SUSPENSION COMPARISON - Let’s Go Racing Season 2, Episode 5 29

One of the most important components of any mountain bike is suspension. With no component sponsors this season, Brian Cahal is in a unique position as a professional rider to test and evaluate critical parts he will put on his Forbidden Dreadnaught for the EWS race season. In this episode, Brian dives deep into the on-trail performance differences of FOX, RockShox, Ohlins, and EXT forks and shocks. Enjoy!
Credit: Brian Cahal and Drew Boxold
Related:
Suspension
Let's Go Racing
29 comments

View replies to: SUSPENSION COMPARISON - Let’s Go Racing Season 2, Episode 5

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FullSend
1 year ago
As a privateer, I'd definitley have chosen the RockShox combo. Longest service life and most DIY friendly when it comes to maintenance and the cheapest service items. Doing DIY maintenance on anything FOX is a desaster.
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Adam943
1 year ago
As a suspension technician i had to log in to tell you how wrong you are. Its probably just the UK but RS is by far the worst for servicing life times. Most parts are buy to order which means when something breaks, its a 4-8 month wait. Seal kits are due in 2024. Its a joke.
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Roots_rider
1 year ago
Loving my Ohlins/Ext combo on the dh bike. Run both a little more on the open side for rough, flatter trails. More highspeed for steep with big holes, and more of everything for big jump trails. Currently running C40/R20 off of Ohlins specs. There’s a C20 and C30 tune in the settings bank. For those who find the ohlins on the heavily damped side, it’s something that’s easily tuned by a capable shop.
I personally still take a rebound shim out of grip2 dampers. Like mentioned in the vid, I feel like fox and rs tend to lean towards the safer and easier to get along with tunes for average riders. Light compression, and a “safe” amount of rebound.
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dirty booger
1 year ago
Too bad the new RS fork didn't make it.
It would be interesting to see how it fit in as they get much more support from the new damper compared to Charger 2.1. Going more towards the Ohlins route.
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yzedf
1 year ago
I doubt it’s going to be that big of a change. My 21 is plush on top like he said and ramps up hard at the end of the travel. Problem is to deal with big hits you have to keep the air pressure up. Adding more damping and messing with the air spring again doesn’t seem like a game changer. I’m waiting for the buttercups breaking pics to start showing up personally.
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Allen_Gleckner
1 year ago
Just started running the last generation lyrik (charger 2.1) 170mm. How much pressure above RS’ recommended settings are y’all talking? I’m finding myself with 3 tokens, a couple PSI over RS’ ‘ebike’ pressure, and 1 click of HSC from closed. 195lb geared up. Any tips? Sorry to highjack the comments with “what settings” question. Happy to move it too
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AndehM
1 year ago
Cross posting from YT comments:
Hi Brian, I ran into you at Northstar yesterday. I've been running EXT front & rear on my GG, and think I've noticed the same things as you with the Fox & EXT (haven't run Ohlins yet). Whenever I run the Fox setups, they feel really supple but I struggle to get enough support in the middle and end of travel. On my EXT, it's kind of the opposite: I can get gobs of support but struggle to get comfort for runs longer than a few minutes. I've had my Era v2 retuned with the light compression tune and even when running both compressions wide open at Northstar, the amount of vibrations transmitted to the bars made it difficult to hold on doing top to bottom runs, especially later in the day. I had the bushings checked for tightness and they were ok, and I make sure the seals are freshly lubed before riding. I also notice that when riding on the moderate grades where it's sort of washboarded, I see the fork flex forward/rearward rather than up/down, so I think I'm noticing the same thing as you with initiating travel. I love that support of the triple air chamber, so maybe on my next bike I'll try Ohlins.
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bikeboardorblade
1 year ago
I was talking to my LBS about that forward/rearward flexing in my Lyrik, and he was saying RockShox’s Buttercups would help address this.
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Cougar797
1 year ago
In a polite way I can’t see how that could be correct. Fore aft stiffness has everything to do with bushing overlap, bushing tolerance, , bushing set distances, and slider diameter. Butter cups simply don’t effect either. Sounds like the shop is trying to sell something.
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bikeboardorblade
1 year ago
It’s a fair question, and I honestly have no idea. This shop is 99% service based, and they’ve been straight shooters with me as long as I’ve been a customer. Perhaps it’s not so much of a stiffness issue, it’s how the buttercups absorb the resonance from the deflection.
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kcy4130
1 year ago
Yeah, chassis stiffness is not damper/air spring related at all. But, if fore/aft chassis flex is causing damper or airspring seals to bind or have increased friction then buttercups could alleviate that. Maybe the shop just stated it in a somewhat unclear way.
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TEAMROBOT
1 year ago
I don't think the shop was lying to you, but they were probably overstating the impact of Buttercups. Buttercups are designed to absorb ultra-high frequency/low force impacts that don't have sufficient force to push a traditional fork into its travel. Think about riding on gravel vs. riding through massive braking bumps- one of those scenarios is going to easily overcome the seal stiction in the air spring and damper of the fork, and the other scenario isn't. In this sense, Buttercups can help absorb some impacts that otherwise would just be transmitted to the chassis of the fork and would have to be absorbed by chassis flex, BUT they'd only be absorbing low force impacts so I don't think they'd be saving you from significant amounts of chassis flex.

On the other question, the Lyrik is just a flexy fork in a long travel 29" format. So is the 36, and probably so is the Era, too. It's just not enough fork for heavy or high-impact riders in a long travel 29" format. Buttercups don't alleviate the fact that 35mm stanchions were designed for 26" wheels and are heavily outgunned when you add an extra 2" of leverage on the end of the fork.
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mixmastamikal
1 year ago
@teamrobot the ERA is definitely not flexy in its 170mm configuration. I think far too much credit is given to stanchion diameter increasing stiffness. Wall thickness of the stanchion itself can increase stiffness in this portion of the fork just as much while simultaneously not adding to the additional surface area that sacrifices in static and dynamic friction properties. Additionally the EXT Crown/Steerer interface design is significantly stiffer and this is where a lot of the flexing occurs. I have talked to several heavier (220lb+) riders that have gone from 38mm stanchion forks to the ERA and they do not find it to be any less stiff.
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mixmastamikal
1 year ago
What air pressure ratio are you currently running in + & ++? We have found if people are running them too close in order to try and make the fork softer it can have a somewhat negative affect on the performance. I find this interesting though because I have been running the V1 since it came out and now the V2 (Both in mid "standard" tune) and also have an Ohlins RXF 36 M2 Coil that I have spent a lot time on. It is a great fork but I 100% feel that the EXT is superior in all facets for a rider that is really pushing hard. Last year I even stopped riding my DH bike and went to my GG for bike park riding because the ERA just felt so much better and controlled than my fox 40 that I have spent years dialing in but always find a it to be a sacrifice between plushness and support and my hands would feel better after a day of riding my shorter travel bike than my DH which seems strange. I am now using the Dorado Pro on my DH and I must say I am really surprised it is not a more popular fork. It does have some torsional flex that is noticeable in certain situations but I think it is well worth the trade off for how much better the damper and air spring feel. I think it blows the 40 out of the water in this respect. Far more small bump sensitivity than the 40 seams to be capable of while simultaneously having much better mid and end stroke support that has a smooth progression and is not like hitting a token wall. I just feel like something is missing for you on the ERA and I am not sure what it is. Really would like for you to have the same experience that I have had.
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lawn dart
1 year ago
to @TeamRobot:

"On the other question, the Lyrik is just a flexy fork in a long travel 29" format. So is the 36, and probably so is the Era, too. It's just not enough fork for heavy or high-impact riders in a long travel 29" format. Buttercups don't alleviate the fact that 35mm stanchions were designed for 26" wheels and are heavily outgunned when you add an extra 2" of leverage on the end of the fork."

I'm 200lbs and scared to death of doing the Windrock Red Bull drop with a single crown fork. Basically, I've seen it snap-off about 200x in my mind (none of these imaginings end well). Do you think that the Fox 38 is really the only solution for the flex issue (with 29"), or do you think that the innards count too? I'm looking at buying an Ohlins 36, is why I'm asking.
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Suns_PSD
1 year ago
These have been great and I've enjoyed them. I use Manitou suspension so would have liked to have seen it included but I understand there is a limit to how much testing money & time there is to go around. Thanks again!
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mcozzy
1 year ago
I'm surprised the x2 lasted the 2 weeks of the test. Reinforces my choice of ohlins coil though.
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