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sspomer
3/7/2011 8:21am
3/7/2011 8:21am
Edited Date/Time
8/12/2014 2:14am
Hey everyone, I just wanted to lay this out there as a general rule in comments on photos and videos.
PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR LOCATIONS OF TRAILS IN THE COMMENTS
PLEASE DO NOT GIVE AWAY LOCATIONS OF TRAILS IN THE COMMENTS
if the person posting the photos or videos wants you to know the location, they will tell you in the descriptions. if they don't want you to know, they won't say.
there are many reasons to keep trail locations quiet and asking for locations online doesn't help anyone out, especially the people who put their sweat and time into making the trails.
thanks!
spomer
PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR LOCATIONS OF TRAILS IN THE COMMENTS
PLEASE DO NOT GIVE AWAY LOCATIONS OF TRAILS IN THE COMMENTS
if the person posting the photos or videos wants you to know the location, they will tell you in the descriptions. if they don't want you to know, they won't say.
there are many reasons to keep trail locations quiet and asking for locations online doesn't help anyone out, especially the people who put their sweat and time into making the trails.
thanks!
spomer
If you haven't got a riding spot close to you, dig one. Pump tracks are the most efficient riding areas you can build. They fit in almost anywhere and if built properly can be fun and challenging for everyone, beginners to pro riders.
Feel free to message me for some pump track tips/designs or go buy Leelikesbikes' book
spomer is speaking the truth. if more people gave the courtesy to the builder and didnt talk about fight club the better we would all be!
Is the trail on public land? Sorry, you did work for the better of society(the riders, and we thank you), get over yourself.
Private land? Post signs and prosecute
Illegal? My guess is most are illegal and that is the reason they dont want to be found out.
I would have to question the ethics of such an endeavor, what are people thinking...if it was your land would you approve illegal trails?
If it is legal then it is open to the public, then what is the issue?
I happen to enjoy it when hoards of people ride the trails i spent so many hours building. The local club keeps up maintenance so I don't have too.
If everyone was on the level, this would be a moot point.
oh....and thanks to the other builders out there 'til dark building and maintaining. I don't know all your faces, but I see your vehicles and labor out in woods. Props
Did anyone else see the article in MBA (yes, I know, it's MBA) about the author's opinion on "DH race bikes"? He (she?) thinks that all DH (race) bikes should come w/ a warning sticker that designates them as "closed course" bikes that shouldn't be ridden outside of sanctioned trails. He goes on to explain that gravity riders are giving all mountain bikers a bad name because they build so many illegal trails and authorities are not distinguishing between gravity riders and your average mountain biker.
While I think that article was a bit chachy, it brings up a good point. The way we're doing it now isn't sustainable (although, it is fun).
The solution? More places like Bootleg Canyon and the downhill-only trails in the PNW.
Cheers,
Will
We as a collective(whatever you want to call us, DH, FR, Black diamond, Gravity, or whatever new stupid name they have now for having fun on your bike) need to start talking to private landowners and legitimizing our trails. Otherwise we will not have any.
BTW, I do build "illegal" trails and would rather not have mass traffic showing up at them, but the local word of mouth is just as bad as the internet sometimes.
Build...get people involved in the spot or other spots...exhibit a need...present to the city....
They aren't going to set aside land if they don't know people are participating in these activities.
I have built trails for over twenty years, legit and not, on private and on public land. I can remember when you could just ask most land owners and they literally couldn't have cared less as long as you didn't cause any trouble. Inevitably though, trouble comes looking to do its thing. I'll skip the legit/pirate debate because I think we can all agree on the basic truths and potential consequences. To me it seems the real underlying problem is and always has been the sense of entitlement that trail "users" exhibit. I do not employ the word "user" nicely. Users are the folks who ride our trails, complain about our trails, re-rout and alter our trails, show up in droves and draw all kinds of unproductive attention. Users do not get involved with the trail building process or builders in any (productive) way. Every aspect of trailbuilding is hard work. It's a labor of love and builders are passionate about their craft. Most builders do want their trails to be ridden and enjoyed but have learned that popularity is a kiss of death. Where I live now, I could list at least a dozen users by name who are notorious for hunting down trails, destroying the builder's work and creating disastrous erosion and mud problems, and even breaking gates to gain shuttle access to trails that were not designed for that level of impact. Obviously this kind of behavior will threaten a secret trail, but the damage actually comes harder and more swiftly to legit trails that have a knowing owner who was just fine with things before the troubles came.
Again, to my point, the problem is self-entitled users. We would love to have you all on board. We could have more legit and better maintained trails, and you would all find that your riding skill and vision improve dramatically. Unfortunately the trend I see growing now is these same users taking their sense of entitlement out to the woods with shovel in hand to build their own trails, often literally right on top of existing lines. Riding spots that were quite sustainable for years are being turned into sprawling abominations. The go-it-alone attitude of these newbies is resulting in the absolute worst trailbuilding practices I have ever seen. If these users would show any respect for their elders they would get involved and learn from our experience. Nothing hurts me more than seeing guys who just gripe about trails being too hard or having features they don't like waste their time and energy cutting a new trail just feet away that isn't even built to last through the next rain. I"m all for building trails, but for F*%K's sake, If you aren't even creative enough to find a place to do it maybe you're not ready. If you are going to do it, do it right and make it last. Just because you paid for a bike doesn't entitle you to ANYTHING. Not even riding it. There are lift passes for that. If you want to build trail, great, but just like anything else, if you are going to do it right you are going to have to put in a lot of time and work. And you're going to be a whole lot better off if you get to know some experienced trailbuilders and work with them and learn from them.
End rant...for now
THE ONLY BENEFIT THAT "USERS" BRING TO THE SPORT IS LINING THE POCKETS OF BIG BIKE COMPANY EXECS.
Something I would like to add to this is, if the rider can't ride a section don't make the trail easier or an alternate line to the side. Man up stuff your pride, and walk it. Find a person that can ride it and ask for advice. Most people will help.
-Vince
I think the real problem is that as a group DH and FR riders have such little legal access. We need to create more legal DH specific spots like Bootleg and Blackrock. We cant just keep building illegal trails. I have ridden up in SC and there are some amazing trails up there, but there are also a ton of irrelevant side trails, unhappy neighbors, and increased traffic. These are things that are not going to go away! The actuality is that the world is getting more populated every day and the open space we need to ride our bikes is at a premium. Illegal trails are not helping us out in the long run. They are fun, dont get me wrong, but it has to change and the sooner the better. We all think legal trails are going to be boring, and most right now are, so we as a user group need to find new ways to make sick, legal, DH trails. My two cents..
Ryan
Be clear, be professional, and tell them you'll spend money to ride there.
And yeah, maybe people can leave the logo wrapped trucks and vans somewhere the rangers on Rte 9 don't have to drive by them you lazy bastids.
It is the only form of MTB that is not - "Site Specific" and thus cannot be taken away. I don't have to worry about "poaching" someones already " poach built" trail ......or wonder if a "No Trespassing" sign is going to appear one day on a BLM Trail because some one was being a freak...... And Sure, I have to worry about someone calling the cops on me, but Street is literally everywhere. ......No Dig- Just Ride.
Street is (to me, personally) neither an option nor is it a solution to the problem. The problem wouldn´t be a problem in the first place if people would manage to stick to trail etiquette and keep their mouth shut. Especially on the internet.
/By the way: The beauty of mountainbiking is that it isn´t "site specific" like you said. I can take my bike, get out the front door and hoon about in the woods till kingdom comes. No limits whatsoever. Where there´s a mountain (and preferably some forest), there´s mountainbiking. And don´t call a mountain a "specific site" or I´ll have to ask if you´d have a swimming comp in the dry. Rant over.
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