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Fresh Prince of Bel Air, MD
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Edited Date/Time
9/13/2018 1:04am
Are there any ex-racers (semi-pro/cat 1 type) that have been without a DH bike for a few years that have purchased an entry level DH bike recently? I raced pretty competitively from 2006-2012ish and most of my bikes were pretty high end (for the time). i.e GT fury, Giant Glory, WC Boxxers, cane creek double barrels, dee max etc. Is the time gap, 6+ years, from riding "high end" DH bikes enough that these new entry level DH bikes would be satisfying?
I've been riding pretty high end trail bikes the last few years,(current ride:evil following MB, Enve Wheels, Eagle etc.) so I'm worried even if I bought an entry level DH bike I'd start swapping parts out and defeat the purpose of getting an entry level bike.
I've been riding pretty high end trail bikes the last few years,(current ride:evil following MB, Enve Wheels, Eagle etc.) so I'm worried even if I bought an entry level DH bike I'd start swapping parts out and defeat the purpose of getting an entry level bike.
if you're a taller rider, it seems like modern geometry/sizing would be the eye-opener of these new bikes. check out minnaar's world champs v10 from 2012!
going back to mid-2000's brings up bikes that seem super odd by today's standards. (2006 giant DH comp)
with that said, the prices of these new DH bikes are intriguing for sure.
Performance wise I think an entry level DH bike of today would suit just fine since the geometry is one of the most important aspects and it tends to remain constant across the different specs (entry level to high spec) and is one of the things that really progressed when compared to the older bikes.
A good test to the theory is to go to the local bike park and rent one of the entry level DH bikes and see what you notice for yourself!
I recently went out east and and rented an entry level gambler and was pretty impressed. I did notice the difference in shifting and hub engagement when compared to my personal DH bike (set up with i9s and saint drivetrain).
In a word "Yes".
But this doesn't end with DH bikes, trail bikes, XC bikes, all bikes are more betterer (technical term) at a much lower price point than ever before. Part of the reason for that is technology is really getting to a place where it isn't getting that much better, so the next most logical place to apply engineering is "how to we make this rad thing better for less".
5 years ago I would notice a big difference in overall "ride experience" on a $10,000 bling machine and a $2500-3000 bike.
These days, so long as we equalize for tires, I bet money I'm going just as fast, at least in the gravity fed direction, on the "cheap" bike as I am the high end bike.
Sure, those higher end parts such as shifters, brakes with more adjustment, wheels with higher engagement, carbon fiber frames bla bla bla are nice, and have a "so choice" feel to them but they don't add up to much on the trail (my opinion)
David's comment about the new Tues Aluminum is spot on. Make Gwin build one and race one at a world cup. Just make sure he has the right springs, right tires. He'd go a little slower, but we're talking MAYBE 1%? Maybe!?
Fox's GRIP damper was so good they made GRIP2, just an IFP based damper with more adjustments, which most (myself included don't need).
RS's lower end coil shocks kick butt.
Bottom of the barrel Code brakes are some of my favorite.They just plain work.
Geometry costs nothing to integrate
Kinematics trickle down from the high end stuff.
Shifting, hub engagement, etc is kind of an afterthought IMO. I don't shift much anyway going downhill. I dump a bunch of gears, mash pedals, then I do the opposite when a hill comes at me. So long as it holds the gear and gets me there semi-fast, I'm good with it.
I'm a bike tester and would happily buy a sub $4000 bike these days. In fact, I'm okay having no sponsorships, running whatever the hell I want, and calling it a day. This coming from one of the most neurotic bike riders you will ever meet.
Good times we are living in.
To bring this full circle, and directly back to the poster's question. As a tall guy a 'bottom of the barrel' DH bike will outrun a full on bling machine from even 3 years ago. Most of the modern geo, with respect to reach, is fairly new. That stuff has been a game changer for me. Far more important than the other bits hanging off the frame...
If you are used to nice wheels/hubs that could be a disappointment when you jump on an entry level bike. That is one area where I think manufacturers save loads of money. The Formula hubs on the inexpensive Commencal Supreme or the SRAM hubs on the cheap Kona Operator are pretty bad. Crappy engagement leads to more chain slap and clunky noises when you get on the gas out of the corners.
I think the modern "entry level" suspension is pretty solid. If you don't feel like you must have HSC LSC HSR And LSR, the inexpensive options are solid. The 40 on that new AL Tues is rock solid.
Personally, I'm not a huge carbon vs aluminum guy. If the price and geometry are right, I'd be happy to ride an aluminum DH bike.
I say buy whatever your budget can handle now then upgrade as things break or wear out.
Kinematics: same goes for kinematics. We've learned quite a bit in the last 10 years.
Suspension: Low end suspension today was the high end suspension of yesterday. Take the guts of Motion Control. That was in the high end forks 10+ years ago and now it's the staple of the entry and mid level Rock Shox product line. That DHX Van RC has many trickle down parts from the RC4 of that generation, which was an expensive shock. Additionally today you have better air springs and production methods that make a bigger difference to ride feel.
Tires: Today's new DH tires with larger volume casings and larger knobs are better. Take a 2.5 Minion from back then and compare it to the new 2.5 3C MaxxGrip Tubeless Ready DH version today and you'll see there's a significant difference in tread size and volume. Paired with wide rims (even cheap ones like a SunRingle Helix TR29) and you have a much better riding wheelset. Cheap hubs haven't changed much (Zee for example) so it's still worthwhile to upspec here if you weren't happy with a hub at that level.
That $2700usd bike is far better than the $6500usd (10 years ago) bike from yesterday.
Its like comparing a .50cal to a musket.
I'm also happy to hear the sizing is a large part of the improvements, I'm 6' 1" and always felt like the sizing wasn't quite right on my DH frames.
I really hope I can temper my upgrade fever if I do end up getting another DH bike.
Spomer - What are the chances you can get a WC level bike from 2012 (like Gwin's trek) to do some back to back riding with a new entry-level bike? Feel like that would be interesting to get some back to back feedback. Over the weekend I was dialing in my new "enduro" bike at the bike park and was chatting with a dude on on older V10 (think a 2010 frame) and he throw a leg over my bike and felt that geo wise he'd be more comfortable riding my bike than the v10...
I also volunteer to be part of the test, since I possed the initial question.
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