my guess with the concentric rear pivot. Hard to tell if the brake is on the the chainstay or seatstay though. This design would typically...
my guess with the concentric rear pivot. Hard to tell if the brake is on the the chainstay or seatstay though. This design would typically be chainstay mounted.
lots of bulk down by the bb though also. Hard to say what else could be going on
You just drew a Devinci Wilson, I doubt it’s that straight forward, I doubt Canyon would do a direct copy like that, but they could put...
You just drew a Devinci Wilson, I doubt it’s that straight forward, I doubt Canyon would do a direct copy like that, but they could put a slight spin on the same design…
If the brake mount is on the chainstay it’s likely a very similar design to what I drew before. The forbidden supernought is arguably very similar...
If the brake mount is on the chainstay it’s likely a very similar design to what I drew before. The forbidden supernought is arguably very similar also. It’s just a Horst link instead of a split pivot.
The split pivot version keeping a true single pivot axle path.
If the brake is mounted to the seatstay. It’s possibly a 6 bar as Ortogonal mentioned. Something like this-ish. Purple link floating somewhere between light blue and yellow.
Without a closer look I'm not sure if the lower link is concentric to the BB or not, but I think you're probably right with the six-bar. Plus the split pivot allows you (in theory) to completely change the anti-rise by changing the link the brake is mounted to, while keeping everything else the the same kinematics-wise.
You just drew a Devinci Wilson, I doubt it’s that straight forward, I doubt Canyon would do a direct copy like that, but they could put...
You just drew a Devinci Wilson, I doubt it’s that straight forward, I doubt Canyon would do a direct copy like that, but they could put a slight spin on the same design…
If the brake mount is on the chainstay it’s likely a very similar design to what I drew before. The forbidden supernought is arguably very similar...
If the brake mount is on the chainstay it’s likely a very similar design to what I drew before. The forbidden supernought is arguably very similar also. It’s just a Horst link instead of a split pivot.
The split pivot version keeping a true single pivot axle path.
If the brake is mounted to the seatstay. It’s possibly a 6 bar as Ortogonal mentioned. Something like this-ish. Purple link floating somewhere between light blue and yellow.
Without a closer look I'm not sure if the lower link is concentric to the BB or not, but I think you're probably right with the...
Without a closer look I'm not sure if the lower link is concentric to the BB or not, but I think you're probably right with the six-bar. Plus the split pivot allows you (in theory) to completely change the anti-rise by changing the link the brake is mounted to, while keeping everything else the the same kinematics-wise.
With how bulky the bb area looks, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a concentric pivot there. And not a lot of room with the rear tire. Hopefully someone can snap a picture showing the rear brake mount at some point.
I haven’t had the opportunity to draw up a 6 bar on linkage. Had a hard time getting it to work when the supreme came out, haven’t tried again since then. So not sure how much the anti rise would change going from chainstay to seatstay in that situation.
The single pivot, Wilson-esque design is pretty obvious that it would go on the chainstay, otherwise your anti-rise goes through the roof.
If the brake mount is on the chainstay it’s likely a very similar design to what I drew before. The forbidden supernought is arguably very similar...
If the brake mount is on the chainstay it’s likely a very similar design to what I drew before. The forbidden supernought is arguably very similar also. It’s just a Horst link instead of a split pivot.
The split pivot version keeping a true single pivot axle path.
If the brake is mounted to the seatstay. It’s possibly a 6 bar as Ortogonal mentioned. Something like this-ish. Purple link floating somewhere between light blue and yellow.
Without a closer look I'm not sure if the lower link is concentric to the BB or not, but I think you're probably right with the...
Without a closer look I'm not sure if the lower link is concentric to the BB or not, but I think you're probably right with the six-bar. Plus the split pivot allows you (in theory) to completely change the anti-rise by changing the link the brake is mounted to, while keeping everything else the the same kinematics-wise.
With how bulky the bb area looks, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a concentric pivot there. And not a lot of room with the rear...
With how bulky the bb area looks, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a concentric pivot there. And not a lot of room with the rear tire. Hopefully someone can snap a picture showing the rear brake mount at some point.
I haven’t had the opportunity to draw up a 6 bar on linkage. Had a hard time getting it to work when the supreme came out, haven’t tried again since then. So not sure how much the anti rise would change going from chainstay to seatstay in that situation.
The single pivot, Wilson-esque design is pretty obvious that it would go on the chainstay, otherwise your anti-rise goes through the roof.
Gut feeling, but I would say that is very much dependant on the geometry of the two short links and the dogbone as they define the movement of the seatstay and chainstay. And that will of course define how much antirise you will have depending on which you mount the brake to.
FWIW, commencal did move the pivot on the Supreme V5 mid development, it used to be on the seatstay and is on the chainstay for the production model. That means the brake is mounted, effectively, to the other link (was on the chainstay, is now on the seatstay).
The front didn't fall off this one so must be from a different batch than BK's?
The front didn't fall off this one so must be from a different batch than BK's?
Must be a different version? I think Dane has had his for a while, and yet Ryan Griffiths just got one recently im pretty sure, but i thought i saw photos of him riding on the old one at this event
Heard that Charger 3.1 dampener upgrade coming out in June, and that it's features more high compression/adjustment. That the current version, the high speed adjuster really...
Heard that Charger 3.1 dampener upgrade coming out in June, and that it's features more high compression/adjustment. That the current version, the high speed adjuster really doesn't do much and doesn't add enough compression, and something along the lines of using the new Boxxer piston, which flows more oil. That part I could be remembering incorrectly though
From 'another' site. Max's Cannondale Dave has a revised looking Bomber DJ .... new air cap and Damper adjuster. Very different decals and Gloss CSU and Lowers. Current bomber DJ's are on a mega sale .... Makes me think Marzocchi is getting more hand-me-down tech from Fox, since it's seems like Fox is refreshing their damper/(forks?) range ....
Maybe Marzocchi will be getting a refresh across the board around the same time and maybe the Marzocchi Super Z (38mm) will be released at the same time.
There also seems to be a small "belly" close to the BB on the new Canyon. The outline almost looks like it's a cover of some sort. Could the shock be mounted vertically and be actuated by an upper link if it indeed a 6-bar ?
Edit: from this photo (from Vital pre-race interviews) you can clearly see a link in the bottom bracket area. This would fit with both the "Devinci" theory and the 6-bar theory. I also wonder if the vertical thick element behind the idler is part of the front triangle or is a vertical member in a 6-bar design (oh I missed nerding out on this stuff 😆)
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic people have been with these brakes the second they hear 'China' Wait till they find out where 90% of bike parts are made. Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic...
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic people have been with these brakes the second they hear 'China' Wait till they find out where 90% of bike parts are made. Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
I don't think it's xenophobia as much as it is that they appear to be a straight rip-off off of Trickstuff.
Will be interesting to see if DT Swiss feels the same way (and does something about it).
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic...
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic people have been with these brakes the second they hear 'China' Wait till they find out where 90% of bike parts are made. Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
First, it's not "xenophobic" to try to avoid buying MIC goods if the issue is philosophical and political. China is our enemy, Xi is an authoritarian communist who commits genocide. It was a horrible mistake to partner with China and offshore our manufacturing to them in the first place.
Second, Taiwan and China are not the same country despite what Xi thinks. There's a MASSIVE difference between the two and if you won't buy Taiwanese goods then that may have an underlying xenophobic reason.
Last, Lewis is a direct rip off of another company's IP. Not everyone is ok with this. I'm not. If you are, why? So you can benefit from others' work without fair compensation? Cause that's EXACTLY what it comes down to.
Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
You think you deserve Trickstuff's brakes without compensating them for their work. I'm not xenophobic, but you have some obvious ethical blind spots.
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic...
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic people have been with these brakes the second they hear 'China' Wait till they find out where 90% of bike parts are made. Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
First, it's not "xenophobic" to try to avoid buying MIC goods if the issue is philosophical and political. China is our enemy, Xi is an authoritarian...
First, it's not "xenophobic" to try to avoid buying MIC goods if the issue is philosophical and political. China is our enemy, Xi is an authoritarian communist who commits genocide. It was a horrible mistake to partner with China and offshore our manufacturing to them in the first place.
Second, Taiwan and China are not the same country despite what Xi thinks. There's a MASSIVE difference between the two and if you won't buy Taiwanese goods then that may have an underlying xenophobic reason.
Last, Lewis is a direct rip off of another company's IP. Not everyone is ok with this. I'm not. If you are, why? So you can benefit from others' work without fair compensation? Cause that's EXACTLY what it comes down to.
Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
You think you deserve Trickstuff's brakes without compensating them for their work. I'm not xenophobic, but you have some obvious ethical blind spots.
Apparently Trickstuff let their patent lapse or there was some issue with their patent while this underwent development, not sure on the details but just a rumor I read online.
I've watched the teardown video and I wouldn't go out and say its a Trickstuff carbon copy.
Also not sure why you think I wouldn't buy parts from Taiwan? I'm just looking for the best product for the best price, I also just purchased the Lollipop driver set directly from 711L in Taiwan after hearing about them from the PB podcast.
While I don't ethically agree with everything China does, I'm also not gonna pretend that buying mountain bike brakes is somehow supporting genocide? America isn't exactly an angel either, so I'm not gonna think about the political impact of my mountain bike purchasing decisions haha. I see a great product at a great price point. Lewis seems to be offering a great product at a great price and you're just going off the rails here about Xi's genocide and how he runs the country? Dude I'm just looking for good brakes. If you don't want to buy them, then don't.
Apparently Trickstuff let their patent lapse or there was some issue with their patent while this underwent development, not sure on the details but just a...
Apparently Trickstuff let their patent lapse or there was some issue with their patent while this underwent development, not sure on the details but just a rumor I read online.
I've watched the teardown video and I wouldn't go out and say its a Trickstuff carbon copy.
Also not sure why you think I wouldn't buy parts from Taiwan? I'm just looking for the best product for the best price, I also just purchased the Lollipop driver set directly from 711L in Taiwan after hearing about them from the PB podcast.
While I don't ethically agree with everything China does, I'm also not gonna pretend that buying mountain bike brakes is somehow supporting genocide? America isn't exactly an angel either, so I'm not gonna think about the political impact of my mountain bike purchasing decisions haha. I see a great product at a great price point. Lewis seems to be offering a great product at a great price and you're just going off the rails here about Xi's genocide and how he runs the country? Dude I'm just looking for good brakes. If you don't want to buy them, then don't.
What patent did Lewis violate that was held by Trickstuff?
I'm in no way disputing they look identical and similar, but that doesn't constitute a patent violation. Some functional aspect of the brake would've needed to be duplicated that was patented by Trickstuff, there are only so many things unique they are doing (maybe the clamp or lever pivot?). If anything the Lewis design is slightly more innovative because it allows you to rotate the cam in the lever to adjust lever progression, something the Trickstuff brakes lack (although I'd find hysterical if they duplicated).
"Something looks like something" isn't a patent issue by itself. It's clear where they ripped off Trickstuff aesthetics, but if they didn't copy any functional aspects of Trickstuffs design then there is nothing there from a patent perspective anyway. Brakes just aren't that complicated and there are only so many things they could do unique enough to really be functionally different enough for a patent.
Don't get me wrong. I have no desire to own these brakes, not because of their country of origin, but I do agree the ripoff aesthetics gives me a bad vibe. I've owned Maximas and love what Trickstuff is doing, so supporting Lewis in this isn't something I can do, they should have been creative enough on their own to come up with their own aesthetics. That doesn't mean they violated any Trickstuff patents, though.
Apparently Trickstuff let their patent lapse or there was some issue with their patent while this underwent development, not sure on the details but just a...
Apparently Trickstuff let their patent lapse or there was some issue with their patent while this underwent development, not sure on the details but just a rumor I read online.
I've watched the teardown video and I wouldn't go out and say its a Trickstuff carbon copy.
Also not sure why you think I wouldn't buy parts from Taiwan? I'm just looking for the best product for the best price, I also just purchased the Lollipop driver set directly from 711L in Taiwan after hearing about them from the PB podcast.
While I don't ethically agree with everything China does, I'm also not gonna pretend that buying mountain bike brakes is somehow supporting genocide? America isn't exactly an angel either, so I'm not gonna think about the political impact of my mountain bike purchasing decisions haha. I see a great product at a great price point. Lewis seems to be offering a great product at a great price and you're just going off the rails here about Xi's genocide and how he runs the country? Dude I'm just looking for good brakes. If you don't want to buy them, then don't.
What patent did Lewis violate that was held by Trickstuff?
I'm in no way disputing they look identical and similar, but that doesn't constitute a patent...
What patent did Lewis violate that was held by Trickstuff?
I'm in no way disputing they look identical and similar, but that doesn't constitute a patent violation. Some functional aspect of the brake would've needed to be duplicated that was patented by Trickstuff, there are only so many things unique they are doing (maybe the clamp or lever pivot?). If anything the Lewis design is slightly more innovative because it allows you to rotate the cam in the lever to adjust lever progression, something the Trickstuff brakes lack (although I'd find hysterical if they duplicated).
"Something looks like something" isn't a patent issue by itself. It's clear where they ripped off Trickstuff aesthetics, but if they didn't copy any functional aspects of Trickstuffs design then there is nothing there from a patent perspective anyway. Brakes just aren't that complicated and there are only so many things they could do unique enough to really be functionally different enough for a patent.
Don't get me wrong. I have no desire to own these brakes, not because of their country of origin, but I do agree the ripoff aesthetics gives me a bad vibe. I've owned Maximas and love what Trickstuff is doing, so supporting Lewis in this isn't something I can do, they should have been creative enough on their own to come up with their own aesthetics. That doesn't mean they violated any Trickstuff patents, though.
While it's abundantly clear Lewis took copied a lot of the aesthetics from Trickstuff, it does seem like the inner-workings of the brake are Lewis's own. I'd love to try Trickstuff brakes but there is no way I would ever pay $1500+ for brakes in my life so I'm happy to try these. And I'm not trying to say these should be as good as Trickstuff, for the price I'm looking with something with slightly improved feel/power over my TRP's And these can potentially offer that while looking a lot better. As ethically ugly as this looks, we consumers are ultimately the winners in this product arms race.
seeing as your in NZ, id be getting the new Merida ebike before the turbo Levo. - much cheaper aswell
Without a closer look I'm not sure if the lower link is concentric to the BB or not, but I think you're probably right with the six-bar. Plus the split pivot allows you (in theory) to completely change the anti-rise by changing the link the brake is mounted to, while keeping everything else the the same kinematics-wise.
With how bulky the bb area looks, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a concentric pivot there. And not a lot of room with the rear tire. Hopefully someone can snap a picture showing the rear brake mount at some point.
I haven’t had the opportunity to draw up a 6 bar on linkage. Had a hard time getting it to work when the supreme came out, haven’t tried again since then. So not sure how much the anti rise would change going from chainstay to seatstay in that situation.
The single pivot, Wilson-esque design is pretty obvious that it would go on the chainstay, otherwise your anti-rise goes through the roof.
Haven't seen it in the flesh, but there is one coming.
Gut feeling, but I would say that is very much dependant on the geometry of the two short links and the dogbone as they define the movement of the seatstay and chainstay. And that will of course define how much antirise you will have depending on which you mount the brake to.
FWIW, commencal did move the pivot on the Supreme V5 mid development, it used to be on the seatstay and is on the chainstay for the production model. That means the brake is mounted, effectively, to the other link (was on the chainstay, is now on the seatstay).
The front didn't fall off this one so must be from a different batch than BK's?
Must be a different version? I think Dane has had his for a while, and yet Ryan Griffiths just got one recently im pretty sure, but i thought i saw photos of him riding on the old one at this event
Earlier there was another photo and you could see the black top perfectly, unfortunately I don't have a screenshot
DAMPER
It only says riders can’t wear skin suits and nothing about bikes. Bend the rules baby and don’t give the UCI any ideas! 😂
From 'another' site. Max's Cannondale Dave has a revised looking Bomber DJ .... new air cap and Damper adjuster. Very different decals and Gloss CSU and Lowers. Current bomber DJ's are on a mega sale .... Makes me think Marzocchi is getting more hand-me-down tech from Fox, since it's seems like Fox is refreshing their damper/(forks?) range ....
Maybe Marzocchi will be getting a refresh across the board around the same time and maybe the Marzocchi Super Z (38mm) will be released at the same time.
If dealers are preparing websites that means it's close...
Recently got approved to be a Lewis brakes dealer. Will have samples coming in for testing and tear downs soon.
I plan on ordering a Fatty T frame kit in a MX. I've seen both of the color ways already
we all did, we're just missing the geo and travel spec, along with release date
Not interested in shimano motor.
Here's a first feeler.
There also seems to be a small "belly" close to the BB on the new Canyon. The outline almost looks like it's a cover of some sort. Could the shock be mounted vertically and be actuated by an upper link if it indeed a 6-bar ?
Edit: from this photo (from Vital pre-race interviews) you can clearly see a link in the bottom bracket area. This would fit with both the "Devinci" theory and the 6-bar theory. I also wonder if the vertical thick element behind the idler is part of the front triangle or is a vertical member in a 6-bar design (oh I missed nerding out on this stuff 😆)
Does it make sense to connect the bottom link and the seatstay?
It's impressive for sure and everyone I've talked to who has actual hands on experience seems to be thrilled with them. Actually kinda crazy how xenophobic people have been with these brakes the second they hear 'China' Wait till they find out where 90% of bike parts are made. Getting CNC'd brakes with apparently great performance at the current price point is a huge win for the consumer. I'm not paying Trickstuff money and I'm more than happy to try these since they cost less than my DH-R Evos
New meta TR? Tempo maybe?
I don't think it's xenophobia as much as it is that they appear to be a straight rip-off off of Trickstuff.
Will be interesting to see if DT Swiss feels the same way (and does something about it).
First, it's not "xenophobic" to try to avoid buying MIC goods if the issue is philosophical and political. China is our enemy, Xi is an authoritarian communist who commits genocide. It was a horrible mistake to partner with China and offshore our manufacturing to them in the first place.
Second, Taiwan and China are not the same country despite what Xi thinks. There's a MASSIVE difference between the two and if you won't buy Taiwanese goods then that may have an underlying xenophobic reason.
Last, Lewis is a direct rip off of another company's IP. Not everyone is ok with this. I'm not. If you are, why? So you can benefit from others' work without fair compensation? Cause that's EXACTLY what it comes down to.
You think you deserve Trickstuff's brakes without compensating them for their work. I'm not xenophobic, but you have some obvious ethical blind spots.
That won’t matter.
BMW once tried to sue a Chinese manufacturer over an X5 clone. The Chinese courts laughed them out, saying that it didn’t look anything like a BMW X5
China definitely doesn't care, but we can decide if we want to buy them.
Apparently Trickstuff let their patent lapse or there was some issue with their patent while this underwent development, not sure on the details but just a rumor I read online.
I've watched the teardown video and I wouldn't go out and say its a Trickstuff carbon copy.
Also not sure why you think I wouldn't buy parts from Taiwan? I'm just looking for the best product for the best price, I also just purchased the Lollipop driver set directly from 711L in Taiwan after hearing about them from the PB podcast.
While I don't ethically agree with everything China does, I'm also not gonna pretend that buying mountain bike brakes is somehow supporting genocide? America isn't exactly an angel either, so I'm not gonna think about the political impact of my mountain bike purchasing decisions haha. I see a great product at a great price point. Lewis seems to be offering a great product at a great price and you're just going off the rails here about Xi's genocide and how he runs the country? Dude I'm just looking for good brakes. If you don't want to buy them, then don't.
What patent did Lewis violate that was held by Trickstuff?
I'm in no way disputing they look identical and similar, but that doesn't constitute a patent violation. Some functional aspect of the brake would've needed to be duplicated that was patented by Trickstuff, there are only so many things unique they are doing (maybe the clamp or lever pivot?). If anything the Lewis design is slightly more innovative because it allows you to rotate the cam in the lever to adjust lever progression, something the Trickstuff brakes lack (although I'd find hysterical if they duplicated).
"Something looks like something" isn't a patent issue by itself. It's clear where they ripped off Trickstuff aesthetics, but if they didn't copy any functional aspects of Trickstuffs design then there is nothing there from a patent perspective anyway. Brakes just aren't that complicated and there are only so many things they could do unique enough to really be functionally different enough for a patent.
Don't get me wrong. I have no desire to own these brakes, not because of their country of origin, but I do agree the ripoff aesthetics gives me a bad vibe. I've owned Maximas and love what Trickstuff is doing, so supporting Lewis in this isn't something I can do, they should have been creative enough on their own to come up with their own aesthetics. That doesn't mean they violated any Trickstuff patents, though.
And if we loop in 50 posts about how much strain our fingers will endure with Lewis' brake levers, we'll have come full circle.
My damper is dampening with excitement.
While it's abundantly clear Lewis took copied a lot of the aesthetics from Trickstuff, it does seem like the inner-workings of the brake are Lewis's own. I'd love to try Trickstuff brakes but there is no way I would ever pay $1500+ for brakes in my life so I'm happy to try these. And I'm not trying to say these should be as good as Trickstuff, for the price I'm looking with something with slightly improved feel/power over my TRP's And these can potentially offer that while looking a lot better. As ethically ugly as this looks, we consumers are ultimately the winners in this product arms race.
Freeride e-bikepacking--surprise!