"Exciting" bikes

geometry

It’s funny to me, because the very thing on that thread that people were lambasting YT and Canyon for is the thing that I find exciting: bikes that perform well and represent a good value proposition. 

Fancy magical linkages, outlier kinematics, adjustable geometry, bleeding edge race tech… overrated. Give me a bike with surprisingly good component specs that works well for its intended use case at a good price point. I’m getting a little turned on just typing that. EXCITING!

$5k paint job.

The things YT and Canyon are doing are exactly what the rest of the industry is doing, just without the "middle man" of a local bike shop. They are cutting costs on the production side, making a cheap bike that looks high end and can be marketed as such, but the main goal of which is to achieve a high profit margin at a price point that is hard to refuse for the average customer.

If anything, I think they offer some of the lowest value on the market: their prices may be enticing — borderline disruptive — but when a derailleur cable replacement will cost you $200 at your local bike shop or take you multiple hours and expensive tools at home (yes, for real), the value proposition seems pretty poor. Not to mention their notoriously shoddy warranty departments.

The bikes that excite me are the ones that are bucking industry trends and appealing to people who ride hard and want a bike that works well but without needless frills. Simple, effective suspension layout and design; metal frames; external cable routing; modern, progressive but not excessive geometry; basic solutions to problems that have been overcomplicated; perhaps a frame that is aesthetically pleasing.... these things get me excited about a bike. The things that may be exciting in a catalogue or on a computer screen are often not the things that wow you when you actually get to lay hands on a bike.

Exciting is hard to come by. I think there are brands that are doing interesting things, but by and large I'm not blown away anymore. Digit and their strut design is way compelling to me, Esker and their Ti and Al full sus as well. Some of the bikes from Made using the 3VO sus design were drop dead gorgeous in their application of 3D printing (that Firefly was an eyepopper, and prob a wallet popper too). Ibis releasing the next gen AF frames had me partially regretting my recent RipmoV3 purchase. I appreciate the new design language on the Knolly's and the new Fuel Ex, and I respect the hell outta Banshee's designs for their modularity and that shock cage. With the carcinization happening for all the brands adopting Horst links it's difficult to get jazzed up about a lot of the latest n greatest when so many of the bikes end up looking like pre- high pivot Norcos. 

I don't necessarily love Orbea, but having the ability to make the Rallon either a world cup level DH bike or an enduro bike is pretty cool. Not exactly a value proposition if you're swapping suspension and drivetrain, but I still like that it can be done. 

I also really like what Shimano is doing with CUES/Linkglide. Affordable and durable combined with good and reliable performance interests me way more than a $3000 wireless drivetrain. If I was building up a new bike, I'd probably go with XT Linkglide 1x11. 

Based on Jeff KW's video it may be "exciting" but nothing anyone wants to purchase. Granted it wasn't a sponsored video, but I would be pretty pissed if I was Priority and watched Jeff's review. 

My take away is that its heavy AF, only really good for going downhill fast and not a great to pedal. Which is odd for bike that isn't a DH and has a unique drivetrain.

crab links: exciting or no?

This question genuinely has been confusing me for a while personally. I click on this and other bike websites multiple times a day (desk job obviously...). But for the last 2-3 years, maybe even more, there is virtually nothing that could actually excite me. 

My last 2 bikes are from the most boring brands Giant and Cube: both bikes are incredible by almost all metrics. I've tried every category of bike, most parts in aluminium and carbon, mid-range, top range and custom suspension, it's all great, but the bike is still a bike. I feel like you would need to actively try to have a bad bike setup these days if you are even slightly informed.

There are still some stuff on the ebike side that I look forward to, mainly the next generation of batteries, maybe a new generation of SL motors, will an MGU appear from one of the top brands?

So as with many things in my life, it comes down to looks. Taking the example above, I don't need or want an Orbea DH+freeride bike, but damn that thing is pretty to look at. An Unno Mith or DJI Crestline costs exactly twice the cost of my current new ebike, and literally the only reason to upgrade would be that they would look sick in my garage.

Yours sincerely, an ID Buzz driver.

Atherton is making exciting bikes. I'd go out of my way to check out an Atherton and make a comment if I saw someone with one in a lift line or on a shuttle.

I saw a '92 Bridgestone MB-0 ("zed") the other day. That was VERY exciting.

 For me, The new Zoceli rutina is an exciting bike

Raaw - their design ethos and reliability seem to be about as high or higher than anyone else at a reasonable price point. Now if they can get the new yalla dropouts on the madonna I would get one. Good geo, good adjustments, good kinematics and crab.

Frameworks - Everything above minus price point abd adjustment but a cool race program

Forbidden - Similar to the above brands but a bit more of an over complicated crab system on the analog bikes. I was a bit disappointed when I saw there ebike didn't have the adjustable dropouts but I think the new ebikes might deal with braking better than there old so maybe that's good. Good geo, some adjustments (depending on model), pretty good kinematics.

Specy - DH is still insanely cool. There DH program alone is enough to get me to look at them. I will say anyone that has a good racing program dh or enduro I am a fan of their company and will at least look at their bikes.

Commencal - Same reason as specy

Then we have all the other crazy ass brands I will most likely never buy but still like to look at, accelotti, egerie, Nicolai, Gamux. This list is probably endless tbh.

build quality.  For example what Neko has done with his frameworks in really trying to perfect a Ochain tweaked crab.  Might not be flashy but all the details add up to something very exciting.

In the opposite direction Everything gamux does.  Not sure how dialed their stuff is but they are consistently trying new things that seem somewhat innovative.

The Atherton is certainly doing cool stuff.

trek and specialized range from boring to gimmicky to pretty fricking awesome.  But for brands that big they are on the innovation side.  And not in a dumb way like Scott.  

Transition is pretty good at predicting trends and responding to feedback.  Some of the line up hasn’t really changed much at all lately.  And their design language is a little stale.  Still looks good but I like new for the sake of new.  Do dig the bottle rocket paint as too many brands are boring now.  But they do a pretty good job when they do introduce or update a model at being somewhat ahead of the curve rather than behind.  Almost everytime they release something it’s pretty clever and dialed when it comes to things like standards and geo.  And in the rare moment they get it wrong they are usually quick to fix.  Like headset cable routing on the repeater.

Hmm, well for me personally I can't think of any complex things that excite me be it electronic suspension, electronic drivetrain/dropper, high pivots, gearbox, etc. Although I absolutely want all the innovation and experimenting for the industry as a whole, as a buyer I just look at dudes like Asa and Jackson winning on what look like fairly stock / simple bikes (yes, I know they are tuned to their absolute MAX with the assistance of technology).

So as an 'average' customer ( see; BMXer who still doesn't know shit about MTB ) I am excited about brands offering builds/configs that are difficult to find elsewhere and thusly unique, which is def becoming a valid concern or desire in the current industry. The amount of 29er and mullet bikes with the same corresponding frame travel and head tube angle is mind-numbing.

I like the Dartmoor Jibbird, I like the Transition Bottlerocket, I like the Pivot Trailcat SL (arguably shortest travel bike designed to be mullet right now?), I even like that Polygon Trid ZZ for being one of the only stock slope/slalom bikes left. Or even rigid DJers like the Marin Alcatraz or Fairdale Hareraiser. I remember when I was getting into MTBing I constantly heard the term 'underbiking'. And I just don't see or hear that anymore because at this point even the XC bikes are getting pretty capable and impressive. And the hardtails, while DEFINITELY underbiking, are getting to be super slack 29ers like the Roscoe and Honzo and TransAM. Those are pretty CAPABLE bikes tbh, all around.

If I had to guess I don't think the industry rebounds away from that and underbiking becomes the hip cool thing again. To the extent people seeking out that adventure may have just gone gravel by this point. Especially as Eeb tech gets better and better, it makes all the sense in the world to basically have a DH bike that shuttles you up the hill, whether you're riding greens or double blacks. (Which is what we tend to see, don't see a lot of 'trail' type travel eBikes out on any trail.)

tl;dr with the way things are going it doesnt even seem hard to be exciting, just make a one off model that would have been run of the mill 10-15 years ago and its a marketing opportunity! (just please stop turning old beloved models into kids bikes or a different riding genre... lookin at ya Transition)

It's kind of hard to have exciting bikes anymore, even newish brands fall into the same kind of homogenous design, marketing, and aesthetic that a lot of other brands have. For me, an exciting brand is doing something new with linkage design, and philosophy behind their design, or they have a good story or idea behind their project. Brands that come to mind for me are Ministry cycles, and Frameworks respectively. Ministry is doing something different with their linkages and experimenting with the manufacturing techniques they use, while documenting the whole process in a really laid back way. I like the reasoning behind the design and the design philosophy entirely. Frameworks might not be exciting from a design perspective imo (the single pivot and floating brake versions being exceptions to that) but the whole story behind them and what they are doing with documenting the process is exciting. 

let me guess, you need an s or m frame?

When a bike makes me do funny noises or laugh out loud on a trail. Then I know, this bike is exciting. My old Kona Process was exciting. My Starling Swoop is exciting at the moment. 

Someone mentioned seeing value/decently priced bikes and that definitely gets me engine revving. Polygon's and Kona's recent launches have been just that. A combination of value and unique design is the Priority Vanth that just launched. Sounds like it doesn't climb very well but descends beautifully. After owning a Marin Mount Vision (the one with NAILD suspension) Im a bit biased towards liking the look of that rear end too.

Some hilarious and spot on comments here.  

When people ask me what bike to buy these days, I tell em its like deciding between a Porsche, BMW, Benz, Acura, Lexus, Caddy, Raptor, or one of other high end auto makers. They're all pretty darn good at the higher end. Its more about what flavor you like. 

As Eoin noted, looks sure do make a difference! 

as VandR noted, yea, I might get excited if I saw an unbroken Bridgestone MB0 actually being ridden, but I sure don't wanna go back to riding one of those noodles! 
 

An old adage from the hotrod car world: if it looks right, it is right. Does the same apply to bikes? To some extent, yes it does. 

And any brand that is spending a lot of money on racing certainly has more appeal to me as a backyard racer and a fan. 
 

Looks are definitely really important. But one thing that wasn't mentioned yet - maybe because people here are to core/experienced to give too much weight to journalists' opinions? - is good press. Specificlally, bikes being praised across multiple media outlets which I consume, because that makes me think they will perform really well. Also if a bike's described strengths profile matches either what I'm looking for or what I wish I could ride like (= soft spot for short travel play bikes like the 2030 or 5010, but also things like Bottlerocket). Worse reviews consequently do the opposite, even if I generally like a brand.

Brand identity is important as well, shaped by many things: bike design, brand voice, edits, sponsored personalities, race program but also exclusivity (to the last point: Specialized may offer excellent performance, but a Forbidden will definitely appeal to me more emotionally). 

A good negative example would be the German brand Radon. In terms of parts for money, they are unbeatable. They are even getting pretty good reviews in old school outlets who also do print, but have 0 presence in the media that I personally prefer, nor are they strong in any of the other aspects, so I would not consider their bikes except if I were on the tightest of budgets.

Lastly, as someone who still strongly optimizes on the performance for money front and won't splurge on "pointless" upgrades (yes, enjoying something has a point, but purely in terms of performance), getting access to more exciting parts via OEM specs is pretty tempting. YT is not super popular (and kinda dead) right now, but I loved what they did with the Uncaged 14 for example (Öhlins suspension, Hayes Brakes, 5 Dev cranks and Silver + Purple Title cockpit). 

I'm a Forbidden Fan boy. Druid and Dreadnought owner. Had V1's, now have V2's. 

Those bikes 'EXCITE" me

I think the "exciting" thing is highly personal. For me it's usually a couple things that make a brand "exciting"

Aesthetics - I'll find myself staring at my bike in the garage thinking to myself. "Damn that bike looks badass" That goes a long way for me.

Brand Identity - So marketing. I just think its a sick brand. Edits are cool, branding works for me. I've also had the opportunity to go to Cumberland and hang with the Forbidden team and that goes a long way in stoking me out. They are riders, they love biking, not just some big behemoth more concerned with the bottom line and appealing to a mass market. They do it their way.

Unique - Not going to go out and find a million Forbidden's on the trail. That kind of exclusivity is kind of fun. Feel like you are part of something 'unique'. People ask all sorts of questions about the bikes out on the trail and I love talking about them. 

Ride Quality - I'm not a super picky rider. Can get on any bike and figure it out pretty quick. Now days very few bikes suck, but when I get on a Forbidden I feel like it rips just a little harder. That all comes back to me being stoked on the bikes more than anything though. Look good, feel good, ride good right?

Brands like Specialized don't do it for me. Everyone and their dog has one, just have a big corporate feel to the brand in my eyes. I will say those bikes do ride good and price is always "good" comparatively, but I just wouldn't be as stoked when riding a Specialized. I also always find it funny when those big brands try and make "cool" marketing. It always feel so forced and filtered through 20 different departments before getting out. To me it just feels like you are supporting "the man" with those big brands.

Moral of the story. 'EXCITING' brands are a personal preference. I have no doubt there are folks stoked on Specialized, just not my cup of tea.

I hate that this is the reality, but its the reality:

Its hard for natural bikes to turn heads the same way ebikes can. Ebikes are the hot new thing. Mountain bike geometry and acceptable compression curves have settled and I dont forsee them changing much. 

IDK if this holds true for the industry, but what would excite me would be an ebike that drops the battery and motor quickly (under 30 min without specialized tools) to become a normal mountain bike thats a reasonable weight, all in a slim package where the downtube doesnt look lke a seahorse

https://www.transitionbikes.com/Bikes/Relay I mean... I think the issue is a) designing like that inherently makes the down tube larger since it's a container and not a pre-formed thing that 'completes' the down tube... And b ) if you make the down tube any smaller with this design the battery is gonna be laughable, even with a range extender.

And then c) it means you have to run Fazua lol. But otherwise I really like what they did with the Relay, and wish it was more of an industry standard, such that you could swap Fazua batteries with other bikes and have long term options and long term repair, etc.

Objective proof, being, the awesome Pivot Shuttle SL also running that Fazua system... In order to make it that small/light it's literally integrated in the frame, such that a battery swap would require a full drop out of the motor and all. So... Maybe there's a middle ground between those somewhere, but ya not sure if anyone is gunning for it and I'd love to see it. I think TQ would be a great candidate to position for that, being even smaller (and having already shown an interest in backwards compatibility and 'universal' mounting.)

Never been sold on the Fauza. The motor is still there in non-ebike mode. Also the DJI killed the lightweight category. 

Speaking of DJI, their battery is pretty dang slim. Makes down tubes look reasonable. 

Also there's Bonnell, which is a very, very interesting ebike (not their 7000 watt emoto)

I really like what DJI has done. And I think with a more TQ-like motor, there wouldn't be any 'need' to drop the motor. I get that its  weight thing but... I assume once you design a shell around accepting a motor, the idea of taking it out and just having a normal spindle go through a large box of emptiness is actually introducing MORE failure or complexity in ways. Not sure.

I said it in another thread, and I suppose it's relevant for this topic of what would excite me (about ebikes instead of... bikes), but: "Call me when ebikes have TQ size, with Fazua style pedaling/feel, with Bosch reliability, with Shimano pricing, and throw in DJI traction control as well..."

But ya as of now, I think the motor ticking the most boxes is the DJI, naturally. Although so far its quite expensive outside its own Amflow platform. Presumably that changes down the road.

To me, exactly what will come out tomorrow

Great geo, look like nothing else, ride feel like nothing else,

That doesn’t mean better than everything, but different, and it’s a match with my riding style so that helps 

As said above, quality construction, I hate dealing with poorly designed, poorly manufactured, poorly QC’d junk (YT, Canyon, my experience with Pivot etc).

The Arrival for me nailed it. Beautifully built to last a lifetime, modularity (esp with the mullet update), a silhouette that could be nothing else, and a clearly intended kinematic. It’s just so refined. Atherton are similar, though not modular. They’re expensive up front, but if you’re not flipping them every time a new form of cable routing comes out they are worth it.

I’m trying to think of anything else comparable at the moment no the Arrivals are no more and if not Atherton, probably one of the smaller Ti or steel builders.

For me there’s more excitement it well executed details than flashy branding or e-bikes. I own an ebike, it’s a handle tool, but that’s about it.