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Data on daily covid deaths in Italy can be easily verified on worldometer.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/italy/
All covid related data for each country can be verified here:
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
Look at data from most African countries and from India and see for yourself: compare deaths per million inhabitants statistics to those of most European countries.
If you look on your own link to the statistics of Italy you will see that you are having 100-200k daily cases since December and 200-350 daily deaths related to that number of cases.
One year ago (Nov.-Dec. 2020) before the vaccination you had 20-35k daily cases and 550-800 daily deaths related to that cases.
And this is data from the link you posted...
So after vaccination and with less restrictions on day-to-day life today you have 3-5x the cases and less of half daily deaths related to that.
I dont know how you can show more clearly the efficacy of vaccination...
Like JoseMPM said, there is countless literature out there proving vaccination is safe (also safer than getting COVID) and effective.
https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations
Vaccinations appear to be quite ineffective against contracting the illness, though they do appear to still prevent a bad outcome, so there is a factor in vaccines there, but the overall lower mortality rate (apparently) of Omicron has a role here too.
That's why I initially wrote that I think a lot of restrictions will be easing up towards spring, as it's needed less and less.
I expect a lot of restrictions to be removed by April here in Slovenia, as we have parliament elections on 28th of April and the ruling party (our Marshal Twito, Janša) needs to gain some political points with which they can make themselves look good.
I get to see people die at work from covid everyday, I haven't seen one vaccinated person die in the last 2 months
If you want to control covid in order prevent the most deaths you have 2 options, vax and masking or super strict lockdowns and masking.
In the US, the only way to get people to vax at a much higher rate will be for health insurance companies to refuse to pay covid related treatment costs for those that choose not to be vaccinated.
The argument about "liberty" is a weak one. The nation was founded on the ideas of liberty. But people frequently forget about the next part, which is license and social contract. You may have the ability to do something but you do not always have the right to do it. If it affects one, it affects all. These are John Locke founding principles and if you read him, the "founders" basically plagiarized his stuff into our Constitution.
It is hilariously sad that a massive health issue became a political issue. It makes sense though, seeing that the two party system needs to find ways to demonstrably separate us into two fictitious groups through fear in order for them to maintain power. Washington saw it coming and warned about it in his farewell address. So did Madison in Federalist 10. The spirit of POS Joe McCarthy lives on...
Quite literally saw my cousin's lower abdomen and legs and they're purple almost 6 months after his legs clotted so bad they tured to sludge 3 days after his shot.
He's had 2 surgeries and scheduled for several more.
Personally saw my brother in law's leg balloon and get to go to the hospital the day after his shot.
Personally saw the obituary of a friends uncle who died of a sudden heart attack 2 days after his shot.
A friend whose aunt and her son both passed within a month of their shots after sudden escalation of unexplained, multiple complications just...out of nowhere.
Personally spoke to the father a girl on my daughter's softball team. The girl couldn't get out of bed for 2 days from debilitating leg pains and still can't run after her jab.
I and 6-8 families in my class at church all went through Covid without having the jab and all fully recovered &; now have antibodies, T cells, B cells & a far more durable immune response to the bug than any person alive who took the shots.
And this garbage about "Oh, but my symptoms were milder because I had the shot". It is impossible to prove that because NOBODY asked our group of 30-40 people about our symptoms. So it's impossible logic.
And then of course, there is a new Columbia study indicating way more people die of the vaccines than reported:
https://www.informedchoiceaustralia.com/post/columbia-study-true-u-s-co…
And of course, Facebook deletes posts on your personal page if you link to a reporting website for vaccine side effects reporting. And FB shut down vacccine side effect support group pages.
But hey...perfectly safe.
Regarding stopping spread, they still do lower the infection rates even with Omicron, so it's not all bad. Though with the infection rates and the demand on hospitals we're seeing currently, I think it does seem like a question of when, not if the pandemic will be over.
Regarding these horror stories from vaccinated people, where are you people living, what are you doing, what are you eating and what kind of vaccines are you taking? Just as anecdotal, I know of 0 people that had any serious side effects from any of the vaccines (AZ, Johnson, Moderna, Pfizer). And I know about quite a few people that have had and still have problems from contracting COVID.
Are all these people with problems that 'people know personally' just Facebook stories or what? Or just fearmongering? Honestly asking as I fail to see all these issues.
And impossible to prove the difference in symptoms? What about the number of vaccinated vs. the number of unvaccinated people in hospitals? Is that not _LITERALLY_ a direct comparison in the severity of symptoms between being vaccinated and not vaccinated (it's now about 50:50 between vaccinated and unvaccinated when it comes to positive cases due to Omicron here in Slovenia, but the ratio still greatly favours the vaccinated when it comes to hospitalisations).
The Germans used dogs in Stalag 17B on my grandfather's friends.
But I'm sure this won't get out of hand anywhere....never has before right.
Plus it's quite apparent that quite a few people here (mostly Americans for obvious reasons) fail to realise that a lot of the restrictions, logical or not, logical when they were set and not anymore or illogical from the onset, were set to protect the greater public, not the individual.
Yeah, great, free choice and everything, but to be a bit facetious, why does this free choice mean any time someone has a big injury in the States there's a GoFundMe to cover the costs of getting them back in one piece? Here in the socialist Europe (socialists measure are the ones where the public is better of at the expense of the individual, in general...) with a socialist healthcare and retirement fund a smashed cheekbone requiring titanium plates cost me (and my family) a grand total of 4 car rides to the hospital and one car ride to the doctors office. And I got 4 weeks of paid sick leave too (state mandated worker's rights).
Different mentalities, of course, but I think it's important to remember humanity achieved A LOT of things that we have because we worked together as a society, not alone as every man (woman) for him(her)self.
I'm with you on the topic of vaccines side effects and in regard to bizutchs post.
Case reports mean nothing in epidemiology. I too know dozens if not hundreds of people who are double our triple vaccinated and had 0 severe side effects from it.
On the other hand, and being a healthworker on the respiratory area I have seen a lot of people who had post COVID symptons for months, even if the acute disease was very mild.
That's not to say young healthy people wont die and older sick people would live, but more that a lot of healthcare systems around the world can be doing things better.
Countries where less than 40% of the population was overweight had death rates of around 10-100 000, countries with a overweight population with more than 50% have death rates closer to 100-100 000. Im not telling you to not get the vaccine, im just saying there is more to it than getting vaccine and calling it good.
But we're to believe that because someone had a heart attack several days after a shot that the vaccine was the cause of the heart attack?
Mmm'k
Cousin, friend's aunt people at my church = not science.
While we're being antidotal, my coworker's wife is a nurse. At the hospital she works at, which once again is full of Covid patients. Guess what the one thing they all have in common? That's right, unvaxxed. Crazy coincidence I guess...
Also questioning if being vaccinated means almost zero case resulting in hospitalization doesn't prove, even indirectly that the vaccine does not lead to better outcomes.
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