Most reliable enduro build

4/14/2023 8:05am

I built my enduro bike up 3 years ago with this approach in mind. I'd like to think its a 10 year bike and so far it has been nothing short of amazing. Was going through a carbon frame every 2-3 years before. 

Frame - Raaw Madonna V2. Zero issues and super easy to work on. All external and really nice bearing seals. Love having aluminum for this application. This frame is so solid. 

Sus - Zeb Ult and X2. I like the ease of working on RS forks. Got lucky and the X2 has been fine and I like how adjustable it is, but hate having to send it in to get any work on it done. DIY ftw. 

Wheels - DT Swiss 511's with Onyx hubs. Reliable rims with silent hubs. Heavy with inserts but they mob. 

Brakes - XT 4 pots. I just have so many spare bits for shimano brakes that I can't justify switching brands. Random bite point aside, they're solid. Easy to bleed and not DOT fluid. 

Cranks - Cane Creek eeWings. Fancy tie dyed color and completely bombproof. Hope BB. Went through a few Wheels Manufacturing BB's before switching. 

Drivetrain - Sram GX 12. Not a huge fan, but I don't care enough to change and like the range with a 34 tooth ring. Might try the 11 speed setups suggested by others next. 

OneUp Dropper - super easy to rebuild and 210 drop is nice. 

Renthal bars and stem - I just keep putting the same old set on every "new" enduro build and it's never an issue. 

 

4/14/2023 8:08am

Most reliable, and i guess by extension durable tires would be the Schwalbe Eddy Current's (Front and Rear).

Front has similar grip to a Mary, but with superior durability and support.

Rear is basically a low key moto tire. Have had lots of buddies run a set for multiple seasons. You can even hot knife to rear square the edges if you want to get frugal.

Shameless brand plug, but the Eddy Currents (despite their name) are worthy of hype on Enduro Bikes.

2
4/14/2023 8:23am

yzedf - curious why the bash on absoluteblack? Of the wearable components on my bikes, it lasted the longest.

yzedf
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4/14/2023 8:34am

yzedf - curious why the bash on absoluteblack? Of the wearable components on my bikes, it lasted the longest.

Just enough sand in the soil here I guess? Teeth wore down quickly and chain retention went with it. I also shattered a rear cog of theirs on my SS. 

1
TEAMROBOT
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4/14/2023 9:03am
yzedf wrote:
Things I can’t recommend: nx or GX Eagle anything other than the cranks. Deore 12 speed derailleur. OneUp bars, broke 2 of them! Renthal push on...

Things I can’t recommend: nx or GX Eagle anything other than the cranks. Deore 12 speed derailleur. OneUp bars, broke 2 of them! Renthal push on grips. SRAM guide brakes, G2 are ok-ish with 200 rotors but not for steep double black stuff. Deathgrips seem nice but don’t last long. Trail 1 carbon bars (feel like iron) and stem (mine wasn’t machined properly). AXS anything. Gravel bikes. Road bikes. Group rides over 5-6 people. Roval or Giant wheels. Formula hubs. X2 shock. Absoluteblack chain rings or singlespeed rear cog.

 

lol "Group rides over 5-6 people." WORD

2
TSchafer
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4/14/2023 9:09am
yzedf wrote:
Things I can’t recommend: nx or GX Eagle anything other than the cranks. Deore 12 speed derailleur. OneUp bars, broke 2 of them! Renthal push on...

Things I can’t recommend: nx or GX Eagle anything other than the cranks. Deore 12 speed derailleur. OneUp bars, broke 2 of them! Renthal push on grips. SRAM guide brakes, G2 are ok-ish with 200 rotors but not for steep double black stuff. Deathgrips seem nice but don’t last long. Trail 1 carbon bars (feel like iron) and stem (mine wasn’t machined properly). AXS anything. Gravel bikes. Road bikes. Group rides over 5-6 people. Roval or Giant wheels. Formula hubs. X2 shock. Absoluteblack chain rings or singlespeed rear cog.

 

LOL and agreed about the group rides! Did you break your OneUp bars in normal use, or crashes? That’s scary.

1
yzedf
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4/14/2023 9:12am
TSchafer wrote:

LOL and agreed about the group rides! Did you break your OneUp bars in normal use, or crashes? That’s scary.

One was a seemingly minor crash. Second one was hard compression at the bottom of a rock roll, thankfully didn’t crash. 

1
4/14/2023 9:36am

Biggest standouts over the last few years for me on my current build

-Code brakes I bleed them once a year and toss in fresh pads as needed. 4 years old swapped from my previous build.

-super deluxe ultimate has been hands down the most reliable shock I have owned. Aircan service and annual rebuild and no addition parts needed to be replaced.

-tires I go for heavy casing rear with middle casing upfront. I haven’t flatted in a few years but this will be location dependant.

-wheels I have a set of Stan’s flow ex and with hope pro4 hubs and double butted spokes. These wheels have been rock solid. I just did the bearings and replaced one spoke after 2 years of solid abuse.

-currently have a 4 or 5 year old set of GX cranks and they just keep going. Throw in a wheels mfg bb for excellent lifespan.

 

1
4/14/2023 10:26am

Got it, not much sand in Austin. BTW, I would never give up my OneUp bars! My shoulder pain went away when I started to use them.

 

4/14/2023 11:42am
TSchafer wrote:

LOL and agreed about the group rides! Did you break your OneUp bars in normal use, or crashes? That’s scary.

yzedf wrote:

One was a seemingly minor crash. Second one was hard compression at the bottom of a rock roll, thankfully didn’t crash. 

If youve broken Oneups then maybe carbon isnt for you.
I have 3 sets of oneup (3 bars & stem combo's) and they've been fantastic, Renthal bars & stems on the other hand..........remind me of Yeti frames.

4/14/2023 3:03pm Edited Date/Time 4/14/2023 3:05pm

What I'd choose if building out a maximum performance/reliable enduro bike for the money.

List of components to spec:

frame: Nicolai G1 or Kavenz, Knolly or Stumpjumper Evo for a little less money. The Nicolai and Kavenz bearings will last much longer than any other frame I've seen and the frames are just bomber.

hubs: DT 350

spokes: Sapim Race or DTSwiss

rims: DTSwiss aluminum or WAO, Reserve, Nobl carbon with a good warranty

tires: Lots of good choices and preferences here. Specialized T9 DH casing tires are the best performance for cost IMO.

brakes: SRAM Code RS/RSC work pretty good for the price especially if you can find some take-offs for cheap. They are also easy to find parts for. If I'm paying full price I'd choose Hayes over SRAM though.

brake discs: Galfer, SRAM they all work fine in my experience.

brake pads: Galfer Pros, SRAM

rear shock: Bomber coil can be found for super cheap and works well. Super Deluxe Ultimate are also solid but a bit more expensive.

fork: For the price, Charger 2.1 ZEB or Lyrik. Air springs are kinda shit but cheaply improved with a 2023 airspring or luftkappe. I see no point in spending extra for the charger 3 or buttercups.

handlebars: Renthal Aluminum are one of my favorites and come in all rises and clamps

headset: canecreek 70 or similar, I see no point in the expensive headsets since I have to replace them just as frequently in my experience.

dropper posts: OneUp is cheap and easy to service.

grips: Ergon GE1 is my favorite right now

saddle: Ergon Enduro SM Comp is the most comfortable saddle I've ever used.

derailleur: GX or SLX/XT 11 speed 

shifter: GX or SLX/XT 11 speed 

cranks: SLX or GX aluminum

cassette: XT, GX, EThirteen Helix for a little better range

Bottom bracket: SRAM or Shimano usually last me about a year and are cheap

chain: XX1 or XTR chains are worth the extra cost since they last way longer than cheaper chains

chainring: SRAM steel or Shimano equivalent 

pedals: I love the Chromag Dagga. Shimano if you're into clipless.

shift/dropper cables and housing: Jagwire works for me

linkage bearings: Probably enduro since that's all I've ever used and they are cheap and last me at least a year.

Bottle cages: Specialized Z cage

frame Mounted tools: Milkit toolkit. Haven't even tried it yet but it isn't too expensive and looks slick.

frame protection/noise management tricks: AllMountainStyle is the best frame protection I've used. Put it on critical areas and that's all you need.

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Blatant
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4/14/2023 7:15pm

I don’t have opinions on most of the categories, but I do on the frame: Banshee Titan. Done.

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Karabuka
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4/15/2023 2:20am
Blatant wrote:

I don’t have opinions on most of the categories, but I do on the frame: Banshee Titan. Done.

This I have to agree, Banshee frames with DH tubing (Rune, Titan, Legend) are incredibly durable, bought Rune in 2014, rode if for years with 0 issues, sold it to a friend who still rides is all the time and the frame is still going, 10 years old next year! Problem with banshees are bikes without dh tubing as I've replaced the rune with spitfire, which has almost the same geometry and is pretty much almost equaly capable with 2cm less travel but does not get dh tubing and the swingarm didnt last long. 

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badIuck
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4/15/2023 6:20am Edited Date/Time 4/15/2023 8:29am
Blatant wrote:

I don’t have opinions on most of the categories, but I do on the frame: Banshee Titan. Done.

Mine cracked after one season of enduro riding at 72kg rider weight but they replaced the frame immediately and made a wall thickness change to that area - great bike.

I went back to11 speed because I stopped counting my desintegrated 12 speed derailleurs. I use 30 or 28t chainrings because where I ride it goes steep uphill and steep downhill - I don't need a very big gear.

Only fork that did'nt feel sort of broken after 1 season was Lyrik with smashpot because it has a steel spring and like 10x oil volume compared to current air sprung forks which get sticky after a few rides with their 10ml oil volumes. Without coil for me Fox feel okay the longest, Rock Shox not so much and don't get me started on my Manitou Mezzer. I went through 2 forks during warranty and sold the 3rd.

Super Deluxe coil is really solid for me. Could ride 3 seasons until it lost it's rebound damping force.

32h rear wheel except for carbon rims. WIth carbon rims it's really nice that you never have to true them. The bad thing is that they will break at some point for me...and also ride quality is compromised. Loctite your spokes/nipples!

Formula Cura brakes are one of the only moving parts that seem to always work for me. Only if you shuttle with the bike hanging from the front wheel air can get into the system if they aren't properly bled. Otherwise bombproof. Use organic pads because metal pads shred your discs. But brakes seem to generally be more reliable than other moving parts nowadays.

Buy expensive chains. They hold up much longer and changing cassettes is expensive.

Don't buy any expensive bottom brackets where people claim they last longer. The bearings all corrode and wear the same for me.

Don't buy carbon fiber cranks.

And lastly dont wash your bike except for cleaning drivetrain and suspension parts. Cleaning your bike with lots of water after every ride is the WORST thing you can do if you want your parts to last and feel good. Too much/intesive washing literally breaks mountain bikes.

Edit: There is a German dropper post brand I use called Vecnum. it's fully mechanical and the lightest long travel dropper post I think. No issues over 3 seasons.

1
thejake
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4/15/2023 7:09am
i dont understand the whole cushcore/dh tires thing, ive run exo+ and maybe DD in extreme cases(w/o cushcore) and i havnt flatted in over 3 years...

i dont understand the whole cushcore/dh tires thing, ive run exo+ and maybe DD in extreme cases(w/o cushcore) and i havnt flatted in over 3 years.

If i go casual riding i have to run EXO+ or the bike is a dog to ride - maybe i run proper pressure and have no issues??

I think there are a lot of factors. Rider weight, rider ability, riding style and terrain type. 

1
4/15/2023 7:46am

Could not agree more - "And lastly dont wash your bike except for cleaning drivetrain and suspension parts. Cleaning your bike with lots of water after every ride is the WORST thing you can do if you want your parts to last and feel good. Too much/intesive washing literally breaks mountain bikes." I call it the ZZ Top school of bike maintenance, "keep the moving parts clean".

4/15/2023 1:33pm

Here are some parts that have been bombproof for me until now:

- Shimano Deore XT 11-speed drivetrain, with 11-46 cassette
- Shimano Deore XT M8000 cranks with 30T Renthal chainring (I have kept this setup from my old bike and sold the new GX cranks on the new one, BB included; I like the old style Shimano BB's better than the new ones and have a lot around on many bikes, just in case)
- 29” wheels with 32H build around Hope Pro 4 hubs, DT Swiss EX511 rims, with Sapim D-Light spokes and Sapim Polyax alloy nipples, ran with CushCore rear and Huck Norris front (I've had a broken inner bearing on the rear hub, that was a warranty issue, but otherwise the hubs have been awesome, rims also needed very little trueing after pretty rough riding)
- Novatec Synergy Cantilever rear hub (I have another wheelset with identical setup, but this hub in the rear and it has been flawless until now, feels better than the Hope)
- Magura MT Trail SL Carbon and MT7 brakes, ran with standard Magura Storm discs and mostly with Miles pads, because I am cheap; they are amazing
- Burgtec Josh Bryceland bars and Enduro MK2 stem
- Burgtec Bartender Pro Greg Minnaar grips; annoyingly durable
- DMR DeathGrips; also very durable
- Hope F20 pedals
- any Chris King headset I have ever owned, actually any Chris King product I have ever owned

- CushCore, CushCore, CushCore: the hype is very real for me, no more flats since mid 2019 for me, thank you!

I'd like to add a few more things:

- I have just had a new wheel built, around a new DT Swiss FR541 rim, 240 hub and Sapim D-Light spokes with alloy nipples and I expect it to last until I get bored of it

- my 2019 Mondraker Foxy XR and 2022 Mondraker Foxy RR Carbon have been excellent until now

- I have always had good experience with my well maintained RockShox BoXXers
- I have been pleased with my Lyriks too, even if my 2019 RC from the Foxy had a problematic air shaft that was replaced
- same with my Super Deluxe Coil, which had a body with two parts that unwinded from themselves during riding and had to be rebuilt with Loctite added, but was bulletproof since then

- my Öhlins air shock and RXF 36 m.2 fork have been working excellent too, but the fork developed play after little riding and Öhlins told me to get it to an authorised service and fill in some more oil (they are basically treating a mechanical issue with a hydraulic solution); fork has been riding dreamy, though

This is pretty much it...
Mx

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JVP
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4/15/2023 7:10pm Edited Date/Time 4/15/2023 7:32pm

Oooo, I like this topic!  I'm a parts-breaker and I've got (bad) experience and (worse) opinions.

frame: this is the hardest one. I haven't had good luck with aluminum frames unless they're suuuuper heavy and you get to inspect alignment before purchase. I go carbon, lasts longer and doesn't tend to eat shocks and pivots as fast. All I know is my current '20 Patrol has been good (older versions debonded at the stupid alum BB insert). I'd go for a pressfit BB if I had the choice on carbon, one less part to fail, and just get a wheels MFing BB thread-together.

hubs: easiest one. DT 350 with j-bend

spokes: anything double butted from DT or Sapim. Sapim polyax double square nips are the best. Use linseed oil as a locker/sealer and easy truing (but don't burn down the shop!).

rims:  I've been wildly impressed with my Newmen SL A.30. I killed one on a really bad case onto rock lip, but any rim would have died, and I was able to ride out with tube.  Of course the We Are One DH rims would also be up there.

tires: I'm done with Maxxis and maybe Schwalbe, soft rubbers crack/tear too fast. I've read from some full time guides (NSMB Kryptotal review comments) that Conti is the best wearing stickeee rubber, with Specialized T9 second. I'll try them next. 

brakes: Like everyone else I say Code RSC which were bombproof for years of abuse. I like my Hayes A4 better, and they're trouble free, but the RSCs just work. Always. Definitely not Shimano or Magura.

brake discs: Any of the new crop of 2.0 to 2.3mm thick one-piece steel in 6 bolt. Get Galfers if in doubt.

brake pads: Stock Code metallics and the Hayes A4 metallics seem to go forever.

rear shock: familiar song: RS SuperDeluxe, with MegNeg if your bike isn't progressive. Like Charlie, I'm no fan of coil since they're too linear on anything but a super progressive frame. Hard bottoming = broken... things, usually frame.

fork: Easy, the DVO Onyx sc in ebike flavor. Not super refined, but it's the only single crown in 8 years that I got > 13 months without creaky CSU. I've creaked Fox 36 (many and often), Lyrik, Mezzer.  We need trailduro dual crowns, this CSU shit has to stop.

handlebars: pick any not-cheap aluminum DH rated bar from a good brand

headset: meh

dropper posts: PNW Bachelor and Loam have been awesome

grips: meh

saddle: meh

derailleur: XO 11 speed or Eagle. GX is also awesome if and only if you replace the B-bolt with an X01 b-bolt when it's new. I've killed a few GX der's getting slop from the unlined b-bolt, which kills the derailleur.

shifter: GX and X01 have been flawless

cranks: RF Atlas. Most 7xxx series alum seem good, XTs bend easily. I much prefer 24mm steel crank axles for longevity and affordable bearings, so that kind of means RF Aeffect R (the R is important here).

Bottom bracket: Shimano XT 24mm. 

chain: X01, hands down. Worth the upgrade.

chainring: steel SRAM if you really want strong. Stamped GX works great.

pedals: This is the part I break most - bent left axles. Diety for sure, they use better heat treating and you can buy individual axles. DMR Vaults and Spanks are shortest lived trash I've ever used.

shift/dropper cables and housing: just don't go cheap, get coated cables

linkage bearings: OEM, repack with heavy PM600 grease 2x/year.

Bottle cages: meh

frame Mounted tools: happy with the OneUp EDC in steerer and OneUp pump. Avoid Lezyne pumps unless you want to search for your presta core for 30 minutes in sub-freezing temps and go numb (true story).

frame protection/noise management tricks: I'm a heel rubber and can saw through a frame in no time. RideWrap, 3M tape, etc. are no match. Thicker stuff from Wilder Wild has been solid. Fabric tape for wrapping car harneses is suuuper strong adhesive for strapping cables together or preventing internal frame rattling.

2
4/19/2023 3:39am

"I've read from some full time guides (NSMB Kryptotal review comments) that Conti is the best wearing stickeee rubber,"

That is my experience as well. Rode a lot on the Baron and Kaiser Projekt tires in the past and now on Kryptotal Soft compound (I don't really need the supersoft compound for my riding and rather save a little money). For the grip they offer, they wear really slowly compared to e.g. Maxxis. But the price of Kryptotals rose a lot in the last couple months so I don't know yet wehether I'll be on Conti in the future, Schwalbe is now less expensive here in Germany

4/19/2023 4:15am
Maxipedia wrote:
Here are some parts that have been bombproof for me until now: - Shimano Deore XT 11-speed drivetrain, with 11-46 cassette - Shimano Deore XT M8000...

Here are some parts that have been bombproof for me until now:

- Shimano Deore XT 11-speed drivetrain, with 11-46 cassette
- Shimano Deore XT M8000 cranks with 30T Renthal chainring (I have kept this setup from my old bike and sold the new GX cranks on the new one, BB included; I like the old style Shimano BB's better than the new ones and have a lot around on many bikes, just in case)
- 29” wheels with 32H build around Hope Pro 4 hubs, DT Swiss EX511 rims, with Sapim D-Light spokes and Sapim Polyax alloy nipples, ran with CushCore rear and Huck Norris front (I've had a broken inner bearing on the rear hub, that was a warranty issue, but otherwise the hubs have been awesome, rims also needed very little trueing after pretty rough riding)
- Novatec Synergy Cantilever rear hub (I have another wheelset with identical setup, but this hub in the rear and it has been flawless until now, feels better than the Hope)
- Magura MT Trail SL Carbon and MT7 brakes, ran with standard Magura Storm discs and mostly with Miles pads, because I am cheap; they are amazing
- Burgtec Josh Bryceland bars and Enduro MK2 stem
- Burgtec Bartender Pro Greg Minnaar grips; annoyingly durable
- DMR DeathGrips; also very durable
- Hope F20 pedals
- any Chris King headset I have ever owned, actually any Chris King product I have ever owned

- CushCore, CushCore, CushCore: the hype is very real for me, no more flats since mid 2019 for me, thank you!

I'd like to add a few more things:

- I have just had a new wheel built, around a new DT Swiss FR541 rim, 240 hub and Sapim D-Light spokes with alloy nipples and I expect it to last until I get bored of it

- my 2019 Mondraker Foxy XR and 2022 Mondraker Foxy RR Carbon have been excellent until now

- I have always had good experience with my well maintained RockShox BoXXers
- I have been pleased with my Lyriks too, even if my 2019 RC from the Foxy had a problematic air shaft that was replaced
- same with my Super Deluxe Coil, which had a body with two parts that unwinded from themselves during riding and had to be rebuilt with Loctite added, but was bulletproof since then

- my Öhlins air shock and RXF 36 m.2 fork have been working excellent too, but the fork developed play after little riding and Öhlins told me to get it to an authorised service and fill in some more oil (they are basically treating a mechanical issue with a hydraulic solution); fork has been riding dreamy, though

This is pretty much it...
Mx

I wont go 12 speed unless something weird happens.. I stick to shimano 11sp, just have one garbaruk 11-50 thats been great 2 seasons, for when is needed.. after this I will go linkglideor some other less-than-12sp stuff... I dont see the point.

2

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