Coil Shock Shootout

thegromit wrote:

Just reread your post here and then looked at the FF piston kit. I noticed that you said all tuning via the base valve, which I...

Just reread your post here and then looked at the FF piston kit. I noticed that you said all tuning via the base valve, which I wasn't sure if that was a joke. On their site on picture looks like they're using a belleville washer on the main piston. Is this correct? Is most of the valving changes at the base valve? I got a Ohlins tuned through them and they actually told me they removed the belleville washer in favor of a traditional shim stack. I know that architecture is different between the shocks but I was surprised to see they may have gone this direction but maybe its easier for at home tuners to only build a single stack and not have any issues balance between mid and base valves.

Skunk Works Suspension wrote:

No, definitely not just tuning via the base valve. But it is modified from stock for all the options being tested. The stock base valve setup on...

No, definitely not just tuning via the base valve. But it is modified from stock for all the options being tested. 

The stock base valve setup on the Bomber CR/Fox Van is quite stiff and uses belleville washers. All three tuning options (Avalanche Racing, Fluid Focus, and Shockcraft) remove the belleville washers and convert the base valve to a more traditional shim stack. All three use different base valve tunes, and Avalanche uses a different needle for the bleed (LSC clicker) as well.

Fluid Focus and Shockcraft both use a different main piston, while Avalanche uses the stock main piston. All three use different compression and rebound shim stacks that correspond to the base valve tune they spec. They all use standard shims, no belleville washers anywhere.

Just about ready to start testing shocks. The Vorsprung Telum was run to get a DAQ baseline and as a means of getting the fork setup dialed. This test bike is currently working quite well, the plan is to just swap in each of the three different shocks and keep the fork in it's current state. Also added a shorter track to the test procedure capable of 10+ runs/day. More data, more better!

 

Friedrich wrote:

The MY26 DHX2 is fundamentally a good design, but it will also need tinkering to work properly. The compression adjuster has next to no effect. See...

The MY26 DHX2 is fundamentally a good design, but it will also need tinkering to work properly. The compression adjuster has next to no effect. See e.g. Fluid Focuses video where they have a MY26 DHX2 on the dyno. 

I think if you are expected to land in the 300-500lbs/in range, the Shockcraft kit is going to be your best bet. Single grade tunes, no tune swapping for each ~75lbs/in increment. 

I like my Shockcraft Van. Guess it depends on what you expect of a shock, but as far as I am concerned, it doesn't feel "magic" in compression, rather very controlled or "muted". I love the rebound. Absolutely predictable, no kicking. Running it with a 500lbs/in coil in my DH bike.

Friedrich wrote:

The MY26 DHX2 is fundamentally a good design, but it will also need tinkering to work properly. The compression adjuster has next to no effect. See...

The MY26 DHX2 is fundamentally a good design, but it will also need tinkering to work properly. The compression adjuster has next to no effect. See e.g. Fluid Focuses video where they have a MY26 DHX2 on the dyno. 

I think if you are expected to land in the 300-500lbs/in range, the Shockcraft kit is going to be your best bet. Single grade tunes, no tune swapping for each ~75lbs/in increment. 

I like my Shockcraft Van. Guess it depends on what you expect of a shock, but as far as I am concerned, it doesn't feel "magic" in compression, rather very controlled or "muted". I love the rebound. Absolutely predictable, no kicking. Running it with a 500lbs/in coil in my DH bike.

Teknik wrote:

If this is true, then the MY26 DHX2 might have the same dad as my old GRIP2 Fox 40 that has those highly decorative compression adjusters...

If this is true, then the MY26 DHX2 might have the same dad as my old GRIP2 Fox 40 that has those highly decorative compression adjusters. I'm getting a feeling that every year, the only flow Fox products actually have takes them further away from the customer.

acs182 wrote:

Have you ridden the Shockcraft kit yet? How does it compare to the FF?

Deciding between these two options currently or just going with a 26 DHX2 

Skunk Works Suspension wrote:

Agreed that the Shockcraft Bomber CR kit is more plug and play if you are in the spring rate range (300#-500#). In general terms the feel...

Agreed that the Shockcraft Bomber CR kit is more plug and play if you are in the spring rate range (300#-500#). In general terms the feel is more controlled and muted compared to the FF kit. Still very sensitive, but just less "free" feeling. Possibly the result of it being fully checked where the FF kit still has a bleed.

The Fluid Focus kit includes a range of compression and rebound tunes, and is great if you want to experiment with tuning and open the shock up multiple times. In regards to rebound, I have tried to eliminate the top out clunk in this shock (205x65) as well as a 250x75 Bomber CR multiple times with no success. Fluid Focus suggests adding face shims until the top out is gone, I have added shims to the point where the rebound clicker was almost fully open and the clunk was still there. It's not horrible, similar to Ohlins coil shocks that don't have the newer hydraulic top out. Bit I know some people can't stand it.

PSA for the current Fox DHX2, there have been multiple cases of the damper body coming loose on the trunnion version of these. There was one at a race just last weekend. Possibly an issue with production as they are typically thread locked and have a high torque spec. Just a heads up if you have one. It can present initially as a clunk, like a loose shock bolt.

This spring/early summer has been much busier than anticipated, but I have been pecking away as I can with the coil comparison. The local lift just started running this week and will help greatly with timing runs. 

 

Friedrich wrote:

The MY26 DHX2 is fundamentally a good design, but it will also need tinkering to work properly. The compression adjuster has next to no effect. See...

The MY26 DHX2 is fundamentally a good design, but it will also need tinkering to work properly. The compression adjuster has next to no effect. See e.g. Fluid Focuses video where they have a MY26 DHX2 on the dyno. 

I think if you are expected to land in the 300-500lbs/in range, the Shockcraft kit is going to be your best bet. Single grade tunes, no tune swapping for each ~75lbs/in increment. 

I like my Shockcraft Van. Guess it depends on what you expect of a shock, but as far as I am concerned, it doesn't feel "magic" in compression, rather very controlled or "muted". I love the rebound. Absolutely predictable, no kicking. Running it with a 500lbs/in coil in my DH bike.

Teknik wrote:

If this is true, then the MY26 DHX2 might have the same dad as my old GRIP2 Fox 40 that has those highly decorative compression adjusters...

If this is true, then the MY26 DHX2 might have the same dad as my old GRIP2 Fox 40 that has those highly decorative compression adjusters. I'm getting a feeling that every year, the only flow Fox products actually have takes them further away from the customer.

comatosegi wrote:

I think it's just a byproduct of going to a monotube with a shimmed base valve, less adjustment range than a twin-tube.  The base valve needs...

I think it's just a byproduct of going to a monotube with a shimmed base valve, less adjustment range than a twin-tube.  The base valve needs to be matched properly with the main piston tunes.  New aftermarket 26/27 DHX2 comes with CL70 compression tune, which is middle of the road.  Most of the factory OE tunes I have seen seem to be softer.  You can definitely feel more oil moving through the system, than the older twin tube DHX2.