogue shocks based on what we've seen with Blackbox products.

Regarding supply issues, it would have shipped last year if it was a '2022' product. If it's a 2023 product, it would make sense, given RS/Sram launches, to launch it this coming spring. As is the expectation/rumor. Flight Attendant was a bit different as it only comes on complete bikes and that probably had to be launched earlier because said bikes were launched in fall.
RiderMikeCheck1 2/21/2022 6:41pm
2/21/2022 6:41pm
Primoz wrote:
Good point on the shock, forgot about it as the service manual wasn't available yet when I was taking a look at the forks right after...
Good point on the shock, forgot about it as the service manual wasn't available yet when I was taking a look at the forks right after release then forgot about it. I've mentioned the updates on the forks above though.

Regarding the shock changes (seen from the manual):
-there is a negative volume token now available on air shocks
-we'll see if only the new (purple) positive tokens will be compatible with the new shocks (it's a yes for Flight Attendant)
-the aircan doesn't have replaceable glide rings anymore, it has a factory installed backup ring that's non replaceable -similar for the main piston that has an additional non-replaceable bushing on the positive chamber side
-the main piston/sealhead has 34 mm wrench flats below the main seal (used to have them on the top, in the positive chamber, 17 mm?)
-the vise block for the sealhead service is still the old 3-hole brass block, no new tools needed there
-no obvious changes in the Flight Attendant version when it comes to the damping circuit and the sealhead, at least when it comes to the service procedure

So a bit more tuning options (up to 4 positive chamber tokens and 1 negative chamber token), improved guiding of the sliding components, likely decreasing friction, especially in side-loaded situations, likely helping out trunnion variants of the shocks, plus the hydraulic bottom out and adjustable high speed compression in top of the line analogue shocks based on what we've seen with Blackbox products.

Regarding supply issues, it would have shipped last year if it was a '2022' product. If it's a 2023 product, it would make sense, given RS/Sram launches, to launch it this coming spring. As is the expectation/rumor. Flight Attendant was a bit different as it only comes on complete bikes and that probably had to be launched earlier because said bikes were launched in fall.
I believe the products were slated for 2022 MY. At least most of them, but because of delays, yes, technically they'll be MY2023. I suspect the only changes between what we see with the Flight Attendant shock and Pike/Lyrik/Zeb will be updated dampers since there's a good chance we'll see a different damper then the Flight Attendant system that is hooked up to the damper. Possible another evolution of the air spring, but we'll see. I believe the Zeb spring and the C1 spring is a thing of the past soon.
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mitch160
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mitch160 2/22/2022 6:07am
2/22/2022 6:07am
Primoz wrote:
Good point on the shock, forgot about it as the service manual wasn't available yet when I was taking a look at the forks right after...
Good point on the shock, forgot about it as the service manual wasn't available yet when I was taking a look at the forks right after release then forgot about it. I've mentioned the updates on the forks above though.

Regarding the shock changes (seen from the manual):
-there is a negative volume token now available on air shocks
-we'll see if only the new (purple) positive tokens will be compatible with the new shocks (it's a yes for Flight Attendant)
-the aircan doesn't have replaceable glide rings anymore, it has a factory installed backup ring that's non replaceable -similar for the main piston that has an additional non-replaceable bushing on the positive chamber side
-the main piston/sealhead has 34 mm wrench flats below the main seal (used to have them on the top, in the positive chamber, 17 mm?)
-the vise block for the sealhead service is still the old 3-hole brass block, no new tools needed there
-no obvious changes in the Flight Attendant version when it comes to the damping circuit and the sealhead, at least when it comes to the service procedure

So a bit more tuning options (up to 4 positive chamber tokens and 1 negative chamber token), improved guiding of the sliding components, likely decreasing friction, especially in side-loaded situations, likely helping out trunnion variants of the shocks, plus the hydraulic bottom out and adjustable high speed compression in top of the line analogue shocks based on what we've seen with Blackbox products.

Regarding supply issues, it would have shipped last year if it was a '2022' product. If it's a 2023 product, it would make sense, given RS/Sram launches, to launch it this coming spring. As is the expectation/rumor. Flight Attendant was a bit different as it only comes on complete bikes and that probably had to be launched earlier because said bikes were launched in fall.
Was the service manual anywhere online by any chance??
Primoz
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Primoz 2/22/2022 9:04am
2/22/2022 9:04am
It is, you can find it on the product pages. Look for 'service manual'.
Philip_Rossetti 2/24/2022 11:33pm
2/24/2022 11:33pm
Not sure if this was covered before but MS Mondraker also seem to be thinkering with “High Pivots”
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Primoz
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Primoz 2/24/2022 11:39pm
2/24/2022 11:39pm
It was, I mentioned at the time that it looks like they only added the idler to lower the kickback, the pivots appear to be the same as before...
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DonutMTB
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DonutMTB 2/25/2022 2:41am
2/25/2022 2:41am
Fezzari has had select riders on what looks to be a new la sal peak releasing soon for a while. Looks like a curvier, more beefed up delano.



bikeboardorblade 2/25/2022 7:12am
2/25/2022 7:12am
I saw the Fezzari above last summer. No idea what the plans for release are, but reportedly it’s a significant improvement over the La Sal (assuming it would replace the La Sal, but no idea there either).
DonutMTB
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DonutMTB 2/25/2022 5:23pm
2/25/2022 5:23pm
better angle of the new fezzari enduro bike. march 1st release it seems.

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metadave
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metadave 2/25/2022 6:31pm
2/25/2022 6:31pm
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked them up and seemed to be fading slightly before that as well. Maybe it's just in Canada but they seem to have pulled an X-fusion and just completely vanished here in the north.
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luisgutrod 2/25/2022 8:59pm
2/25/2022 8:59pm
metadave wrote:
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked...
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked them up and seemed to be fading slightly before that as well. Maybe it's just in Canada but they seem to have pulled an X-fusion and just completely vanished here in the north.
I see their stock of items is healthy, at least in european dealers.. maybe just quietly doing business… their current offering is clear to me as well.. so no xfusion move hahaha (they really did cause some trauma with that revel fork…)
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Jrp 2/25/2022 11:15pm
2/25/2022 11:15pm Edited Date/Time 2/25/2022 11:18pm
metadave wrote:
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked...
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked them up and seemed to be fading slightly before that as well. Maybe it's just in Canada but they seem to have pulled an X-fusion and just completely vanished here in the north.
Come to ozzy The shit it’s everywhere and Apparently NZ is even worse haha
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Edthorne
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Edthorne 2/26/2022 7:19am
2/26/2022 7:19am
metadave wrote:
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked...
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked them up and seemed to be fading slightly before that as well. Maybe it's just in Canada but they seem to have pulled an X-fusion and just completely vanished here in the north.
I think part of the reason we don't see them much up here is the lack of reliable distribution. Both of their Canadian distributors are suspension service centers that also distribute a few brands, as opposed to a dedicated distributor like most other brands use. If they could get in with LTP, HLC etc. I think we'd see a lot more of their stuff out on the trails.

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Losifer
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Losifer 2/26/2022 7:23am
2/26/2022 7:23am
metadave wrote:
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked...
Since they're on the above bikes, has anyone heard anything from DVO lately? They really seemed to drop off the map after the year Giant picked them up and seemed to be fading slightly before that as well. Maybe it's just in Canada but they seem to have pulled an X-fusion and just completely vanished here in the north.
DVO has made improvements to the Onyx SC, more running changes than anything. New lower casting, bushings, coating on stanchions, air piston, damper seal head, compression tune… enough that I’m surprised they have been so quiet about it.
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jason.west.750 2/26/2022 10:57am
2/26/2022 10:57am
Those changes would be a huge press release from Rock Shox along with all sorts of new buzzwords.
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Whattheheel
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Whattheheel 2/26/2022 12:26pm
2/26/2022 12:26pm
And new standards making everything else obsolete...
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dolface 2/27/2022 8:06am
2/27/2022 8:06am
dolface wrote:
Trickstuff has pushed their re-opening back to March 1st. It was originally Jan 18, then Jan 23. The modal on their site says it's so they...
Trickstuff has pushed their re-opening back to March 1st. It was originally Jan 18, then Jan 23.

The modal on their site says it's so they can migrate to a new ERP (enterprise resource planning) system and I am not surprised by the date changes; migrations like that are brutally complex (I've led a few) and I was surprised they originally said they'd do in a month.

From the outside it doesn't speak especially well of whoever is managing the project though, and they have my deepest sympathies, this stuff is freakin' hard (and if they're trying to integrate w/ DT Swiss at the same time, just yikes).
Trickstuff's migration is not going well. They now say that they are starting from scratch and no longer have a date for when they expect to start selling stuff again: https://trickstuff.de/customerinformation-erp/
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Zero Cool 2/27/2022 9:43am
2/27/2022 9:43am
jason.west.750 wrote:
Those changes would be a huge press release from Rock Shox along with all sorts of new buzzwords.
Corrected for you:
those changes would be SEVERAL huge press releases from Rockshox along with all sorts of new buzzwords AND ACRONYMS. spread over 12 months (minimum).
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Will_Narayan 2/27/2022 9:46am
2/27/2022 9:46am
jason.west.750 wrote:
Those changes would be a huge press release from Rock Shox along with all sorts of new buzzwords.
Maybe because of supply issues ?
Maybe big names come first and smaller ones have to wait, and no need to really advertise your product if you can't deliver.
I wonder if it's not the whole point for DVO. After the Giant deal maybe they realized it was just not "their thing" to grow that much and prefer to remain smaller ? (though smaller shouldn't mean unvisible)

What about that Evil ebike for instance ? It seems to be finished no ? Could it be the same thing ?
Erwan_Ghesquiere 2/27/2022 10:18am
2/27/2022 10:18am
jason.west.750 wrote:
Those changes would be a huge press release from Rock Shox along with all sorts of new buzzwords.
Will_Narayan wrote:
Maybe because of supply issues ? Maybe big names come first and smaller ones have to wait, and no need to really advertise your product if...
Maybe because of supply issues ?
Maybe big names come first and smaller ones have to wait, and no need to really advertise your product if you can't deliver.
I wonder if it's not the whole point for DVO. After the Giant deal maybe they realized it was just not "their thing" to grow that much and prefer to remain smaller ? (though smaller shouldn't mean unvisible)

What about that Evil ebike for instance ? It seems to be finished no ? Could it be the same thing ?
Considering that DVO is just the mid-level brand from Tenneco (stuck between Suntour and Ohlins) it would be very unlikely that they don't allow for production slots for their own brand instead of third party companies. Also DVO and Suntour share a lot of components so again, not likely that their quietness is due to having difficulties finding production slots.
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baronKanon 2/27/2022 10:39am
2/27/2022 10:39am
Erwan_Ghesquiere wrote:
Considering that DVO is just the mid-level brand from Tenneco (stuck between Suntour and Ohlins) it would be very unlikely that they don't allow for production...
Considering that DVO is just the mid-level brand from Tenneco (stuck between Suntour and Ohlins) it would be very unlikely that they don't allow for production slots for their own brand instead of third party companies. Also DVO and Suntour share a lot of components so again, not likely that their quietness is due to having difficulties finding production slots.
Is DVO owned by Tenneco? I thought Bryson Martin jumped the tenneco ship to start DVO.
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Brian_Peterson 2/27/2022 10:48am
2/27/2022 10:48am
Erwan_Ghesquiere wrote:
Considering that DVO is just the mid-level brand from Tenneco (stuck between Suntour and Ohlins) it would be very unlikely that they don't allow for production...
Considering that DVO is just the mid-level brand from Tenneco (stuck between Suntour and Ohlins) it would be very unlikely that they don't allow for production slots for their own brand instead of third party companies. Also DVO and Suntour share a lot of components so again, not likely that their quietness is due to having difficulties finding production slots.
baronKanon wrote:
Is DVO owned by Tenneco? I thought Bryson Martin jumped the tenneco ship to start DVO.
DVO isn't part of Tenneco... When Tenneco bought Marzocchi, they didn't even want the MTB portion of the company.. Suntour tried to buy the MTB side, but Marzocchi wouldn't break up the company.
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slimshady
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slimshady 2/27/2022 10:49am
2/27/2022 10:49am
baronKanon wrote:
Is DVO owned by Tenneco? I thought Bryson Martin jumped the tenneco ship to start DVO.
I'm not sure Tenneco owns DVO, but DVO and Ohlins are manufactured by Suntour.
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Brevard_Bikewrench 2/27/2022 12:01pm
2/27/2022 12:01pm
The intense session seems to be shaping up nicely. Looks like a combo of the session and a Jekyll
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Erwan_Ghesquiere 2/27/2022 12:48pm
2/27/2022 12:48pm
baronKanon wrote:
Is DVO owned by Tenneco? I thought Bryson Martin jumped the tenneco ship to start DVO.
slimshady wrote:
I'm not sure Tenneco owns DVO, but DVO and Ohlins are manufactured by Suntour.
I clearly got mixed up but in the end manufacturing or owning, DVO, Ohlins and Suntour all come out of the same factory and machines. I heard that Fast Suspension also comes from that factory. For those not convinced just looks at Jade/TriAir, the Jade Coil and soin to be released Suntour coil shock, and I believe they also share some fork chasi components. I have a few friends riding the high end Suntour stuff and it is actually good stuff but I get how some can get butt hurt and down-vote you when realizing that they basically bough over priced Suntour.
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slimshady
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slimshady 2/27/2022 1:54pm
2/27/2022 1:54pm
Erwan_Ghesquiere wrote:
I clearly got mixed up but in the end manufacturing or owning, DVO, Ohlins and Suntour all come out of the same factory and machines. I...
I clearly got mixed up but in the end manufacturing or owning, DVO, Ohlins and Suntour all come out of the same factory and machines. I heard that Fast Suspension also comes from that factory. For those not convinced just looks at Jade/TriAir, the Jade Coil and soin to be released Suntour coil shock, and I believe they also share some fork chasi components. I have a few friends riding the high end Suntour stuff and it is actually good stuff but I get how some can get butt hurt and down-vote you when realizing that they basically bough over priced Suntour.
If you look at the old Monarchs from RockShox, you can see a lot of similarities with both DVOs and TriAirs. In fact, my TriAir has a DVO green anodized piston seal.
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metadave 2/27/2022 9:22pm
2/27/2022 9:22pm Edited Date/Time 2/27/2022 9:26pm
Well now that is just a stunner... Dear Intense, please bring back aluminum. Be the Renaissance Alu company making awesome metal frames again.





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