Hello Vital MTB Visitor,
We’re conducting a survey and would appreciate your input. Your answers will help Vital and the MTB industry better understand what riders like you want. Survey results will be used to recognize top brands. Make your voice heard!
Five lucky people will be selected at random to win a Vital MTB t-shirt.
Thanks in advance,
The Vital MTB Crew
The second response was clearly written by someone who's never ridden a set of brakes hard for months on end without tearing them down and deep cleaning/servicing them. In theory, yes... you shouldn't need to fiddle with contact point over the life of a set of pads. But in practice, slight variations in caliper alignment, piston advancement due to filth and micro tolerances, rotor straightness, etc. etc. all lead to a change in contact point feel.
Forwarding what I got from HAYES.
"The internet is not correct here. In that, Dominion is setup at assembly with ZERO dead stroke - and you cannot adjust this to have less than none.
Effectively you'll block the timing port and the brakes will not be able to be bled or function properly.
The pistons advance as pads wear, all disc brakes should function this way - just like on an automobile.
You can back this adjustment out to have more lever pull - or some deadstroke."
I may not follow correctly , but it sounds like bite point adjuster is not taking any role? Read also somewhere that this is factory set and shouldn't be moved ?
In the above picture, you can see the pushrod, which is used to adjust the bite point. Clockwise advances the piston in the bore, counterclockwise retreats it. Adjust it too much and the seal on the piston can block off the timing port hole, circled in red, effectively closing the brake off. Hayes made much about setting this gap between seal and port holes as minimum as possible from the factory and recommend against mucking around with it. Bite point adjustment does nothing to the caliper pistons' location. That is designed into the seal and seal seat interface and cannot be adjusted by any dial or screw. So yep, everything they said is correct. Sounds like you maybe weren't familiar with the terminology, so here's hoping the cutaway sheds some light on things.
I futzed with changing the pushrod length when I owned a couple pairs of Dominions, and they were all set to slightly different lengths from the factory. So I don't buy that they're set at the absolute minimum limit. They definitely have a nominal length specification (I know because when I went too far, I asked for what it should be to go back to factory setting) but assembly tolerances are a thing. The BPC is definitely set to the minimum position from the factory though. It's just that there is slight variation in how far into the pivot bushing the pushrod is threaded. Because of system leverage, tiny changes to the pushrod length (talking <0.1mm) can be felt at the lever.
It is wild to me that the majority of discussion in this thread continues to be around the 8-year-old Hayes Dominion. For the record, I own three sets.
There is a really simple solution to minimising lever throw and not blocking off the timing port - adjust the bite point/pushrod with the bleed syringes connected and make sure fluid still goes from lever to caliper. It takes a bit of trial and error but its foolproof.
People gotta tinker.
What I did
Turned push-rod almost fully clockwise - as shown on this topic to eliminate dead stroke movement.Here I should be safe as only moving counterclockwise too much could move piston too much and block the timing port - this is my understanding
and here is what I don't understand:
Official Avid stream describes that user can play with bite point adjust screw to eliminate the free pad movement. It's full to "-" by factory but if we want we can turn it more towards "+" to quicker engage pads to rotor.
So we have one unofficial way (turning push rod clockwise) and second way by using the screw ?
How about bite point screw at that moment - should it be full "-" like from factory or it doesn't matter ?
I would bottom the screw out at that point to stop you being able to adjust past it in future. I can't remember if that's at the - or + direction.
It probably doesn't matter if you won't ever adjust it again.
What other screw are you referring to?
Just following up on this post/question. I now have 3 rides on this setup, the first one didn't count because in typical sram/maxima mineral oil bleed challenges, I developed some soft levers half way through the ride.
At any rate I am really happy with how these brakes turned out. The combo of the maven base master cylinders and the db8 brakes are honestly perfect for a trail brake. These have a lot more power than codes and the combination with the direct link maven base master cylinder makes for a very light lever feel but a nice ramp up into the power. I would say that they are about 25-30% more powerful then a code/motiv and have a lighter lever feel then a code rsc. The deadband isn't quite as light as the maven base (or a motiv) but that's because they have far less deadband then the maven base setup.
Honestly I prefer these to both motivs and codes. I would go as far as saying that for a trail bike, I honestly prefer these over the maven base as it's easier to feel where the pads are contacting the rotor within the deadband. Top it all off with the fact that they are lighter then mavens is a bonus for a trail bike application. If you have db8's or motivs and you're wanting more power... I would suggest getting yourself some maven base master cyl/levers and putting those on.
Does anyone have any experience on the new semi metallic pad from TRP compared to the old metallic ones? And how they would compare to something like the Shimano metallic? I need to replace the pads in a set of Shimanos and am thinking of trying them since they fit.
When I turned that fully "-" as google suggest than I was not able to bleed. 3 turns toward the "+" opened the channel and fluid could move.
The one commented in red.
In that case set it as far as it goes in the "-" direction when you've confirmed your pushrod adjustment isn't blocking the port at that point
Small feedback on the TRP RS05E rotors in 220mm after a season, the rear is dead (1.8mm), front still has some life (1.95mm), and most importantly the braking surface is still pretty smooth. They're a bit noisy compared to more "full" versions of rotors (even the RS01), but held up good!
I guess I'll add a pair of rotors to the dozen of pads I order at the start of the uplift season, which lasts from early may until late october (or in case of last year, late april until early november)
And this is the only solution I can find.
What is weird is that factory doesn't mention this kind of impact, just to avoid confusion.
I think that is how they are supposed to leave the factory, when Hayes says that the contact adjust will be set up with minimum level throw when you first open the box. But it definitely was not the case for the set I bought and manually adjusting the plunger made the brakes feel infinitely better for me.
Well discussion with Hayess seems to be pointless.
"We can offer no details on adjusting those beyond that as we've no procedures on this outside of assembly."
Nobody has played with those settings at the same time. Even having bite point screw full "-" makes bleeding impossible. Customer should just buy and not ask.
Does anyone know if I can use SRAM 11.5018.054.008 (SRAM Maven Ultimate/Silver Brake Lever Internals & Service Kit (B1)) to upgrade my A1 Mavens that developed leaks and air ingestion?
I'm looking to replace all the internals, and as a bonus point get a gold camshaft - will it work? I'm also probably fine staying on the red cam shaft, I only really care about the internals fixed.
Well that part should be identical unless they changed something silently so I don’t see why it wouldn’t work
Post a reply to: Nerding out on Brakes shall we? Not another tech deraliment