Tubeless help, please! (Update)

PS- when people talk about Gorliia tape, they're talking about Gorilla Tape you buy at Home Depot, right? Duct tape?

Can I ask what rim/ tire combo you have?
Not all valves work with all rim profiles, Roval suggests their valve, and magic does the same.
Gorilla tape is not completely air tight, while the stans tape is. If there is any corrosion on the rim bed it will let air into the spoke holes and around the tape.

I'm running WTB STP i25 rims and a Maxxis Highroller II on this wheel. The bead is insanely good; I can rarely get it back off without a lot of cursing! The air is definitely not coming out between the wheel/tire.

Thanks for the info. Maybe I'll go back to the Stan's tape. I'm still not sure that's what is causing this leak, though. There's a lot of air coming out. It's blowing big, fast bubbles from under the nut on the valve stem.

I had a similar problem with a wheel at work the other day. That rim had an asymmetric profile such that the valve hole was not centered on the high point of the rim. A second, fatter o ring on the outside solved my problem.

if air is leaking at the valve, its probably the valve/valve insertion point
-+1 for bigger rubber o-ring in between the rim and valve collar
-with the valve installed and collar hand tight, put the wheel on the ground and push on the valve from the back to create more slack for spinning the collar even further - obviously we want to be able to get the valve out in an emergency on the trail so dont over tighten or use a tool to tighten
-it takes time for sealant to work - if air is coming out at the valve, install everything including sealant and get the sealant where the leak is. spin the wheel so the valve is at the bottom, and gently shake the wheel so sealant will splash the valve over and over again. you can also gently bounce the wheel against the ground with leaky side hitting the ground.

I'll try the o-ring trick.

By the way, in my most recent attempts I've been using no sealant in the wheel, just to see if it holds air at the stem. Does the Gorilla tape need to be "conditioned" with sealant to work?
Obviously, I intend to run sealant for punctures but I was just planning on squeezing it in through the valve stem after determining I didn't have to disassemble again..

Falcon wrote:

I'll try the o-ring trick.

By the way, in my most recent attempts I've been using no sealant in the wheel, just to see if it holds air at the stem. Does the Gorilla tape need to be "conditioned" with sealant to work?
Obviously, I intend to run sealant for punctures but I was just planning on squeezing it in through the valve stem after determining I didn't have to disassemble again..

Gorilla tape doesn't seem to be the solution to your stem problem. Stans tape isn't woven like the gorilla or duck tape. I have found heating up the end of a pokey tool (pick, needle, dentist's torture instrument) then creating a perfect hole in the tape to work the best with situations involving the valve. Stans tape has a tendency to split if you cut the valve hole too big.

Another solution could be to get the specific WTB valve. It is designed to work with WTB rims and should fit yours well.

Cant you just stick the wheel in the bath and see where its leaking? I have also sprayed soapy water around the valve stem and spotted the bubbles confirming its the valve

Good luck

The air is definitely coming from underneath the valve collar nut. None of the spoke nipples are blowing bubbles but the valve stem is. I can see it coming out from under the nut; it has a flat profile and the rim is curved so it's easy to see with soapy water.
I've been heating up a phillips screwdriver to puncture the tape over the stem hole.

How tight are you turning the nut on the valve? The rubber piece on the end of the valve is meant to create a seal so that no air escapes through the valve hole.

If nothing else works i would suggest getting the rubber conversion strips with the valve moulded into the strip.
Either that or getting the WTB TCS valves what are made to slot directly into the channel.

I've tried "finger" tight, "push on the back side with my thumb + finger" tight, and "deform the inner rubber cone because you cranked on the collar nut with pliers" tight. None seems to work.

I'm going to try the rubber o-ring trick first; that should go between the cone-shaped rubber piece on the valve stem and the inside of the rim, against the wheel tape, right? (That's where the air has to stop.)

dude! why are you not using sealant?? that is what sealant is for... it sealzes shit. you could be done days ago

dirtyberd wrote:

dude! why are you not using sealant?? that is what sealant is for... it sealzes shit. you could be done days ago

I do use sealant, but removing it every time I had to re-disassemble the wheel was getting old the other day. The leak is far too fast for the sealant to stop it. I'm trying to get the main malfunction corrected and then I'll run the sealant again.

What brand valve are you using?
You shouldn't have to put an o ring on the outside of the rim. That means air and air pressure is getting to a place where it isn't supposed to be. That means sealant and other liquid will be getting to the spokes and causing corrosion.
I had this same problem on another WTB rim (an older frequency rim).
Good luck! - I mean it, I've been there, and I do tubeless conversions for a living!

Broken_spoke.photo wrote:

What brand valve are you using?
You shouldn't have to put an o ring on the outside of the rim. That means air and air pressure is getting to a place where it isn't supposed to be. That means sealant and other liquid will be getting to the spokes and causing corrosion.
I had this same problem on another WTB rim (an older frequency rim).
Good luck! - I mean it, I've been there, and I do tubeless conversions for a living!

This is what I was thinking.

For now, I'm giving up. I just grabbed a tube and went riding over the weekend. I'm over it. Gonna recharge for a few weeks or months and then try again... start all over with branded wheel tape and some professional help.

UPDATE: I finally got it to work!

I had been using the cheap "universal" tubeless valves and the air was escaping around the valve stem. Gushing out, in fact. I bought a new Stan's universal valve some time ago thinking it would help, but I was having the same problem. Since it was almost time for a new wheelset anyway, I figured I'd just start all over when I got the new wheels. The ones I chose came pre-taped from the factory, so I figured they would be good. Well, I tried the Stan's valve and got nothing. I was able to seat the tire, but the damn thing went flat in less than 30 seconds. I had sealant in there, and of course it made a toxic mess all over my garage!
I figured I'd either stomp on down to the bike shop and offer to pay $10,000,000 to the first person who could keep air in my tubeless tires, or try a different approach; so I got some Orange Seal valves. These are a little pricier ($25,) and have a few color options in the bag for the lock nut. They come with an o-ring as part of the design, so I figured that might help as well. How'd they work? Perfect. First try. No more leaking.
It may be some crazy coincidence, but the Orange Seal hardware fixed my problem. I'm sold!

PS- yes, I ran tubes in my wheels for two+ years because I was so frustrated trying to get tubeless to work!

Falcon wrote:

UPDATE: I finally got it to work!

I had been using the cheap "universal" tubeless valves and the air was escaping around the valve stem. Gushing out, in fact. I bought a new Stan's universal valve some time ago thinking it would help, but I was having the same problem. Since it was almost time for a new wheelset anyway, I figured I'd just start all over when I got the new wheels. The ones I chose came pre-taped from the factory, so I figured they would be good. Well, I tried the Stan's valve and got nothing. I was able to seat the tire, but the damn thing went flat in less than 30 seconds. I had sealant in there, and of course it made a toxic mess all over my garage!
I figured I'd either stomp on down to the bike shop and offer to pay $10,000,000 to the first person who could keep air in my tubeless tires, or try a different approach; so I got some Orange Seal valves. These are a little pricier ($25,) and have a few color options in the bag for the lock nut. They come with an o-ring as part of the design, so I figured that might help as well. How'd they work? Perfect. First try. No more leaking.
It may be some crazy coincidence, but the Orange Seal hardware fixed my problem. I'm sold!

It's really important that the rim tape is cut properly at the valve hole. The last bike I bought, I couldn't keep the rear from leaking around the valve stem. For a year I fought it until I guess enough sealant coagulated around the hole to seal it up. Fast forward to a few months ago. I bought new tires and when I was inspecting the rim tape, I noticed that they (LBS) actually took a razor knife and cut a hole in the tape where the valve went. Well, it had stretched and exposed bare aluminum. The valve absolutely would not seal against it.

I decided to install new rim tape and this time I merely took a awl and poked a small hole for the valve to go through. Now, the valve was sealing against the rim tape, and not the rim itself. I haven't had any issues with it since I did this. works like a charm.

^ I'm doing a similar thing; the valves I bought have a choice of seat options and I tried the block instead of the cone. It basically mashes a large, rectangular area on the inside of the rim bed instead of trying to plug the stem hole. It is covering several millimeters of flat area around the hole in every direction, obviously on the tape.

The moral of the story is: don't cheap out on the valves, guys!