My guess would be that there is less weight distributed up front. More weight distributed on the rear creates more heat that allows those sinter pads...
My guess would be that there is less weight distributed up front. More weight distributed on the rear creates more heat that allows those sinter pads to be in there optimal state. Your solution of organic pads up front and sintered on the rear makes perfect sense to me to deal with the noise you're experiencing.
You could explain a hotter rear brake with excessive dragging which isnt too unlikely but the weight distribution explanation is forgetting about Newton's first law of...
You could explain a hotter rear brake with excessive dragging which isnt too unlikely but the weight distribution explanation is forgetting about Newton's first law of motion
Anyways, obviously this is completely anecdotal but I've had a few experiences now with TRP rotors (and a couple other heavy 2.3mm rotors, to be fair to TRP) not playing nicely with metal pads and glazing in the front. Each time fixed by using lighter 2mm rotors after very carefully testing for contamination
Why would using a metal pad with a thinker rotor make it more prone to glazing?
My thinking was the less intense / hard braking on the front (more feathering) coupled with greater heat absorption of the metal pads & thicker rotor would mess with the compound transfer to the rotor and slow down the natural burn off of the surface of the pads. Then once it glazes it would just make the problem worse. I did swap rotors & pads between the front wheel of ebike & rear of pedal bike last night and will give it a shot. The sintered pads I pulled off the ebike front were indeed very glossy - gave them a quick sanding pass to take the shine off.
I've previously tried putting on a fresh front rotor & (sintered) pads on the ebike and the noise came back after a few rides. Hence my thinking it's compound related.
You could explain a hotter rear brake with excessive dragging which isnt too unlikely but the weight distribution explanation is forgetting about Newton's first law of...
You could explain a hotter rear brake with excessive dragging which isnt too unlikely but the weight distribution explanation is forgetting about Newton's first law of motion
Anyways, obviously this is completely anecdotal but I've had a few experiences now with TRP rotors (and a couple other heavy 2.3mm rotors, to be fair to TRP) not playing nicely with metal pads and glazing in the front. Each time fixed by using lighter 2mm rotors after very carefully testing for contamination
My thinking was the less intense / hard braking on the front (more feathering) coupled with greater heat absorption of the metal pads & thicker rotor...
My thinking was the less intense / hard braking on the front (more feathering) coupled with greater heat absorption of the metal pads & thicker rotor would mess with the compound transfer to the rotor and slow down the natural burn off of the surface of the pads. Then once it glazes it would just make the problem worse. I did swap rotors & pads between the front wheel of ebike & rear of pedal bike last night and will give it a shot. The sintered pads I pulled off the ebike front were indeed very glossy - gave them a quick sanding pass to take the shine off.
I've previously tried putting on a fresh front rotor & (sintered) pads on the ebike and the noise came back after a few rides. Hence my thinking it's compound related.
All of my hard braking is done with the front. The rear gets used in corners and modulated with less front brake on the steeps
The front brake/rear brake thing really comes down to terrain and riding style, but mostly terrain. There are trails where it's easier for me to accidentally make my rear tire skid, and other trails where it's easier for me to accidentally make my front tire skid.
If grip is good on a trail, my weight is typically going to shift forward when I brake, loading the front tire and creating grip there while unloading the rear. On trails like that my front brake is going to do most of the work slowing me down, which is what we would typically expect from a basic free body diagram in physics or engineering 101. Because my rear tire is unloaded, there's no grip there and I can skid the back of the bike all over the place, left to right, while my front tire is doing all the real work to slow me down. By the way, all that rear tire skidding doesn't feel sketchy, if anything it feels awesome. For example, jamming hard on the brakes in braking bumps into a tight turn. Tons of traction, front tire gripping.
But if grip is bad, hitting my brakes might not generate enough deceleration to significantly shift my weight onto the front tire, which means that my rear tire is going to be the grippy one and it's my front tire that's going to slip. But front tire skids on steep and gnarly trails with low grip don't feel sick and awesome and cool, they're terrifying, so I end up doing most of my braking with my rear brake on steep and gnarly trails. Same for lower angle trails with low grip (i.e. most of southern California for 364 days a year) where I'm nursing my front brake the whole time and saving it for the bits where there's traction.
So yes, in theory we would expect front brakes "to do most of the work," and that's what actually happens under "normal circumstances." But in practice, less-than-normal circumstances are actually pretty common in mountain biking, leading to a less-than-trustworthy relationship with the front brake. This is why I've really fallen in love with Troy Brosnan's "bigger rotor in the back" setup. It makes both of my brakes feel more similar in practice, instead of my rear brake feeling like a brake and my front brake feeling like an instant-death skid trigger.
Honestly, every once in a while I like to practice using only one brake to control my speed for a descent, it really makes you approach trails differently and helps you to learn how to adjust your braking in the fly. Just do it on trails you know haha. I've been thinking about running 220 rotors front and rear on the DH bike, Shimano mt520s with trickstuff pads and 203 rotors has not been strong enough
^100%. The trail I built last winter is designed to be heavy on the front, and skid-sliding the rear around on every tight corner. It rides best when it's dusty (which luckily is most of the time). But a lot of our other trails grip sucks so you can only brake hard in quick blips between corners, and the rest of the time you have to bias rear and keep the front moving.
Did a ride with organic front after work and it was dead silent. Now time will tell whether it stays that way, and if the sintered and pair rotor that I put on the rear of the other bike stay quiet. Power was a bit less but I'm sure I will retrain my brain for bite points quickly. Also, thinking back, I experienced something similar a few years ago when I tried to run an HS2 220 rotor front on my ebike (at that time with Dominions & their sintered pads). The sintered + 220 front was constantly noisy. Dropping that down to a 200 made that better, and I may have also ended up going to organic front.
My thinking was the less intense / hard braking on the front (more feathering) coupled with greater heat absorption of the metal pads & thicker rotor would mess with the compound transfer to the rotor and slow down the natural burn off of the surface of the pads. Then once it glazes it would just make the problem worse. I did swap rotors & pads between the front wheel of ebike & rear of pedal bike last night and will give it a shot. The sintered pads I pulled off the ebike front were indeed very glossy - gave them a quick sanding pass to take the shine off.
I've previously tried putting on a fresh front rotor & (sintered) pads on the ebike and the noise came back after a few rides. Hence my thinking it's compound related.
All of my hard braking is done with the front. The rear gets used in corners and modulated with less front brake on the steeps
The front brake/rear brake thing really comes down to terrain and riding style, but mostly terrain. There are trails where it's easier for me to accidentally make my rear tire skid, and other trails where it's easier for me to accidentally make my front tire skid.
If grip is good on a trail, my weight is typically going to shift forward when I brake, loading the front tire and creating grip there while unloading the rear. On trails like that my front brake is going to do most of the work slowing me down, which is what we would typically expect from a basic free body diagram in physics or engineering 101. Because my rear tire is unloaded, there's no grip there and I can skid the back of the bike all over the place, left to right, while my front tire is doing all the real work to slow me down. By the way, all that rear tire skidding doesn't feel sketchy, if anything it feels awesome. For example, jamming hard on the brakes in braking bumps into a tight turn. Tons of traction, front tire gripping.
But if grip is bad, hitting my brakes might not generate enough deceleration to significantly shift my weight onto the front tire, which means that my rear tire is going to be the grippy one and it's my front tire that's going to slip. But front tire skids on steep and gnarly trails with low grip don't feel sick and awesome and cool, they're terrifying, so I end up doing most of my braking with my rear brake on steep and gnarly trails. Same for lower angle trails with low grip (i.e. most of southern California for 364 days a year) where I'm nursing my front brake the whole time and saving it for the bits where there's traction.
So yes, in theory we would expect front brakes "to do most of the work," and that's what actually happens under "normal circumstances." But in practice, less-than-normal circumstances are actually pretty common in mountain biking, leading to a less-than-trustworthy relationship with the front brake. This is why I've really fallen in love with Troy Brosnan's "bigger rotor in the back" setup. It makes both of my brakes feel more similar in practice, instead of my rear brake feeling like a brake and my front brake feeling like an instant-death skid trigger.
Honestly, every once in a while I like to practice using only one brake to control my speed for a descent, it really makes you approach trails differently and helps you to learn how to adjust your braking in the fly. Just do it on trails you know haha. I've been thinking about running 220 rotors front and rear on the DH bike, Shimano mt520s with trickstuff pads and 203 rotors has not been strong enough
^100%. The trail I built last winter is designed to be heavy on the front, and skid-sliding the rear around on every tight corner. It rides best when it's dusty (which luckily is most of the time). But a lot of our other trails grip sucks so you can only brake hard in quick blips between corners, and the rest of the time you have to bias rear and keep the front moving.
Did a ride with organic front after work and it was dead silent. Now time will tell whether it stays that way, and if the sintered and pair rotor that I put on the rear of the other bike stay quiet. Power was a bit less but I'm sure I will retrain my brain for bite points quickly. Also, thinking back, I experienced something similar a few years ago when I tried to run an HS2 220 rotor front on my ebike (at that time with Dominions & their sintered pads). The sintered + 220 front was constantly noisy. Dropping that down to a 200 made that better, and I may have also ended up going to organic front.
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