Nerding out on Brakes shall we? Not another tech deraliment

With the addition of reach adjust, and a bearing pivot in the "silver" and "ultimate" grades, by the looks of it

Code R and Guide R also had reach adjust (R beaing 'R'each adjust, S being Swing link and C being contact point adjustment in the RS(C) moniker.

So yeah, reach adjust or pivot bearings does not mean a swing link. As the picture above also shows. For the swing link you need another pivot higher up, closer to the clamp, that's a giveaway.

For the Hope brake noise I wonder if something like this would be effective https://shop.morganblue.net/en/brake-silencer-paste.html

Back in the day when I got my first disc brakes I remember the advise to cure squeaky brakes was to apply copper grease to the back of the pads. 

I seem to have a habit of cooking brakes. Even with 223/2.3mm rotors I can get them discolored. I saw that Lewis make a 3mm thick 223mm rotor suited for E-motos. I know that hopes vented rotor only fits on V4’s and maven calipers but was thinking that would a 3mm thick rotor just manage to fit on ”normal” brake calipers? I currently run Radic Kaha’s (yes I know Radic state that 2.3mm is the max).

What’s your weight, bike weight, terrain?

Also, what color discoloration? Some brown/bronze discoloration is expected. Purple/oil slick means you’re cooking the pads.

Can we talk about the rest of your setup before you put dirt bike rotors on your mtb? Like, what types of trails do you ride? What region? Do you think it could be a technique/style thing?

You're right, I forgot Motives are "DirectLink." Good call. They are not Swinglink.

But they're still not truly a rebadged DB8 because the fancy Motives still have bearing pivots and tool free reach adjust, and the Ultimate version might even have ti hardware (this would be easy to look up but I don't remember and I'm not going to bother now).

One thing to keep in mind is that thicker rotors will hold heat for longer than thinner rotors, more thermal mass will maintain temp longer with the same effective cooling... Thicker rotors won't necessarily solve the issue. Im between 195-215lbs depending on the part of the year and I have zero issue "cooking" rotors. Are you sure that the discoloration is the bad type of discoloration? Posting pictures of the rotor color would help. Ive been on T4V4's, Kaha and Dominions exclusively for the last 2 years. With SE05 TRP's I have yet to run into an issue where fade has had any impact on brake performance regardless of it being racing or just having fun ripping 4,000 foot runs. In fact the Kahas were towards the bottom of the pile for fade and pump issue of the three. 

I think that is a rather confusing post about how the thickness of the rotors affect the heat and temperature. The heat transfer from the rotor will mostly be affected by the surface area and this will be reasonably similar between standard and thicker rotors. So, if the rotors are at the same temperature a thicker rotor will, indeed, stay at a higher temperature longer, but in reality the temperatures will not be the same. For a given braking event the energy dissipated with either rotor will be the same and the thicker rotor will reach a lower maximum temperature, and with multiple events the thicker rotor will always have a lower maximum temperature and less temperature fluctuation. Both good things for consistent braking performance, provided the rotor is sensibly sized and not way off from it's intended range.

My riding experience with thicker rotors is that they definitely help keep the brakes feel more consistent, reduce wear and fluid degradation, and stay true longer.

I guess we need 5+ mm thick aluminium rotors... Or berylium 😂

Has anyone here mixed shimano levers with maven calipers? 

I want maven power with the shimano lever feel, and I'm wondering if the shimano servowave levers will push enough fluid that I won't end up with absurdly long deadstroke on the levers. I know people have done it over on MTBR. Curious if anyone here has experience with it. 

Also interested in hearing what people have been playing with. I might retire some TRP eventually and was thinking about trying TRP levers with Maven calipers. Maven power unfortunately ruined my TRPs haha, but would be nice to have a lighter lever pull on the Mavens. Shimano levers could be an option to apparently from MTBR. 

Going to pick up my Evo GR4's from my LBS later today! Unfortunately, I don't think I'll get to test them out until next season...

weather this weekend looks pretty decent for Moose mountain  

Ha ha. It's been a pretty great extended riding season out here, but I'm learning how to not die in avalanches this weekend. Lol

haha yup that is also very important thing to learn if you're heading to the backcountry. Enjoy and be safe out there :D 

Came across the Shaven setup on insta https://www.instagram.com/reel/DGR3V7XzVyj/?igsh=MXM5NTdmcWN0dHdyZg==

Man, some of those comments...

So I guess it technically works but how does it perform?

Wild. I like the idea of the Lewvan set up more than the Shaven, but cool to see people experimenting and mixing/matching.

Been running the same AliEx maxima copy levers with (first DB8'S) and now magura MT7 calipers with Tektro mineral oil. 

No issues whatsoever. 

No noise. No fade. No wandering bite point. 

Just budget friendly, strong brakes. 

Been trying to figure out which one I like more lol

You have my interest, as I've been contemplating a set of budget friendly stoppers and reading up on the various shigura setups people have cobbled together over the years. I've been wondering what other MC+lever options might be out there that could pair well with MT5/MT7s.

Are you running Lewis levers or one of the other Ali options? There are so many different ones, many of which seem to be the same product rebranded, and there is precious little information out there in terms of reviews and whatnot. 

I'd be interested to hear about your experience, if you don't mind sharing. Thanks.

These are two options on Ali for something similar to trickstuff lever. $60 for a full set of brakes is pretty wild. 

IIIPRO IV4R 4 Piston Disc Hydraulic Brake MTB AM DH Bike Brake 82/145cm CNC Tech Mineral Oil for Mountain XC Climbing Bicycle - AliExpress

ZRACE M1 X2 / X4 Mountain Bike Hydraulic Brake,Full CNC Lightweight, Oil Pressure Disc - AliExpress 18

Personally, I prefer the lever feel of shimano to trickstuff or lewis, but to each their own. 

I did just buy some Maven bronze calipers to throw on my XT levers / shimano BH90 hose, so I'll report back once I get the Shaven setup going. 

Right on, thanks for sharing that. I've never ordered anything of Ali before and just have no idea what to expect. 

There are lots of Shimano lever options on there at low cost (assuming they are real, of course). I'm somewhat hesitant to go that way, though, because I've never ridden Shimano brakes before, so I don't know how I would get on with the on-off feel.  

I'm a 215 lb man in his forties that has only ridden for a few years. The on-off dynamic sounds like it may advantage riders that can bring more precision to bear, rather than ham fisted brake draggers like myself. As such, I think I may be better served by a setup with more modulation. I'm strong as fuck and don't have small hands, so I'm not worried about having to pull the levers too much. I've certainly never felt the arm pump sensation people talk about before, but I also ride very little park, and my local has very little vert.

Thanks again for sharing. Cheers. 

oh come on now... that honestly sounds like a really fun tallboy! I dig it 

just out of curiosity and possible planning for future purchases on a couple bikes. What has been the overall consensus on here of the GR4 vs the T4V4 with folks that have owned or ridden both. I thought I remember in this forum earlier or another forum that some were preferring the T4V4 with the 8mm bearings replaced to an 9mm or 10mm for even better feel and less dead stroke than the GR4.  Appreciate all the people that ride, modify, etc all this stuff and share!

I am using the zrace levers (as linked by @Evwan) with DB8 and MT7 calipers on my trail and enduro bikes (I have some MT5 calipers to swap out the DB8's at some stage also). 

Pads I'm using are the Uberbike e-matrix pads (both in the DB8's and MT7's) with Tektro 203-17 2.3mm rotors (203mm f/r). Mineral oil is Tektro mineral oil. 

I started this mix and match brake journey with Tektro Orion HD745 4P brakes that I first put the zrace levers on. Instantly better feeling and stronger brakes. Have always using shimano olive and barbs on the zrace levers. I have exclusively bleeding all these brake combinations with a stainless steel bleed cup I made (after breaking a plastic ezmtb one). 

I found a new set of DB8 calipers cheap so upgraded to the larger piston DB8'S. These have a firmer lever feeling and more bite than the Tektro calipers. 

I ran these on my trail bike for about a year before pulling the trigger on another 2 zrace levers and a DB8 brake set. Ran the DB8's (replaced Guide RS brakes) for a few rides on my Enduro bike as I didn't have any shimano olives left and had some on order.

The MT7/MT5's calipers I got from a fellow RB forum friend and the opportunity to run some 17mm piston calipers was just too good to pass on. 

Because the zrace levers don't have any swinglink/servo-wave magic they obviously feel more linear. But they seriously bite. 

2 friends that have tried them were both impressed. One runs 4piston Dominions and the other lad Hope v4's. 

It’s not the worst, but the geometry/brakes/tires can easily get you into situations that the suspension has no hope of getting you through.

Thank you for your detailed account. That was quite informative and confidence inspiring. Very cool. 

Looking around, it seems one can't spit without hitting reasonably price MT5s and MT7s. It's cool to see what experienced riders are doing to harness the strength of the calipers while mitigating the weaknesse of their apparently-made-of-cheese levers.

I know there are great out-of-the-box options out there, but it's hard to justify the expense to the missus when we have three small kids and the costs of living keeps rising. Frankenbrakes become more attractive in a K-shaped economy. Haha.

Cheers.