Meh. I know it's technically on theme but I really don't want this to turn into another economy thread that wades in the paddling pool of...
Meh. I know it's technically on theme but I really don't want this to turn into another economy thread that wades in the paddling pool of 'i know people doing fine so things are fine.
National average minimum wage is 9 bucks (and thats after a decent bump through covid of course). Average rent is somewhere between 1500-2k, depending on which unreliable source you care to cite. Average house cost is 360k-500k, also depending on which unreliable source you cherry pick. (Not even gonna touch on housing cost where I live lol, hence using averages)
We're choking our middle class and gate keeping the next generation (as per tradition!) and the fact that a neighbor who works a trade is doing ok and a neighbor who is a teacher and is struggling... Doesn't mean Thanos has perfectly balanced the economy and both people are able to mountain bike. A reductive conversation on the economy is probably NOT what this thread needs. Whoever brought it up first may now assume the position for the paddling...
This is CLEARLY a thread where everyone announces that they do, indeed, have children now. And seal in concrete the age demo of the forums lol
I do like the narrative of 'nobodys upgrading because theres just no need to upgrade' at the moment. There was essentially a full paradigm shift around 2015, from wheel size to droppers to axle standards to increased use or better use of carbon, obviously better geo, etc.
And it seemingly peaked right before 2020 and has gotten well into diminishing returns status since. Luckily smaller parts have had slightly more compelling upgrade narratives. Wireless if you're into that, budget 1x drivetrains (and bikes) worth buying, various Ochain or Sidekick type products, some cool store on bike tool stuff that to me seems more compelling than 'added a box in a frame now try to shove stuff in it' tactic. Tires are kinda insane right now imo. I suppose they were quite good before but I feel like a base Conti trail tire performers much better than the base EXO maxxis probly
It seems the only 'paradigm shift' for the industry since 2020 is ebikes and making them not suck (kinda like when they had to make all around 29ers not suck). And they're getting pretty damn good at it for sure. Still not an eeber but the direction is obviously good. Regardless of power and longevity, they really just need to feel smooth to pedal and not break down constantly.
Me personally I'm just waiting for 275 to fully die so that brands can start marketing one off models of fun dual 27 bikes as a 'niche, fun' option. It needs to go full circle from irrelevant to trendy and niche hipster marketing.
I do like the narrative of 'nobodys upgrading because theres just no need to upgrade' at the moment. There was essentially a full paradigm shift around...
I do like the narrative of 'nobodys upgrading because theres just no need to upgrade' at the moment. There was essentially a full paradigm shift around 2015, from wheel size to droppers to axle standards to increased use or better use of carbon, obviously better geo, etc.
And it seemingly peaked right before 2020 and has gotten well into diminishing returns status since. Luckily smaller parts have had slightly more compelling upgrade narratives. Wireless if you're into that, budget 1x drivetrains (and bikes) worth buying, various Ochain or Sidekick type products, some cool store on bike tool stuff that to me seems more compelling than 'added a box in a frame now try to shove stuff in it' tactic. Tires are kinda insane right now imo. I suppose they were quite good before but I feel like a base Conti trail tire performers much better than the base EXO maxxis probly
It seems the only 'paradigm shift' for the industry since 2020 is ebikes and making them not suck (kinda like when they had to make all around 29ers not suck). And they're getting pretty damn good at it for sure. Still not an eeber but the direction is obviously good. Regardless of power and longevity, they really just need to feel smooth to pedal and not break down constantly.
Me personally I'm just waiting for 275 to fully die so that brands can start marketing one off models of fun dual 27 bikes as a 'niche, fun' option. It needs to go full circle from irrelevant to trendy and niche hipster marketing.
totally agree. bikes are just damn good these days. gone are the days where companies could get away with putting out stuff that was garbage on day 1, thankfully. the last product I can think of offhand that was totally DOA was the Crank Bros Kronolog dropper.
I find myself spending a little more on bikes now and have a few more in the garage to ride but I am also selling them faster. I try to get rid of stuff in about 14/16 months to help get a good price on resale. Shop around with resale in mind and you end up not loosing that much while turning the inventory over.
I feel like the slowing of development and product releases has helped maintain resale of current bikes a little bit. If you have something older then a year and a half though you may as well give it to a kid in the neighborhood so you can at least feel good about your self after it leaves.
Much less as i took early retirement 2 years ago, so have less money to waste. Plus my 4+ year old kenevo is so good i see no reason to replace it.
I just buy consumables now, tyres, chains, cassettes and brake pads. Plus a second battery, a pre-emptive motor rebuild, fork and shock service. Yeah its still quite a pricey hobby but im not buying a new bike each year now just for the sake of it.
As a follow up and with additional thought I know some of my dollars will be going toward rebuilding some old bikes that I enjoyed during the development of my skills and the modern MTB.
Such as , and I know these may seem like a waste of good energy and $ to some, but I had great experiences on these bikes and for the time and place they were and in many situations still are really good trail bikes.
2005 Trek 8500 super light weight, a 21 speed 26er but geometry fit me like a glove and I learned a lot on this bike. I will rebuild this bike, if possible, a 12 speed.
2013 Surly Instigator 2.0. Same rules apply, great geometry, Surly cool, and climbs and descends like the devil himself. I'll be rebuilding this bike.
That's where my $ will go from here on, it'll have to be an offer I can't refuse if I get a new one again.
My spending habits have changed slightly, im spending less, but im still buying the things i require, and the parts im “trying” are things like tires and rotors, I wouldn’t mind an o-chain though. Im not entirely sure why im spending less, but I have a hunch that its because instead of having a 1 bike quiver and always trying to optimise, I now have an enduro bike and a downhill bike which has stopped me continuously looking for marginal descending improvements on the enduro bike and just let me appreciate it for what it is. Another part of the puzzle is that since buying my megatower v2 which I’ve owned for approx 18 months I havent found any other carbon bikes interesting enough to make me want to buy them, this bike ticks every box exceptionally well, the geo is as close to my idea of perfect as you can get, throw in the after sales support and lifetime warranty and it has me feeling very content. If i were to buy another enduro or trail bike my eyes are firmly set on something like a RAAW or Frameworks regardless of their high cost; with frame works being the front runner simply due to wanting something interesting and to support a cool brand.
I'm spending more but less mainstream products. There is fewer and fewer stuff coming out that interests me in cycling industry (Gravel, MTB ). I'm willing to spend more on stuff that makes sense to me.
e.g. Custom hybrid drivetrains to have wider range with fever shifts. Good mechanical disc brakes on dropbar bike. DIY custom wheels. Tools to make it all happen... My own flat pedal design. Less interest in shiny stuff.
I'm already regretting not going custom/small production frame in both genres. Not for fancyness, but for manufacturing precision which is lacking everywhere.
I do love that SRAM's goal seems to be complicating the drivetrain as much as possible. And Shimano is now working the other way with the awesome CUES stuff. Which will almost certainly put a significant dent in the headway MicroShift made into being OEM on budget bikes. Though their short cage 8 speed still looks awesome for kids bikes or mega budget bikes tbh
I do love that SRAM's goal seems to be complicating the drivetrain as much as possible. And Shimano is now working the other way with the...
I do love that SRAM's goal seems to be complicating the drivetrain as much as possible. And Shimano is now working the other way with the awesome CUES stuff. Which will almost certainly put a significant dent in the headway MicroShift made into being OEM on budget bikes. Though their short cage 8 speed still looks awesome for kids bikes or mega budget bikes tbh
My son's bike has a microshift and it's pretty impressive for the price point
Yep I bought a budget hardtail with the AdventX and it just feels like SRAM NX with a better shifter. Basically a nice offering between SX/NX and Deore/CUES.
In my case, my spending dropped to near zero over the last year. 3 main reasons;
1/ sold my bike shop, so no more near endless stream of free or cheap parts.
2/ New job, plus building a new house is sucking up a ridiculous amount of my time.
3/ had too many illnesses and injuries to keep fitness and riding ability. (Getting old sucks, I'm not sure I recommend it) so on average I've had 1 bike ride a month, this has greatly reduced the amount of gear I chew thru.
Same for me, I've spent a lot a couple years ago and it's dropped to near zero now, for several reasons :
-My '19 Honzo ESD is as good now as it was 5 years ago -2 years ago I bought a relatively cheap fat and it's my favourite bike for small rides around home where there's mud and rocky paths but no need for 140mm of travel -3 years ago I bought an Ebike in the worst of the price hike and I've kinda lost interest since.
I expected to ride the ebike a lot, which I did the 1st year, partly because of the novelty I guess, but covid has changed my riding group a lot, many have changed their riding habits (more local, with family) and the messageboard where group rides were organised has pretty much died. I had to move for work during that time so covid has pretty much killed my social circle. I had bought the eeb thinking that it would allow me to make longer and more "exploratory" rides, focusing more on landscape and mood, riding with a meal in the bag etc, but those that still ride regularly have turned more toward enduro, so it's mostly "going as fast as possible up and down very steep trails" which I don't enjoy. Also while the novelty effect has gone, the 25kg have remained, and it's a PITA just mounting on the bike rack on the car. So the 8000€ ebike is now mostly used as an occasional grocery store vehicle.
So my riding habits have changed as well, I ride a lot less, and spend mostly on consumables. Also when you can afford quality products (clothes, lights, etc), which I can only since the last couple of years, you keep them longer.
I'll add something that kind of relates and is basically a longer way to say "I'm getting old". I was reading on my little screen a little while ago about how when your young you are more likely to find new music and as you get older you are less likely to be looking for new music and instead become comfortable with what you know. I feel a bit the same about bikes, I'm not as interested in shiny new things like I was 10-15 years ago. Now I know what I like and it may not be the latest and greatest but I am comfortable with it and when it breaks or is worn out I will probably buy the same or similar. So yeah I'm just getting older.
this is now a "we've gotten old" thread
Challenge mode level, Vital thread not turn into a middle aged man with kids 'doesnt ride as much as he used to' thread: I M P O S S I B L E
i've tried at least 4 times to post an honest on-topic comment, and each time that's exactly what it turned into.
I do like the narrative of 'nobodys upgrading because theres just no need to upgrade' at the moment. There was essentially a full paradigm shift around 2015, from wheel size to droppers to axle standards to increased use or better use of carbon, obviously better geo, etc.
And it seemingly peaked right before 2020 and has gotten well into diminishing returns status since. Luckily smaller parts have had slightly more compelling upgrade narratives. Wireless if you're into that, budget 1x drivetrains (and bikes) worth buying, various Ochain or Sidekick type products, some cool store on bike tool stuff that to me seems more compelling than 'added a box in a frame now try to shove stuff in it' tactic. Tires are kinda insane right now imo. I suppose they were quite good before but I feel like a base Conti trail tire performers much better than the base EXO maxxis probly
It seems the only 'paradigm shift' for the industry since 2020 is ebikes and making them not suck (kinda like when they had to make all around 29ers not suck). And they're getting pretty damn good at it for sure. Still not an eeber but the direction is obviously good. Regardless of power and longevity, they really just need to feel smooth to pedal and not break down constantly.
Me personally I'm just waiting for 275 to fully die so that brands can start marketing one off models of fun dual 27 bikes as a 'niche, fun' option. It needs to go full circle from irrelevant to trendy and niche hipster marketing.
totally agree. bikes are just damn good these days. gone are the days where companies could get away with putting out stuff that was garbage on day 1, thankfully. the last product I can think of offhand that was totally DOA was the Crank Bros Kronolog dropper.
I find myself spending a little more on bikes now and have a few more in the garage to ride but I am also selling them faster. I try to get rid of stuff in about 14/16 months to help get a good price on resale. Shop around with resale in mind and you end up not loosing that much while turning the inventory over.
I feel like the slowing of development and product releases has helped maintain resale of current bikes a little bit. If you have something older then a year and a half though you may as well give it to a kid in the neighborhood so you can at least feel good about your self after it leaves.
Way less. I see no reason to upgrade anymore. Bikes are good. I stock piled tires and chains over Covid. All the soft goods I'll ever need.
Much less as i took early retirement 2 years ago, so have less money to waste. Plus my 4+ year old kenevo is so good i see no reason to replace it.
I just buy consumables now, tyres, chains, cassettes and brake pads. Plus a second battery, a pre-emptive motor rebuild, fork and shock service. Yeah its still quite a pricey hobby but im not buying a new bike each year now just for the sake of it.
As a follow up and with additional thought I know some of my dollars will be going toward rebuilding some old bikes that I enjoyed during the development of my skills and the modern MTB.
Such as , and I know these may seem like a waste of good energy and $ to some, but I had great experiences on these bikes and for the time and place they were and in many situations still are really good trail bikes.
2005 Trek 8500 super light weight, a 21 speed 26er but geometry fit me like a glove and I learned a lot on this bike. I will rebuild this bike, if possible, a 12 speed.
2013 Surly Instigator 2.0. Same rules apply, great geometry, Surly cool, and climbs and descends like the devil himself. I'll be rebuilding this bike.
That's where my $ will go from here on, it'll have to be an offer I can't refuse if I get a new one again.
My spending habits have changed slightly, im spending less, but im still buying the things i require, and the parts im “trying” are things like tires and rotors, I wouldn’t mind an o-chain though.
Im not entirely sure why im spending less, but I have a hunch that its because instead of having a 1 bike quiver and always trying to optimise, I now have an enduro bike and a downhill bike which has stopped me continuously looking for marginal descending improvements on the enduro bike and just let me appreciate it for what it is.
Another part of the puzzle is that since buying my megatower v2 which I’ve owned for approx 18 months I havent found any other carbon bikes interesting enough to make me want to buy them, this bike ticks every box exceptionally well, the geo is as close to my idea of perfect as you can get, throw in the after sales support and lifetime warranty and it has me feeling very content. If i were to buy another enduro or trail bike my eyes are firmly set on something like a RAAW or Frameworks regardless of their high cost; with frame works being the front runner simply due to wanting something interesting and to support a cool brand.
I'm spending more but less mainstream products. There is fewer and fewer stuff coming out that interests me in cycling industry (Gravel, MTB ).
I'm willing to spend more on stuff that makes sense to me.
e.g. Custom hybrid drivetrains to have wider range with fever shifts. Good mechanical disc brakes on dropbar bike. DIY custom wheels. Tools to make it all happen... My own flat pedal design. Less interest in shiny stuff.
I'm already regretting not going custom/small production frame in both genres. Not for fancyness, but for manufacturing precision which is lacking everywhere.
I do love that SRAM's goal seems to be complicating the drivetrain as much as possible. And Shimano is now working the other way with the awesome CUES stuff. Which will almost certainly put a significant dent in the headway MicroShift made into being OEM on budget bikes. Though their short cage 8 speed still looks awesome for kids bikes or mega budget bikes tbh
My son's bike has a microshift and it's pretty impressive for the price point
Yep I bought a budget hardtail with the AdventX and it just feels like SRAM NX with a better shifter. Basically a nice offering between SX/NX and Deore/CUES.
In my case, my spending dropped to near zero over the last year.
3 main reasons;
1/ sold my bike shop, so no more near endless stream of free or cheap parts.
2/ New job, plus building a new house is sucking up a ridiculous amount of my time.
3/ had too many illnesses and injuries to keep fitness and riding ability. (Getting old sucks, I'm not sure I recommend it) so on average I've had 1 bike ride a month, this has greatly reduced the amount of gear I chew thru.
Same for me, I've spent a lot a couple years ago and it's dropped to near zero now, for several reasons :
-My '19 Honzo ESD is as good now as it was 5 years ago
-2 years ago I bought a relatively cheap fat and it's my favourite bike for small rides around home where there's mud and rocky paths but no need for 140mm of travel
-3 years ago I bought an Ebike in the worst of the price hike and I've kinda lost interest since.
I expected to ride the ebike a lot, which I did the 1st year, partly because of the novelty I guess, but covid has changed my riding group a lot, many have changed their riding habits (more local, with family) and the messageboard where group rides were organised has pretty much died.
I had to move for work during that time so covid has pretty much killed my social circle.
I had bought the eeb thinking that it would allow me to make longer and more "exploratory" rides, focusing more on landscape and mood, riding with a meal in the bag etc, but those that still ride regularly have turned more toward enduro, so it's mostly "going as fast as possible up and down very steep trails" which I don't enjoy.
Also while the novelty effect has gone, the 25kg have remained, and it's a PITA just mounting on the bike rack on the car.
So the 8000€ ebike is now mostly used as an occasional grocery store vehicle.
So my riding habits have changed as well, I ride a lot less, and spend mostly on consumables. Also when you can afford quality products (clothes, lights, etc), which I can only since the last couple of years, you keep them longer.
I'll add something that kind of relates and is basically a longer way to say "I'm getting old". I was reading on my little screen a little while ago about how when your young you are more likely to find new music and as you get older you are less likely to be looking for new music and instead become comfortable with what you know. I feel a bit the same about bikes, I'm not as interested in shiny new things like I was 10-15 years ago. Now I know what I like and it may not be the latest and greatest but I am comfortable with it and when it breaks or is worn out I will probably buy the same or similar. So yeah I'm just getting older.
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