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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/13/2014 10:27 AM
C50_water_bike

JM- thanks for the reply... To ease your concerns, EVERYONE who has ridden it thinks it's an improvement over the currently available shocks. Obviously there are a million variables (rider weight, style, speed, terrain, bike, travel etc.) however we feel like we have a good generic tune that will work well for most riders. It is not perfect. Nothing is.

You are absolutely correct in that we tuned a lot of the regression out of the curve. Initially we had a lot more regression, but it didn't feel good on the bike. We have a tune that offers a sharp nose for efficient pedaling, then a little regression to take the edge off bumps when riding in climb or trail modes. It works pretty darn good. Of course you will have to ride one to see for yourself and form your own opinion.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 8:03 PM
C50_water_bike

It decreases force (in trail and climb modes only) from around 4ips to 10ips (medium speed hit) then the curve starts to turn up again as speeds increase and orifice damping takes over (the valve is fully open and the holes are the restriction).

It is fairly speed sensitive, so on an fast hit (50ips) peak, it reacts differently than on a medium speed hit (25ips) vs on a low speed hit (10ips). The curve kind of stretches out with increasing speeds.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 7:18 PM
C50_water_bike

Yes- the biggest advantage is that the shock pedals efficiently while still moving when you need it to- hitting bumps, preloading for bunny hop etc.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 7:15 PM
C50_water_bike

They are a little similar, but Re:aktiv valve actually decreases in force as velocities increase (for a while). The damper curves that propedal makes are very different from the ones that Re:aktiv makes. The valves are also very different inside...

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 3:00 PM
C50_water_bike

Not exactly- small bump doesn't always mean small velocity. The shock velocity is more dependent on shape of the bump- even a small rock or tree root generates a medium/high shock velocity. The low speed inputs are all rider generated- pedaling, pumping, weight shifts etc. The goal of the damper curve is to resist movement due to rider inputs, while still being sensitive to terrain.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:47 PM
C50_water_bike

This one feels very 'settled'. Especially climbing rough stuff in trail mode- the bike just feels planted.

Never ridden SPV in an airshock, so I can't compare to that.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:44 PM
C50_water_bike

guess who makes J-dampers

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:34 PM
C50_water_bike

I wouldn't say the damper was built around our linkage. It was tested and tuned on our linkage...

The rebound circuit is pretty much identical to previous DRCV rear shocks. It works like normal.

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Liked a comment on the item Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:30 PM

I love when development is reached by mechanical solutions, because this is every time less common in this electronic world that we have today.

Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:29 PM
C50_water_bike

True, and the tire is also really important to suspension on a mountain bike! Didn't know they were contemplating switching to bigger wheels.

I don't know much about F1 car suspension, but I do know that regressive damping was used as one way of controlling body motions without going to stiffer springs. Beyond that, I don't know much about the extra spring setups.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:17 PM
C50_water_bike

Yeah- sorry should have made that clear. I work for Trek.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:07 PM
C50_water_bike

It's not used in motocross as far as I know. I think it would work well in moto, but just hasn't gotten there yet.

Think about it this way: F1 cars want stiff suspension for cornering, braking, accelerating and to resist against their massive downforce. They want the suspension to move when the car hits a bump or apron on track.

A mountain biker wants stiff (efficient) suspension for pedaling, braking & cornering. MTB rider wants the suspension to move when we hit something on trail.

This valve was designed for cars, but applies well to mountain bikes.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 2:02 PM
C50_water_bike

I'm not a Penske engineer- I work for Trek at our suspension office (which is not in Wisconsin). I like working in metric (even though I'm a proud American) and we use Solidworks CAD. Fox uses Imperial, so that is fun to switch.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 1:52 PM
C50_water_bike

Yes- the damper needs to build a little pressure to start flow- there is NO bleed path in compression when the shock is stationary. That said, in descend mode the spring tension on the valve is very light and flow starts immediately. When you crank the adjuster (which compresses the spring) it puts more pressure on the valve and more oil pressure is required to open the valve. This is how we get lots of low speed damping initially in climb and trail modes. The valve geometry encourages the blow-off at higher shaft speeds.

Rebound is a pretty standard shim stack & orifice bleed much like other shocks.

Bottoming control is similar to other air shock dampers. The Re:aktiv valve does ramp up at higher velocity, helping control big hits, and you can run a PUSH spacer in the DRCV can to help get a little more support from the air spring if needed (I run the smaller PUSH spacer on my bikes).

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 1:41 PM
C50_water_bike

No problem- I'm happy to answer any questions...

About the shock service- since this shock is manufactured by Fox, it is covered under Fox warranty and service. I know it went through and passed all their normal testing- durability and otherwise, so it should at least match the durability of other Fox products. I cannot comment on the Fox service in Europe.

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Added a comment about feature Formula 1 Meets Mountain Biking in Trek's New RE:aktiv Suspension 6/11/2014 12:16 PM
C50_water_bike

Can't say either way right now... It was initially developed for trail applications and works well on mid-travel bikes.

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