MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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12/13/2020 11:03am
Did they need to change much?
EugenM wrote:
Mullet.
So but a frame and put a 29er fork on it. 160
Should be pretty close to current geo and you could go for an upforked feeling with 170.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Santa came out with a bromad down the road, but the nomad is 650b.

Who knows maybe they’ll take a page from specialized and offer aftermarket links on the next Hightower and megatower.
EugenM
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12/13/2020 11:22am
So but a frame and put a 29er fork on it. 160 Should be pretty close to current geo and you could go for an upforked...
So but a frame and put a 29er fork on it. 160
Should be pretty close to current geo and you could go for an upforked feeling with 170.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Santa came out with a bromad down the road, but the nomad is 650b.

Who knows maybe they’ll take a page from specialized and offer aftermarket links on the next Hightower and megatower.
They've made the Bullit a mix wheel size but they could not make the Nomad in the same way?, where is that place in the trail or what/how is that trail where a 650b excels but a mullet won't?, because I am tired and I don't want to bring 29er bikes into discussion.
So.., where and in what way?
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bigbrutt
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12/13/2020 11:23am
Dual uprights on the rear triangle. Size specific chainstay lengths. You seem to have some animosity towards Santa Cruz. They are not nearly as exclusive as...
Dual uprights on the rear triangle. Size specific chainstay lengths. You seem to have some animosity towards Santa Cruz. They are not nearly as exclusive as you have made them out to be in your mind.

When a bike is launched that doesn’t fit my needs or is from a brand I’m not crazy about, I don’t rag on it online. I just don’t purchase it.


Sorry to sound dumb but what is an upright and what is the significance of their duality? Silly
C-LION
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12/13/2020 11:43am
Guys, 2021 will be exciting.

Both Canyon and YT will probably release an update of their Enduro bikes - The Strive and the Capra.

Longer, lower and slacker I guess.

YT has fallen behind the curve and need to deliver. Canyon has been busy releasing new/updated bikes recently.

It will be interesting to see if they will offer a mullet option or stick with the current options.

I really hope that they are going to release bikes with progressive geometries and I reckon that we will not get disappointed.
12/13/2020 12:13pm
I wonder if SC would be open to doing some limited edition releases similar to Commencal has done with maybe a DVO or Ohlins kit and some special finishes
Primoz
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12/13/2020 1:10pm
EugenM wrote:
They've made the Bullit a mix wheel size but they could not make the Nomad in the same way?, where is that place in the trail...
They've made the Bullit a mix wheel size but they could not make the Nomad in the same way?, where is that place in the trail or what/how is that trail where a 650b excels but a mullet won't?, because I am tired and I don't want to bring 29er bikes into discussion.
So.., where and in what way?
It's not a bike that should be fast. It's a bike that is for a specific customer. Racers buy Megatowers.
Primoz
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12/13/2020 1:14pm
bigbrutt wrote:
Sorry to sound dumb but what is an upright and what is the significance of their duality? Silly
They have a rear triangle with two short links. Therefore they need a full rear triangle with a connection between the two pivots on the rear triangle.

The old Nomad has this link on the left side only to clear the front triangle, this one is built similarly (more symmetrically) to the current crop of Santa Cruz bikes - Megatower, Hightower, Tallboy, 5010, Bronson and Heckler.

This goes hand in hand with the current lower link shock mount, though the Nomad did this in the V4 generation already with the asymmetric swingarm.
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EugenM
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12/13/2020 1:29pm
Primoz wrote:
It's not a bike that should be fast. It's a bike that is for a specific customer. Racers buy Megatowers.
All riders want faster and more capable bikes, not just the racers.
1
10
Primoz
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12/13/2020 1:54pm
Nope. All riders want better bikes. For some that could mean a more fun bike, a more lively bike, a smaller (less travel), lighter bike. Some riders want to have fun regardless of the times they post on Strava, if they even post rides in strava.

If all riders wanted faster bikes, 27,5" would have been dead a few years ago and it is in XC where the most important thing is in fact that the bike is fast and efficient. Not so when it comes to recreational trail riding. Or freeride. Or dirtjumps. Etc.
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12/13/2020 8:19pm
So but a frame and put a 29er fork on it. 160 Should be pretty close to current geo and you could go for an upforked...
So but a frame and put a 29er fork on it. 160
Should be pretty close to current geo and you could go for an upforked feeling with 170.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Santa came out with a bromad down the road, but the nomad is 650b.

Who knows maybe they’ll take a page from specialized and offer aftermarket links on the next Hightower and megatower.
EugenM wrote:
They've made the Bullit a mix wheel size but they could not make the Nomad in the same way?, where is that place in the trail...
They've made the Bullit a mix wheel size but they could not make the Nomad in the same way?, where is that place in the trail or what/how is that trail where a 650b excels but a mullet won't?, because I am tired and I don't want to bring 29er bikes into discussion.
So.., where and in what way?
Nomad is what it is. I know 3 guys who buy one with every generation. I ain’t exactly popular so why would Santa Cruz duck with that type of reliable costumer?

I truly expect mullets to be a big thing in the future. Especially in sizes below xl. But how the industry grows to accomandate a new market will be slow. I also think it will become a new option, rather than replace 650b in the front. So if ya want a mullet either make it yourself or wait a few more years

Primoz
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12/13/2020 10:18pm
Agreed, if you have 29" vs. 27,5" bikes in different sizes in the current market, I also expect the 27,5" to give way to the mullets. It's less stock to keep, it's only one fork, front wheel and tyre as opposed to two.
EugenM
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12/13/2020 11:10pm Edited Date/Time 12/13/2020 11:56pm
Primoz wrote:
Nope. All riders want better bikes. For some that could mean a more fun bike, a more lively bike, a smaller (less travel), lighter bike. Some...
Nope. All riders want better bikes. For some that could mean a more fun bike, a more lively bike, a smaller (less travel), lighter bike. Some riders want to have fun regardless of the times they post on Strava, if they even post rides in strava.

If all riders wanted faster bikes, 27,5" would have been dead a few years ago and it is in XC where the most important thing is in fact that the bike is fast and efficient. Not so when it comes to recreational trail riding. Or freeride. Or dirtjumps. Etc.
I disagree. No one(or very few) will buy a Nomad that's less capable and less fast than the previous generation. So, ultimately, in the 170-180mm travel range of bikes, a better bike would have to be a more capable bike.

Edit. and when looking at the geometry changes, SC intentios were, of course, to make a more capable and faster bike than the previous one; but, if they deemed the Bullit as a better, faster, more capable bike with a 29" front wheel...and a Bullit is basically a Nomad with a motor, why they've excluded this option for the actual Nomad?
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12/14/2020 12:57am Edited Date/Time 12/14/2020 1:22am

Can barely see the top chain of a high pivot system maybe new Forbidden? In the comments they say Tuesday so should be... Tomorrow!
shreda
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12/14/2020 2:43am
[img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2020/12/14/10178/s1200_Screenshot_20201214_005459.jpg[/img] Can barely see the top chain of a high pivot system maybe new Forbidden? In the comments they say Tuesday so should be... Tomorrow!

Can barely see the top chain of a high pivot system maybe new Forbidden? In the comments they say Tuesday so should be... Tomorrow!
Where can you see the chainguide? Also a Forbidden would have a lower guide.

My money is on the new Nomad - stem also looks like a Burgtec.
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Mafflin
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12/14/2020 4:48am
EugenM wrote:
All riders want faster and more capable bikes, not just the racers.
Obviously not.
1
Primoz
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12/14/2020 5:33am Edited Date/Time 12/14/2020 8:50am
Primoz wrote:
Nope. All riders want better bikes. For some that could mean a more fun bike, a more lively bike, a smaller (less travel), lighter bike. Some...
Nope. All riders want better bikes. For some that could mean a more fun bike, a more lively bike, a smaller (less travel), lighter bike. Some riders want to have fun regardless of the times they post on Strava, if they even post rides in strava.

If all riders wanted faster bikes, 27,5" would have been dead a few years ago and it is in XC where the most important thing is in fact that the bike is fast and efficient. Not so when it comes to recreational trail riding. Or freeride. Or dirtjumps. Etc.
EugenM wrote:
I disagree. No one(or very few) will buy a Nomad that's less capable and less fast than the previous generation. So, ultimately, in the 170-180mm travel...
I disagree. No one(or very few) will buy a Nomad that's less capable and less fast than the previous generation. So, ultimately, in the 170-180mm travel range of bikes, a better bike would have to be a more capable bike.

Edit. and when looking at the geometry changes, SC intentios were, of course, to make a more capable and faster bike than the previous one; but, if they deemed the Bullit as a better, faster, more capable bike with a 29" front wheel...and a Bullit is basically a Nomad with a motor, why they've excluded this option for the actual Nomad?
If you want a faster bike than the old Nomad, buy the Megatower. What is then the point of the new Nomad?

Oh and when you say all riders want a faster bike, what am I then? My bike is plenty fast enough for me, it's a 29er, very long and is 150/150. I don't need a faster bike, I'm sure of that, but I'm currently not that sure what exactly I need...
EugenM
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12/14/2020 5:43am Edited Date/Time 12/14/2020 5:44am
Primoz wrote:
If you want a faster bike than the old Nomad, buy the Megatower. What is then the point of the new Nomad? Oh and when you...
If you want a faster bike than the old Nomad, buy the Megatower. What is then the point of the new Nomad?

Oh and when you say all riders want a faster bike, what am I then? My bike is plenty fast enough for me, it's a 29er, very long and is 150/150. I don't need a faster bike, I'm sure of that, but I'm currently not that sure what exactly I need...
I don't know about you but I would like a 180mm bike with a 29" front wheel from SC.
And I also like the name better...and I would also not want to invest in a cc link and a ext shock to make the springy megatower more plowy and easy on my fat-ass low skill joints.

#morefromthebike #lessfromme
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8
12/14/2020 6:57am
Primoz wrote:
If you want a faster bike than the old Nomad, buy the Megatower. What is then the point of the new Nomad? Oh and when you...
If you want a faster bike than the old Nomad, buy the Megatower. What is then the point of the new Nomad?

Oh and when you say all riders want a faster bike, what am I then? My bike is plenty fast enough for me, it's a 29er, very long and is 150/150. I don't need a faster bike, I'm sure of that, but I'm currently not that sure what exactly I need...
EugenM wrote:
I don't know about you but I would like a 180mm bike with a 29" front wheel from SC. And I also like the name better...and...
I don't know about you but I would like a 180mm bike with a 29" front wheel from SC.
And I also like the name better...and I would also not want to invest in a cc link and a ext shock to make the springy megatower more plowy and easy on my fat-ass low skill joints.

#morefromthebike #lessfromme
sounds like you just need an ebike then dude
7
EugenM
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12/14/2020 7:05am
sounds like you just need an ebike then dude
Ahahaha 😁..could be but, for sure not in this travel range!, something light for epic days on the bike(like the orbea rise, maybe, in the future..who knows 🤷🏿‍♂️)
But I still see no reason for which the Nomad is coming with a 27.5 front wheel, especially in this price category.
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krabo83
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12/14/2020 7:15am
that green is pretty ugly!

2
Noeserd
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12/14/2020 7:24am
krabo83 wrote:
that green is pretty ugly! [img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2020/12/14/10179/s1200_33C330BE_EA62_4E9F_95B4_4C3814EA03ED.jpg[/img]
that green is pretty ugly!

megatower's lime color was way more better
12/14/2020 7:32am
Something to think about... My Santa Cruz rep told me that 27.5 bikes as a whole account for roughly 30% of their sales.. How much lower does it go before they reconsider keeping them? As long as they keep selling everything they make, I'd assume they will keep making them...
EugenM
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12/14/2020 7:37am
Something to think about... My Santa Cruz rep told me that 27.5 bikes as a whole account for roughly 30% of their sales.. How much lower...
Something to think about... My Santa Cruz rep told me that 27.5 bikes as a whole account for roughly 30% of their sales.. How much lower does it go before they reconsider keeping them? As long as they keep selling everything they make, I'd assume they will keep making them...
30% interesting. Good info to think about it.
nskerb
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12/14/2020 7:38am
Something to think about... My Santa Cruz rep told me that 27.5 bikes as a whole account for roughly 30% of their sales.. How much lower...
Something to think about... My Santa Cruz rep told me that 27.5 bikes as a whole account for roughly 30% of their sales.. How much lower does it go before they reconsider keeping them? As long as they keep selling everything they make, I'd assume they will keep making them...
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those.
Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still be produced for the foreseeable future, be it in lower quantities.
EugenM
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12/14/2020 7:44am
nskerb wrote:
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those. Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still...
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those.
Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still be produced for the foreseeable future, be it in lower quantities.
Not quite. DH bikes need to be sold for racing. They aren't racing the Nomad.
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krabo83
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12/14/2020 7:46am
Noeserd wrote:
megatower's lime color was way more better
was more of a mint green IMO, but yeah way prettier!
12/14/2020 7:50am
nskerb wrote:
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those. Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still...
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those.
Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still be produced for the foreseeable future, be it in lower quantities.
I do agree since Santa Cruz isn't a Trek or Giant trying to make bikes for everyone..
nskerb
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12/14/2020 7:56am
nskerb wrote:
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those. Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still...
How much do DH sleds account for sales percent wise? I'm guessing less than 5%. They still make those.
Nomads and other 27.5 bikes will still be produced for the foreseeable future, be it in lower quantities.
EugenM wrote:
Not quite. DH bikes need to be sold for racing. They aren't racing the Nomad.
Dude you clearly just hate the Nomad we get it. You're beating a dead horse right now. Go buy a Megatower if the Nomad is such a terrible bike.
SC isn't obligated to stop producing a legacy bike because you don't approve of it. Those dudes are pretty good at bikes. I think they are going to keep being them and your life wont be too adversely affected.
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EugenM
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12/14/2020 8:04am
nskerb wrote:
Dude you clearly just hate the Nomad we get it. You're beating a dead horse right now. Go buy a Megatower if the Nomad is such...
Dude you clearly just hate the Nomad we get it. You're beating a dead horse right now. Go buy a Megatower if the Nomad is such a terrible bike.
SC isn't obligated to stop producing a legacy bike because you don't approve of it. Those dudes are pretty good at bikes. I think they are going to keep being them and your life wont be too adversely affected.
No, not the bike..just its 27.5" front wheel. And that legacy is bs..because I'm asking you..why isn't still a 26" wheel bike, if the legacy is so important?
I am just trying to understand through discussing why they have decided on a 27.5 front wheel for the Nomad. I don't hate SC or the Nomad. Do tell that none of you guys look at the 650b front-wheel 2021 Nomad and thought...really...not even mullet..?(in 2021?) 😁
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12/14/2020 8:33am
krabo83 wrote:
that green is pretty ugly! [img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2020/12/14/10179/s1200_33C330BE_EA62_4E9F_95B4_4C3814EA03ED.jpg[/img]
that green is pretty ugly!

Perfect for me then
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