2018 Racing Rumors

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5/25/2018 2:45 PM

Pole's downhill bike prototype is interesting. Check out the bar/stem setup.

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5/25/2018 3:03 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/25/2018 4:35 PM


I dont mind the bike, its actually pretty nice but that bar stem setup... no thanks!
With a regular stem setup its a seriously good looking bike!






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5/26/2018 4:50 AM

Regarding the Pole:

Saw that Isak was running a prototype of that on his Pole endurobike in Nesbyen a couple of weeks back. Didn't have time to take a photo of the bike as it hang on the shuttle rack, but the stem-combo basically consisted of a metal block right on the top of the steerer tube, with holes drilled for a DM-stem a bit _behind_ the centre of the steerer tube. Basically like putting a stem on backwards.

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Mörkrostat kokkaffe.

5/26/2018 5:46 AM

@Big Bird,

The stiffness + alignment "issue" in normal compression shocks is actually because of bad fundamental engineering, for example, the 2010-2014 Demo breaking CCDB's shafts. It is not an advantage for pull shocks but rather an excuse to call compression shocks "bad" or "flawed". This "issue" is very easily and cheaply solved by using ball joints (spherical bearings) instead of bushings/bearings. Everyone in road racing uses ball joints, it is just that for some reason mountain bikes have gone the other way.

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5/26/2018 5:49 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/26/2018 5:52 AM

Well you have the Pivot Phoenix that requires an air shock due to a larger shaft size to provide additional stiffness in the frame. That and the in-plane nature of mountain bike suspension (in principle) compared to a much more 3D geometry of practically any car suspension design. That's why they need ball joints and mountain bikes possibly don't need them.

EDIT: every WP suspension shock on their site uses bushings, not ball joints. Plus a ball joint will not prevent side loads in shocks, they will still require thicker shafts, more bushing overlap and the like to work properly. With normal bushings and with a stiff enough frame design, you could actually prevent binding in a shock since each eyelet would hold it in line instead of the shock buckling. But that last part is more theory than practice i suppose

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5/26/2018 9:12 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/26/2018 9:13 AM



New V10 front end with lower stand over? Might also explain why they were all on last years frames at Losinj.
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5/26/2018 12:10 PM

jofish wrote:

New V10 front end with lower stand over? Might also explain why they were all on last years frames at Losinj.

I sure hope so! It will allow shorter people to size up in frame! Now they just have to add some rear tire clearance and come out with an aluminium version and I might consider getting one

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5/26/2018 12:13 PM

Dylan wrote:

Pole's downhill bike prototype is interesting. Check out the bar/stem setup.

I think the negative stem setup looks sick! So moto. I been riding 10mm stem for a while now on my Pole EVOLINK176 (their old DH frame) and love it!

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5/26/2018 4:01 PM

I think it looks fucking lame, but if your a 5'10" guy that whats to run a XL frame, then maby it would work for you.

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5/26/2018 6:17 PM

Too much! Actually 10 much. It’s nice to have some variance in frame dimensions , to fit different people,but I think a few have gone overboard and pole have gone off the deep end, unless you’re putting on a skin suit and ripping straight down a volcanoes for a speed record. Emphasis on straight. That has to suck in the turns

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5/26/2018 7:02 PM

jofish wrote:

New V10 front end with lower stand over? Might also explain why they were all on last years frames at Losinj.

Fred_Pop wrote:

I sure hope so! It will allow shorter people to size up in frame! Now they just have to add some rear tire clearance and come out with an aluminium version and I might consider getting one

Talked to the rep at the local demo the other day. He was pretty sure what you see next weekend is the production model of the V 10 29er.

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5/26/2018 7:06 PM

grinch wrote:

Too much! Actually 10 much. It’s nice to have some variance in frame dimensions , to fit different people,but I think a few have gone overboard and pole have gone off the deep end, unless you’re putting on a skin suit and ripping straight down a volcanoes for a speed record. Emphasis on straight. That has to suck in the turns

People said the same about Mondraker and their forward geo stuff. I have had 3 of their bikes and they ride amazing.
I am waiting for my Pole fully buying into the longer front end. I do agree, they do not fit everyone, however you could say the same about brands like Trek and Specialized and their overly small frames.

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5/26/2018 7:10 PM

We knew something new was coming rom Santa Cruz over the off season, as there were little hint here and there on instagram.
I was very surprised to see that the guys ran the old frames from last year to be honest or didn't have this new frame at the first World Cup of the season for some real world testing even if it was 1 or 2 practice runs.

Greg seems so particular when it comes to setup, but in the first syndicate video event Greg on last years frame with last years exact same shock he was still questioning things, maybe he doesn't know exactly what he's feeling down to a half a click there or half a turn there after all.

I took a few more frame grabs and lifted the shadows a little.






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5/27/2018 3:04 AM


Another photo of what looks like new V10 to me
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5/27/2018 3:56 AM

jofish wrote:

New V10 front end with lower stand over? Might also explain why they were all on last years frames at Losinj.

Fred_Pop wrote:

I sure hope so! It will allow shorter people to size up in frame! Now they just have to add some rear tire clearance and come out with an aluminium version and I might consider getting one

depeche4 wrote:

Talked to the rep at the local demo the other day. He was pretty sure what you see next weekend is the production model of the V 10 29er.

Think they'll have the new Saint in it

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5/27/2018 9:30 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2018 9:38 AM

grinch wrote:

Too much! Actually 10 much. It’s nice to have some variance in frame dimensions , to fit different people,but I think a few have gone overboard and pole have gone off the deep end, unless you’re putting on a skin suit and ripping straight down a volcanoes for a speed record. Emphasis on straight. That has to suck in the turns

And you know this because you rode it, right?
Look at MX bikes bar/ stem position..

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5/27/2018 11:03 AM

here's another shot of kiran's v10 from vital raw coming up shortly.

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5/27/2018 1:11 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2018 1:20 PM

grinch wrote:

Too much! Actually 10 much. It’s nice to have some variance in frame dimensions , to fit different people,but I think a few have gone overboard and pole have gone off the deep end, unless you’re putting on a skin suit and ripping straight down a volcanoes for a speed record. Emphasis on straight. That has to suck in the turns

Beez177 wrote:

And you know this because you rode it, right?
Look at MX bikes bar/ stem position..

I’m open to the longer front ends and short stems and the ultra steep seat angle and slack ha. I run a 28mm small stem on my dh bike and a 30mm on my trail bike and I’ve always upsized frames for a longer tt. I’m also really liking steep seat angles and still sliding my seat forward a touch more . I’d like to try a zero stem and I think ,if anything , pole should also use forks with less offset(that’s been working on motorbike choppers for years). I still think the tt and cs and wheelbase is to long on these and have little interest in trying them. It looks like an old rocky mt dh bike. Those were too long and sucked as well. The good and bad traits of long cs, tt and wb are well known. You can only counteract the bad traits soo much by shortening the stem and steepening the seat angle and the pole is maxed out trying to keep the front from pushing and the rear and wb agile in the turns. There’s no more help. Nice standover though so it has that going for it

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5/27/2018 3:40 PM

All of the syndicate riders are blacking or blurring out the frames on Instagram.

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5/27/2018 4:48 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/27/2018 4:49 PM

Hopefully they lower the SO on the nomad too and an aluminum v10 option. Final piece to their puzzle after years of short tt’s and limited SO

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5/27/2018 5:54 PM

grinch wrote:

Hopefully they lower the SO on the nomad too and an aluminum v10 option. Final piece to their puzzle after years of short tt’s and limited SO

I highly doubt there will be an alloy option. They have not had one for years.

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5/27/2018 8:54 PM

grinch wrote:

Hopefully they lower the SO on the nomad too and an aluminum v10 option. Final piece to their puzzle after years of short tt’s and limited SO

What're you smoking? TT on my xl nomad comes just above my knees, that's pretty darn low.

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5/27/2018 11:32 PM
Edited Date/Time: 5/28/2018 12:29 AM

grinch wrote:

Hopefully they lower the SO on the nomad too and an aluminum v10 option. Final piece to their puzzle after years of short tt’s and limited SO

Steam Roller wrote:

What're you smoking? TT on my xl nomad comes just above my knees, that's pretty darn low.

I usually just look at the numbers rather than use your approximate knee height but thanks for the valuable info. Isn’t lowering the so height on this new v10 part of the design?
Medium nomad-440mm reach/728mm so
Small gg megatrail 440mm reach/686mm so
Med Commencal Supreme sx 442reach/710mm so
Med yt capra 440mm reach/690mm so
Hmmm. All look like just around your knee height give or take 4 or 5 inches, I’m guessing. They only listed imperial and metric though



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5/28/2018 5:55 AM

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5/28/2018 12:01 PM

I'd say the most pressing missing piece in SC offering is the lack of decently angled seat tubes (not all this slack, offset malarkey they are doing now).

Also, SO measurements depend on the location (relative to the wheelbase) of measurement, so it's hard to compare between brands and/or models. Plus, knee heigh while riding or while standing beside the bike (given knee height i think i know which it is)? The riding one is also influenced by the BB height for example.

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5/28/2018 12:34 PM

grinch wrote:

Too much! Actually 10 much. It’s nice to have some variance in frame dimensions , to fit different people,but I think a few have gone overboard and pole have gone off the deep end, unless you’re putting on a skin suit and ripping straight down a volcanoes for a speed record. Emphasis on straight. That has to suck in the turns

Beez177 wrote:

And you know this because you rode it, right?
Look at MX bikes bar/ stem position..

grinch wrote:

I’m open to the longer front ends and short stems and the ultra steep seat angle and slack ha. I run a 28mm small stem on my dh bike and a 30mm on my trail bike and I’ve always upsized frames for a longer tt. I’m also really liking steep seat angles and still sliding my seat forward a touch more . I’d like to try a zero stem and I think ,if anything , pole should also use forks with less offset(that’s been working on motorbike choppers for years). I still think the tt and cs and wheelbase is to long on these and have little interest in trying them. It looks like an old rocky mt dh bike. Those were too long and sucked as well. The good and bad traits of long cs, tt and wb are well known. You can only counteract the bad traits soo much by shortening the stem and steepening the seat angle and the pole is maxed out trying to keep the front from pushing and the rear and wb agile in the turns. There’s no more help. Nice standover though so it has that going for it

As a owner of a Pole EVOLINK 176 with a 1340mm wheelbase, 63º headangle, 460mm chainstays and a reach of 520mm I can say hands down this is the best bike I have ever had! I'm 180cm (5'11"). My bike is an L. Sure an Pole in size XL (535mm) or a nicolai geometron in XXL (555mm reach) would probably be too much for me. That being said my bike works everywhere and not just in a straight line! I don't have any problems cornering or riding tight trails. On paper it seems like these bikes won't work but they actually work really well.

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5/28/2018 1:30 PM

grinch wrote:

Hopefully they lower the SO on the nomad too and an aluminum v10 option. Final piece to their puzzle after years of short tt’s and limited SO

Steam Roller wrote:

What're you smoking? TT on my xl nomad comes just above my knees, that's pretty darn low.

XL thats the thing, if I was to place a guess I would say you were over 6 feet tall with legs as tall as telephone poles. But you are right, the nomad has a relatively low stand-over height. The other bikes like the Tallboy and the Hightower, do have higher SO measures because they have to fit a shock that sits higher in the frame.

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5/28/2018 1:59 PM

Fred_Pop wrote:

As a owner of a Pole EVOLINK 176 with a 1340mm wheelbase, 63º headangle, 460mm chainstays and a reach of 520mm I can say hands down this is the best bike I have ever had! I'm 180cm (5'11"). My bike is an L. Sure an Pole in size XL (535mm) or a nicolai geometron in XXL (555mm reach) would probably be too much for me. That being said my bike works everywhere and not just in a straight line! I don't have any problems cornering or riding tight trails. On paper it seems like these bikes won't work but they actually work really well.

Not diminishing your own gains in riding performance, but does the bike react the same as a BMX Bike at-speed on a track?

This overall wide-berth of frame design must be like that of long-skis vs shorter. Each have a tune to the terrain, the result comes from the person choosing to find the limits. I am not a Skier tho...

BMX Bikes have not changed much in 20years, and even still have not changed much in about 35. A little more squat is it, aside form designing compliance and aero-effect.

There are alot of Mountain Bike riders who are looking for a direct ride quality to that of a BMX Racer. These Pole / Nicolai / Mondraker builds appear to be oriented toward the exiting of tight trail segments - all rides being equal of course.

Is this perception of it being 'best bike' from personal failure-points on other bikes or, does this bike ride w/ your being along for the ride? Some riders apparently expect that sensation, but this is a passive experience to some.

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5/28/2018 2:36 PM

Looks like Muddy is heading back over to Europe as a privateer again.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BjUFoh8DcVZ/?hl=en&taken-by=graemebobmudd

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5/28/2018 8:33 PM

oliosky wrote:

Looks like Muddy is heading back over to Europe as a privateer again.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BjUFoh8DcVZ/?hl=en&taken-by=graemebobmudd

I can't believe he didn't get another factory ride after trek!

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