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Yeah I agree with this and with @Erwan_Ghesquiere views, the companies can definitely test, but I do understand if they don't publish the data. I think an interesting point is there isn't really an engineering or rider based objective standard of what is good or bad flex yet, we are still at the stage of figuring out whats good, let alone specifically designing for it. In the broadest sense, everyone can agree that "wind-up" flex from a frame is undesirable, i.e the frame can wind up in a corner and spring back aggressively losing traction and control exiting corners. Also...

There was a bike with sliders that came up recently, but also the 1st gen Intense M1, which had a strut rather than linkage activated single pivot design, used sliders. Having said that, the M1 suddenly became a lot more successful in racing when they switched to the 2nd gen without sliders, although there are other variables involved.

I don't think the slider is the best approach. If anything it will just kill your shock quicker as it prys off your seattube. Just add a brace between the pivot and shock mount to make that stiff. My frame has a pretty tight gap from rear end to seattube (1/4") and it has never touched, even with spherical bearings on the shock. Most movement or flex is rotation behind the pivot point. A bridge behind the seattube will help and a stiffer axle interface. I run a BMX style bolt on 135 hub with right washers to remove axle...

Someone built a steel frame incorporating the slider idea I to it. I can't recall off the top of my head who the builder is to find the IG link. Igus sells a filament that would work well for this, now sure difficult it is to print on a consumer FDM printer.

Ryan, those sliders are a cool idea! Erwan, if you interested or need, I could help you print some and send them over

I should add that the bike rides very well and is very dynamic (more than my previous GTs Force 27.5 and 29). The only moment I notice the lack of rigidity is in pretty high load type of berms, so the question is, aside from how to make it stiffer, is it worth it and could it make it worse everywhere else ?

I don't remember the video from Nekko but it shouldn't be the dutty of a consumer to prove what your product does. And yes, for some reason the mass damper products seem very data driven so for once we may get a product that is actually back-up which is cool. At least you will know what you buy, why you buy it and what it does for you.

Placebo effect is not too hard to prove or bust, have a double blind experiment. Put a series of riders on bikes, with or without the ochain and ask them how they liked the performance of the bike. In order to account for the pedal feedback you could tell them they are not allowed to pedal and have the bb area covered so they can't see which type or crank they are riding. Placebo effect should give you 30% of people feeling an improvement, if ochain can do better and consistently better than standard crank, voila ! you proved that...

There’s definitely data out there if you look deep enough. I guess there’s many consumers who don’t care about the data and just want something that’s cool? Hopefully with new technology, it will be easier for brands to gather, sort and analyze the data. Neko Mulally had data when testing oChain and said he saw a change in dynamic sag. This was in one of his earlier videos when testing between the high and low pivot bike. CounterShox had data showing with and out their device showing a clear difference.

Same goes with all the pedal kick dampers (Ochain and Rimpact, e13 new hub). For instance, did you ever see a graph, data, anything that shows in which way does pedal kick dampers actually do anything ? Yes riders tell us it does something, TEAMROBOT did an excellent video about it too. But these companies should be able to quantify what it actually does, X% less vibrations at your feet, Y% less loss of grip moments during braking situations, Z% more suspension amplitude during a given impact, etc etc. Yet do we see any of this ? Nope, it's all...

Whoa whoa whoa don't go giving the marketing people any idea's like that. Soon a 45mm stem will be marketed as 10% more compact than a 50mm stem.

17% isn't much but compared to most single pivot on the market that have 0 to 5% of progression this is a lot lol. As an enduro bike I wouldn't change anything on it really. As a DH bike I would use some slightly shorter chainstays (460 or 465mm) to help a little in the very steep stuff and add a little rear end stiffness (the whole point of this thread) as it is a bit lacking sometimes in high G scenarios. Other than that it is very capable as it is. If I was to use it as pur...

So there’s evidence people have been looking at, thinking about, measuring and comparing bike component compliance for years. And there’s evidence that some component and system (for example, a wheel) makers have been doing the same. But instead of helping to create basic language and tools riders could use to compare compliance as one more factor to consider alongside all the other bike fit and performance details, every company is mining the compliance boom in the same way. Our new gen widget is more compliant (but not too compliant!) than our previous gen widget. Start tuning your ride today! Marketing...

Nice! I don’t think 17% is very progressive, so I thought you were going to say that it’s much more. Cool project, do you think you will make a second version? Will you change anything?

This much ! So slightly more than 17%. I ride the bike with 32/33% of static SAG and a lot of compression. Makes is super dynamic and poppy (especially with the mid stroke support of a coil shock), not the best at ironing trail chater tho, and I don't have any issues with bottoming out even on big features. So far this frame has been ridden with Formula MOD (orange and green CTS), Ohlins TTX2 with all the tokens, and the VORO that a friend of mine handed to me to test. So far I am very impressed with the...

That’s a cool looking bike! How progressive did you make it?

I realised I didn't have any picture of my bike (after 2 seasons lol) so I took some this morning. The bike has heen welded by Egerie in France, based on a linkage file I made. The idea here is to have the chainstay length based on a front to rear center ratio. I checked that ratio at SAG on bikes I found to have good cornering characteristics. In terms of number it is 63HA, 80SA, 490mm reach, 470CS, 643stack, 15mm BB drop. The bike is full 29, 180mm front and 192mm back. The frame is atypical for a single...