May be nothing, but Gwin is wearing Alpinestars glove and shorts.. :dry: [img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2016/01/06/3140/s1200_image.jpg[/img]
May be nothing, but Gwin is wearing Alpinestars glove and shorts..
Not a coincidence. I called it in a couple of posts.
I've always wondered why or when the DH biking profession will get away from industry sponsorship. I don't want to drag this down the ski racing...
I've always wondered why or when the DH biking profession will get away from industry sponsorship. I don't want to drag this down the ski racing road again, but I guess I will. DH needs to get out into other corporate money if they actually want to make some (and most likely that is what Gwin is doing to some extent). Look at skiing or road racing for example. Names like DIscovery Chanel, Charles Schwab, T mobile, Barilla, Superfund and Audi for that matter. That is where the real money is coming from, not the ski manufacturer or bike company.
I was impressed to see Subaru(?) use one of the Mc Cauls (?) in their commercial's and thought "finally". Just because the sport may not have been associated with certain demographics in the past doesn't mean that it should stay that way. DH is becoming a far more family "friendly" sport with the advent of bike parks/resorts. I'll use Highland for example. I ride mostly with my son and, his crew of friends, dads. Amongst us is a software designer, a doctor, an engineer and (myself) Prosthetist. It's not a cheap sport and I think the demographic is shifting as people like me who have been riding since the 90's actually have careers and can afford to spend money in the sport.
My point is, I wouldn't get caught up on the frame sponsors capital resources..Gwin has probably reached far beyond that. And let's face it, the one thing that everybody gives him shit about, (being clean cut and no nonsense) may be the most marketable thing after all. Ratboy sponsored by Bank of America..not so much.
early 2000's cedric was sponsored by siemens tech/phone company, haro team had Lee jeans back in the day. CRC has some kind of paypal partnership right now. there are always outside industry brands nibbling around MTB but they all use the same formula...come in for a couple years w/ a marketing push and then they're gone.
Reality is mnt biking is not a sport that has great exposure, in fact, the only form of biking with decent exposure is road, therefore companies don't care
Gwin's salary is one thing, but setting up and operating a WC team that is capable of winning races is a different story. I'm talking about...
Gwin's salary is one thing, but setting up and operating a WC team that is capable of winning races is a different story. I'm talking about a team manager, transport/truck/pit setup in the US and Europe, masseuses, dieticians, admin etc. I doubt the world number 1 will be slumming it in the back of a camper van.
As Lee has said, each sponsor doesn't have to cover the entire cost of Gwin's salary or the team setup, but that leaves the question as to who has the infrastructure in place to make this happen in a relatively short timescale?
In my mind the only answer can be Martin Whiteley.
Martin must have something in the works, and what big time riders are left?
As someone mentioned earlier, there is a password-protected area on the 23-degrees athlete page with a Black Betty icon. I believe they've referred to the TWR big-rig as Black Betty before.
Houseman isn't his agent anymore, so who is?
It would seemingly all make such sense, except for the major falling out between Martin and Aaron during the Trek/Specialized fiasco.
More fuel to the fire, Alpinestars (as Gwin was spotted in) was the sponsor for Honda G-cross and TWR.
I'd completely discount Gwin riding for YT strictly because I doubt they have the money to pay him; however, I thought the same thing about Nukeproof...
I'd completely discount Gwin riding for YT strictly because I doubt they have the money to pay him; however, I thought the same thing about Nukeproof and Sam Hill...................
Why do Americans keep saying this?
Do you have any idea how many bikes YT are selling worldwide- They have zero overstock, they sellout on pretty...
Why do Americans keep saying this?
Do you have any idea how many bikes YT are selling worldwide- They have zero overstock, they sellout on pretty much every model, run no factories, employ minimal staff.
They run the epitome of a lean business model, and have been doing so since forming over 5 years ago and you think they dont have enough money to offer a frame sponsorship, not run a team, just offer a frame sponsorship.
And CRC, are you serious, they own multiple brands are the worlds biggest cycling retailer, but you dont think they can afford to pay Hills wage?
You realise that the bulk in which these companies order mean that even the YT tues you think you're getting a great deal on probably makes them 50% profit per unit.
not to mention the exchange rate in paying an athlete from a country with a weaker currency
Exactly. It comes down to how budgets are used. As a smaller company, YT might only have, say, 800K (I doubt it's that low) allocated for global marketing but if they decide it's a good move to put 40% of that towards developing a DH program that includes Gwin, then there's your salary and a good bit of expenses. It's pretty simple really. And if they are planning to develop a WCDH platform, they already have product devo money earmarked that doesn't come out of the marketing budget.
Can we believe anything anyone says on here, they are called rumors for a reason.
Whilst you say that...
There are 3-4 People in this forum who are definitely in the loop both Worldcup and Industry wise.
Information supplied by myself in the early stages, only rendered to be true ( athertons on Trek , Brook on GT , George ( commencal) Bruni on specialized)
Maybe called team rumors - But we cracked the egg on alot of it .
First real confirmation ???
[img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2016/01/06/3141/s1200_p4pb13042513.jpg[/img]
First real confirmation ???
The only thing this confirms is that we have a leak in our advertising...
Capra means "goat" and the fox is well...Fox suspension. It is allusion to a dark Fairy Tale. Component specs are decided long before any of the race seasons have finished....
So do you also realize that since they are different companies, KTM motorcycles has zero competition from any mountain bike company? That's a pretty non-existent issue...
So do you also realize that since they are different companies, KTM motorcycles has zero competition from any mountain bike company? That's a pretty non-existent issue, and if you want to talk about brand communication, I think it's a way bigger deal that a totally different company is making KTM bikes, which are supposedly pretty whack.
Exactly. That's what I'm saying. It's not an issue for "moto" KTM, but it would be an issue for [i]another [/i]frame supplier/sponsor. Especially if [b]that[/b] supplier...
Exactly. That's what I'm saying. It's not an issue for "moto" KTM, but it would be an issue for another frame supplier/sponsor. Especially if that supplier is not a big, long-standing brand. I would assume Gwin isn't just asking for product, so the frame supplier would have to fork over major cash and then share branding space with a huge, internationally known brand that also happens to have licensed their name and logo for a line of bikes.
So, in regards to my first scenario (whereby KTM is the main sponsor), I just don't see how a bike brand would want to fork over a bunch of money to Gwin just to ride their frames. Consider if they did and they happened to get a really banger shot of Gwin at a World Cup just destroying the field, the value of the shot is gonna suffer because he's COVERED in KTM logos. Are you (as bike brand X's marketing manager) gonna buy that shot and pay thousands to put it in a magazine where it could end up next a full page ad for KTM mountain bikes? Basically, if you (as a bike brand) co-sponsor a KTM-headlined program you will without a doubt be helping KTM bicycles sell bikes. Maybe you believe you'll get a greater benefit than they will, but it's a quandary nonetheless.
If you think it won't be confusing, look at any press release about a high-profile rider signing with Fox (either head or tail) and read the comments. It'll be like that, but 100x more confusing to the average consumer.
Gwin to a Whitely-run program with KTM as the primary sponsor and a custom bike is my best guess. Who ran the Honda G-cross team?
You're probably right for most bike companies. But I think for YT it would still be a slam dunk based on how new the company is. People in this thread even are questioning the Tues as a race bike, so the fact that they could jump into the DH market is big time incentive.
I still think the possible confusion is exaggerated. Likely more people would be aware that Gwin is on a YT frame then think KTM must make a sweet dh bike. I have no clue what Madison and MS do, and it wasn't too long ago that I finally found out what GSTAAD was. For all I know they could be direct competitors. I'm sure you've paid attention long enough to see that the bike always gets the recognition, and often even the blame or credit.
I think its funny how we all talk about YT like we've seen the P&L and are familiar with their balance sheet. Who knows. Maybe they are backed by some PE firm with deep pockets. Or maybe they're just killing it. We have no idea.
The only thing this confirms is that we have a leak in our advertising...
Capra means "goat" and the fox is well...Fox suspension. It is allusion...
The only thing this confirms is that we have a leak in our advertising...
Capra means "goat" and the fox is well...Fox suspension. It is allusion to a dark Fairy Tale. Component specs are decided long before any of the race seasons have finished....
So do you also realize that since they are different companies, KTM motorcycles has zero competition from any mountain bike company? That's a pretty non-existent issue...
So do you also realize that since they are different companies, KTM motorcycles has zero competition from any mountain bike company? That's a pretty non-existent issue, and if you want to talk about brand communication, I think it's a way bigger deal that a totally different company is making KTM bikes, which are supposedly pretty whack.
Exactly. That's what I'm saying. It's not an issue for "moto" KTM, but it would be an issue for [i]another [/i]frame supplier/sponsor. Especially if [b]that[/b] supplier...
Exactly. That's what I'm saying. It's not an issue for "moto" KTM, but it would be an issue for another frame supplier/sponsor. Especially if that supplier is not a big, long-standing brand. I would assume Gwin isn't just asking for product, so the frame supplier would have to fork over major cash and then share branding space with a huge, internationally known brand that also happens to have licensed their name and logo for a line of bikes.
So, in regards to my first scenario (whereby KTM is the main sponsor), I just don't see how a bike brand would want to fork over a bunch of money to Gwin just to ride their frames. Consider if they did and they happened to get a really banger shot of Gwin at a World Cup just destroying the field, the value of the shot is gonna suffer because he's COVERED in KTM logos. Are you (as bike brand X's marketing manager) gonna buy that shot and pay thousands to put it in a magazine where it could end up next a full page ad for KTM mountain bikes? Basically, if you (as a bike brand) co-sponsor a KTM-headlined program you will without a doubt be helping KTM bicycles sell bikes. Maybe you believe you'll get a greater benefit than they will, but it's a quandary nonetheless.
If you think it won't be confusing, look at any press release about a high-profile rider signing with Fox (either head or tail) and read the comments. It'll be like that, but 100x more confusing to the average consumer.
Gwin to a Whitely-run program with KTM as the primary sponsor and a custom bike is my best guess. Who ran the Honda G-cross team?
You're probably right for most bike companies. But I think for YT it would still be a slam dunk based on how new the company is...
You're probably right for most bike companies. But I think for YT it would still be a slam dunk based on how new the company is. People in this thread even are questioning the Tues as a race bike, so the fact that they could jump into the DH market is big time incentive.
I still think the possible confusion is exaggerated. Likely more people would be aware that Gwin is on a YT frame then think KTM must make a sweet dh bike. I have no clue what Madison and MS do, and it wasn't too long ago that I finally found out what GSTAAD was. For all I know they could be direct competitors. I'm sure you've paid attention long enough to see that the bike always gets the recognition, and often even the blame or credit.
madison are a big deal in the uk cycling industry...
I think its funny how we all talk about YT like we've seen the P&L and are familiar with their balance sheet. Who knows. Maybe they...
I think its funny how we all talk about YT like we've seen the P&L and are familiar with their balance sheet. Who knows. Maybe they are backed by some PE firm with deep pockets. Or maybe they're just killing it. We have no idea.
Hahaha so true. Careful picking on the internet CFOs and CMOs... haha
And what about Mitch Ropelato ?! Would love to see him on Specialized Factory with Troy !
I remember an Instagram with him saying that he is racing World Cups this year, but I guess I am just assuming he will be with Troy on the factory team.
I'd completely discount Gwin riding for YT strictly because I doubt they have the money to pay him; however, I thought the same thing about Nukeproof...
I'd completely discount Gwin riding for YT strictly because I doubt they have the money to pay him; however, I thought the same thing about Nukeproof and Sam Hill...................
Why do Americans keep saying this?
Do you have any idea how many bikes YT are selling worldwide- They have zero overstock, they sellout on pretty...
Why do Americans keep saying this?
Do you have any idea how many bikes YT are selling worldwide- They have zero overstock, they sellout on pretty much every model, run no factories, employ minimal staff.
They run the epitome of a lean business model, and have been doing so since forming over 5 years ago and you think they dont have enough money to offer a frame sponsorship, not run a team, just offer a frame sponsorship.
And CRC, are you serious, they own multiple brands are the worlds biggest cycling retailer, but you dont think they can afford to pay Hills wage?
You realise that the bulk in which these companies order mean that even the YT tues you think you're getting a great deal on probably makes them 50% profit per unit.
not to mention the exchange rate in paying an athlete from a country with a weaker currency
Exactly. It comes down to how budgets are used. As a smaller company, YT might only have, say, 800K (I doubt it's that low) allocated for...
Exactly. It comes down to how budgets are used. As a smaller company, YT might only have, say, 800K (I doubt it's that low) allocated for global marketing but if they decide it's a good move to put 40% of that towards developing a DH program that includes Gwin, then there's your salary and a good bit of expenses. It's pretty simple really. And if they are planning to develop a WCDH platform, they already have product devo money earmarked that doesn't come out of the marketing budget.
To be fair, no I have no idea how many frames/bikes YT is selling worldwide. Nor do I know how Specialized decides to spend it's money. I believe that Specialized has gobs more money than YT does, strictly because of how many bikes are in their arsenal, and that they sell these bikes almost everywhere.
I'd prefer to see Gwin on an American platform, Intense still makes DH rigs....... and I know it isn't up to me. I still think it was less about money and more about team ownership/structure.
As for the graphic, GOAT has traditionally been used when describing Peaty. In addition, the lettering underneath "New Breed" isn't centered, and it's pretty blurry, so I think it's fake.
To be fair, no I have no idea how many frames/bikes YT is selling worldwide. Nor do I know how Specialized decides to spend it's money...
To be fair, no I have no idea how many frames/bikes YT is selling worldwide. Nor do I know how Specialized decides to spend it's money. I believe that Specialized has gobs more money than YT does, strictly because of how many bikes are in their arsenal, and that they sell these bikes almost everywhere.
I'd prefer to see Gwin on an American platform, Intense still makes DH rigs....... and I know it isn't up to me. I still think it was less about money and more about team ownership/structure.
As for the graphic, GOAT has traditionally been used when describing Peaty. In addition, the lettering underneath "New Breed" isn't centered, and it's pretty blurry, so I think it's fake.
You know, like formula one...
Wrong sorry, that's not Jacob Dickson on a nukeproof (he'd be on the new pulse) and last time I checked he didn't have a sex change :-)
Apparently they were the only ones who could get him close to baby Jesus.
As someone mentioned earlier, there is a password-protected area on the 23-degrees athlete page with a Black Betty icon. I believe they've referred to the TWR big-rig as Black Betty before.
Houseman isn't his agent anymore, so who is?
It would seemingly all make such sense, except for the major falling out between Martin and Aaron during the Trek/Specialized fiasco.
More fuel to the fire, Alpinestars (as Gwin was spotted in) was the sponsor for Honda G-cross and TWR.
http://dirtmountainbike.com/racing-events/movers-shakers-downhill-racer…
Gwin on...
There are 3-4 People in this forum who are definitely in the loop both Worldcup and Industry wise.
Information supplied by myself in the early stages, only rendered to be true ( athertons on Trek , Brook on GT , George ( commencal) Bruni on specialized)
Maybe called team rumors - But we cracked the egg on alot of it .
Kinda forgot Laurie Greenland. I gotta think he'll end up on whatever program Martin is cooking up.
it's how most of the teams are run.
Capra means "goat" and the fox is well...Fox suspension. It is allusion to a dark Fairy Tale. Component specs are decided long before any of the race seasons have finished....
so the pic was not released to the public before - thanks for stepping in and clearing that up
I still think the possible confusion is exaggerated. Likely more people would be aware that Gwin is on a YT frame then think KTM must make a sweet dh bike. I have no clue what Madison and MS do, and it wasn't too long ago that I finally found out what GSTAAD was. For all I know they could be direct competitors. I'm sure you've paid attention long enough to see that the bike always gets the recognition, and often even the blame or credit.
http://www.madison.co.uk
I'd prefer to see Gwin on an American platform, Intense still makes DH rigs....... and I know it isn't up to me. I still think it was less about money and more about team ownership/structure.
As for the graphic, GOAT has traditionally been used when describing Peaty. In addition, the lettering underneath "New Breed" isn't centered, and it's pretty blurry, so I think it's fake.
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