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The debonair+ was a major change to the air spring - it went from the small negative spring (like Debonair C1) to a much larger negative chamber which made it more sensitive and increased midstroke support, like a Vorsprung Luftkappe. This also made the air spring more progressive due to the smaller positive chamber but yes it also didn't change the ramp effect of the lowers
Pleased to see RockShox and Fox bringing elastomers back into MTB forks, I think it's really what we have been missing since coil forks got fazed out.
People seem to joke about this, but were apparently fine with forks basically just smashing themselves in to the bottom of the lowers with next to no protection, since time immemorial.....Its like that reassuring CLANG and jarring through the hands is what they needed to know you got your monies worth!
Doesn’t the Fox 38 have tiny bumpers on the bottom of the lowers? I could have sworn I’d seen some when doing a 50hr service.
Most forks have something like that but they are pretty useless and super hard. They mostly prevent major damage to the fork but don't help the performance in anyway. The Fox 36 & 40 ones would often get wedged in to the stanchion tube after a big hit, leaving nothing at all from them on!
@onxx answers for ya -
- No rebound kits available for 3.2. Rebound is only available with the R55 tune
- For FA, HSC is set to the middle or 0 setting for the open position. It's fixed like the Charger 3.1
Tagging in @TEAMROBOT who has ridden new Zeb Select+ and Podium.
My two cents would be that if you're worried about lugging extra weight up the hill, and are considering a new Zeb FA, I would do that for the lockout/lower weight.
Thanks so much!
I haven't had the chance to ride the new 2026 Zeb (except around the parking lot so far), but I will say that if you don't like pedaling a FA Zeb uphill when the FA lockout isn't working, I don't imagine you'll like pedaling the Podium uphill, either. One of the selling points of the Podium is how supple it is and how easy it is to break into the stroke, but that also means it's supple and easy to break into the stroke when you're climbing. The Podium bobs a lot when I stand on climbs, compared to other forks of similar travel. It ain't a cross country fork.
Having said that, you can crank the compression knob closed on any fork for long climbs, most people just don't.
@Jason_Schroeder or @TEAMROBOT , now that linear is in and the Zeb has put on weight, how about doing a head to head with a 2027 Zeb and the original Zeb with a coil conversion? An artificial friend said the weight of a smashpot converted Zeb would be 2600g to 2800g depending on spring weight. What do you think?
On it.
2900 g with a 50 lbs spring and 180mm on my zeb smashpot
Also, how much do we know about weights for the new Zeb, and where are people seeing those numbers?
The only weight I can find listed on the RS website is 2550 grams for the new Zeb Ultimate, but I can't see weights for the Ultimate FA, the Select+, the Select, or the base model Zeb. Obviously the FA model will weigh a little more (the outgoing FA Zeb weighed 109 grams more than the old Ultimate), and I'm guessing the Select+, the Select, and the base model Zeb weigh a little less. Here's my little table of long travel fork weights I compiled for the Push review:
Push Nine One 2,950 grams
Zeb w/ Smashpot: 2906 grams (50 pound spring)
Boxxer Ultimate: 2880 grams
40 Grip X2: 2745 grams
Podium Grip X2: 2695 grams
Intend Flash 38: 2620 grams
NEW 2027 ZEB ULTIMATE: 2550 grams
Marzocchi Z1 Coil: 2525 grams
38 Grip X2: 2314 grams
Zeb Ultimate: 2324 grams
36 Grip X2: 2130 grams
https://flowmountainbike.com/tests/2027-rockshox-zeb-vivid-air-review/
scroll down in that, they have a photo of it on scale as 2,570g at 29/170, no fender.
They also have the new Lyrik at 2,262g for 29/160, no fender.
https://flowmountainbike.com/tests/rockshox-lyrik-ultimate-review-first-ride-2027/
Also, Enduro MTB lists the 2027 Fox 38 Grip X2 w/ Glidecore etc as 2,412g (170mm/29):
https://enduro-mtb.com/en/fox-38-factory-vs-rockshox-zeb-ultimate-test/
R2-Bike in Germany are really good for weights. They usually include photos of every item on their scales.
Any feedback on the new Delta RC damper in the new 2027 ZEB Select ?
I'll just copy and past what Fluid Focus briefly said to me about it:
"Our test fork arrived yesterday and we've been testing out the 3.2 damper. The damper itself is basically the same as the 3.1(with a few good changes), but our 3.1 piston fits perfectly. The fork chassis itself seems really good."
Delta RC looks like the Rush RC damper with a Charger 3-like rebound piston. The Rush RC is/was pretty cheap and basic, similar to the old "charger RC" cartridges. The worst part was the orifice rebound so it might be a little better with the new piston but I wouldn't expect too much out of it.
Delta RC is rather an updated version of the Charger RC.
The compression piston seems to be a bit of an upgrade.
So it actually might be a pretty decent damper for the money.
https://docs.sram.com/en-US/publications/1MdgH61bPulKX0ksJ8f3UH/SM%20-%202027%2B%20ZEB%20and%20Lyrik?models=fs-lyrk-bse-d2#hashItem=damper-service_2
I got a first ride in on my 2027 Zeb on my local trails. My first impressions straight off were that it felt like it tracked the ground really well, rode higher in its travel & had more midstroke support, and was super, super quiet. I'm coming from a 2-3 year old Zeb with Charger 3.1 and a Noken, which I liked but my old fork's chassis was worn out and noisy. I started out running the recommended pressure for my weight (155 lbs + 7 lbs gear + ebike), which suggested 133 psi. Normally I prefer to manually account for the added ebike weight rather than relying on the checkbox in TrailHead, but in this case adding 13 lbs to rider weight ended up giving me the same pressure. I started with both comp settings in the middle, and running rebound my customary 3 clicks faster than Trailhead's suggestion. Over the course of a 5,900' ride, I ended up opening LSC -2 due to harshness over a section of blown out rocky trail, slowing rebound 1 click (felt like the fork was kind of dancing in my hands in some cases), and dropped pressure to 130 psi. At the reduced pressure I was able to fully bottom it once on a series of steep 3' face drops where you brake hard after landing, but on a followup lap I still had some in reserve with the same settings. The bottom out was quiet and I had to check the o-ring afterwards to confirm I did actually use full travel - the same event on my old Zeb would have had an audible clack with associated feedback in my hands. The other thing I noticed was the fork seemed like it was a lot poppier on jumps than my old one - presumably from the added midstroke support. Overall, I'm really happy with how the fork feels, and think I'm pretty close to having it dialed in already for my preferences. The best I can describe it is that it seems to combine the air spring feel of the prior gen Fox 38 with better damping and smoother bottom out.
I also got an updated Vivid and don't have much to say about that. It basically feels the same as the old model, except maybe a trading off a little bit of the stuck to the ground coil-like feel for a little bit more pop. I'm fine with that, as it seems to match the character of the new Zeb better. But it doesn't feel like a dramatic change / improvement like the Zeb did.
I asked at sea otter what the difference between the vivid and superdeluxe was, and they said the vivid was more ground hugging, the super deluxe is more fluttery and poppy.
Does the vivid feel well matched to the zeb, or do you think the super deluxe might be slightly more balanced feeling if you want that kind of poppy feel?
Based on my experience with the prior gen Vivid air and SD with the big air can, I think their description is fairly accurate. Vivid prioritized bottomless feel and traction, SD was overall a bit more active and poppy.
I think either shock should work well with either fork, they're not as dramatically different as, say, going to coil is. I'd pick more based on the bike's use/intent. So like I put Zeb & Vivid on my Vallit (Vala ebike overforked to 170 & overstroked to 163) because the extra weight of the bike makes it a bit more stuck to the ground anyways, I do more descending each ride on it (so more DH-biased suspension helps with fatigue a bit), and I ride a wider variety of terrain on it. I've previously run on a Heckler SL (before I sold it) Lyrik/SD, Lyrik/Vivid, Zeb/Vivid, and Zeb/SD... both shocks were great and I found the fork to be more character defining. I briefly considered going with the new Lyrik/SD for my Vala (now that you can run Lyrik at 170 again) but considering I had to warranty the CSU on the Lyrik on the Heckler SL after about a year, I figured I'd rather err on the side of stiffness for the ebike. The weight difference between the 2 shocks is pretty minor, especially compared to the fork, so I didn't figure it was worth saving grams there.
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